Ferrari vs. Porsche : reliability

Which models/years?

 

Hello:

My 08 GT3 RS had it's motor "pulled" twice in its first 2K miles for rear main seal leaks - I've never had to do that with any Ferrari.

 

P's warranty is 4 years and F's 3. That makes a difference when they have to fix things for an extra year.

 

That's one valid data point, but this discussion is too general to mean anything. I'd say Ferrari have produced a range of models with varying reputations for reliability, and the weak spots are at least somewhat predictable (348 gearbox, TR differential, 355 headers, etc.)

On the reputational side, Porsches have a bulletproof image, but there are chronic issues here as well. The early 964 series cars were relatively troublesome, for example.

Ferraris also suffer from expensive maintenance costs and lack of use, which can make a basically reliable car more neglected and trouble prone. (I'm thinking of an early 308 that had been driven a paltry 14,000 miles over 30 years and developed a stuck valve...)

As far as the "passion" part of the opening post, that's subjective, but I think most of us would say Ferraris deliver a more visceral experience and the Porsche a more clinical one.

 

In my experience, it wasn't even close: Reliability-wise and maintenance costs, the Porsche wins hands down. The most annoying "reliability problem" was the fact that the 993 windshield had insufficient rake to keep stones from constantly pitting or cracking the windshield. A problem that seemed at first like the literally impossible "vapor lock" was caused by a bad solenoid which I bought on ebay for $40 and replaced in 5 minutes. Most other problems were the result of age and mileage and were to be expected; and they cost a whole order of magnitude less than the Ferrari to put right. As for the windshield, I was constantly sealing the pits and ended up replacing 2 windshields in 3 years.

I realize that the Ferrari has twice as many cylinders as the Porsche, but that does not account for the HUGE disparity in maintenance costs and the vast gap in reliability and repair costs.

 

I don't have a Ferrari, but the maintenance costs for my 2001 996 Turbo with 500+ HP are $0.13 per mile over 60k miles......thats hard to beat.

And anyone who says driving a Porsche can't be a passionate experience hasn't driven a Turbo or GT3 at 9/10.......you can ride with me.....but bring an extra pair of underwear.

 

Some of my personal experiences:

2000 Honda S2000 purchased new and sold after 33k miles:

Clutch replaced under TSB
Tail light replaced for color fading
Fuel gauge failed 3 times and after the third, dealer told me it was "normal" for it not to read accurately.
Power window switches failed 3 times, never fixed properly.
Rear axle nuts loosened on their own and had to be periodically retightened.
Top mechanism rubbed on liner and wore holes in it.
Spark plugs loosened on their own.
Oil 'banjo bolts' had to be replaced for poor lubrication. Recalled in Europe and Asia but not the USA.
Top striker plates prematurely wore out (one year).
Rear view mirror frequently fell off.

2002 996 TT, owned 3 years and 20k miles

Keyless entry failed.
Clutch slave cylinder failed
MAF sensor failed
Navigation and radio failed
Rattles and shakes everywhere
Hydraulics for rear wing failed


2000 Ferrari 360 Modena, owned 16 mos and 5k miles.

Fluid change and belt service once.
Cigarette lighter fuse blew.
Oil temp gauge occasionally (twice in 16 mos.) went haywire and then returned to normal.

2004 Challenge Stradale, 16 mos., 7k miles and counting.

Fluid service
Passenger side window hardware loosened, came off and had to be put back.

 

It all depends on how much you drive the cars. I think we hear all these horror stories of Ferraris being unreliable because people don't drive them enough. I think the more you drive the car the more reliable it gets (to an extent.)

 

With far fewer Ferraris on the planet, parts and service are bound to be more expensive. As for the intrinsic reliability of the design, Porsche has benefitted from over 40 years of incremental improvements on 911's, but when the water cooled 996's came around, there were some new bugs to work out.

I do subscribe to the notion of driving the cars more to keep seals from drying out, etc. At least, that's what I'm doing with my 993 (23K miles in two years), and it seems to be working.

To get an informal sense of how models stack up, take a look at the number and nature of threads here and on Rennlist: some models on either board seem to be dominated by maintenance, repair, and failure threads, while others are all about mods, drives, and general adoration. There is a marked contrast between 964 and 996 threads on Rennlist vs 993 ones, for example.

As far as cachet, however, Ferraris win handily over my beloved Porsches. I frequent a monthly car get together in my area, and the hotties consistently cluster around the Ferraris and Lambos.

 

Quite honestly my early 930 turbo with 475hp has had much go wrong with it vs my 512BB, 355 and previous 328, however I wouldn't hesistate to take the 930 on a long road trip in in the middle of nowhere, if it breaks I can fix it or find a part the Ferraris would have a long tow bill back, the Porsche weighs around 2500lbs with that much hp is a blast and will beat most any car though as well

 

This is funny, and good.

There are three rules that apply for Ferrari ownership: Find a well sorted one, budget for it, and then drive it. A lot. This is the best solution to future maintenance problems. Think about it this way: The more you drive it, the less expensive it is (as far as stuff going wrong), theoretically. It's a win/win situation for you.

 

Hello,


I can only speak as a twice Porsche owner, that both of my cars were rock solid when it came to quality.

Porsche 944S - one issue. faulty alarm system.

Porsche 968 Cabrio - one issue. passenger window stuck.


That's it. My 968 still has a solid "thunk" every time i close the door. Nothing has fallen off. No puddles on the garage floor. Never left me stranded. That being said- at the time of purchase, I was debating between it and a Ferrari Mondial Coupe.

- wish i would have chosen the Ferrari...


Joe

 

I've had 4 996 cabs, 2 996tt's, 3 996tt cabs, 2 997 tt's, 1 997 tt cab, a cgt and 2 360 spiders. One 996tt had a wing ran issue, the cgt had a short in the glove box that drained the battery and one 360 had ball joints go bad and a slow down message.


If you buy a sorted late model of either marque, you prolly won't have to worry about being stranded.

 

For me part of the issue is that I can afford a brand-new Porsche and in the future am sure I could afford a nicer brand-new Porsche if I so choose, though I'm actually really pretty happy with my little Boxster. I can drive it everywhere I go and if I have a problem for the first four years, roadside assistance comes anywhere I am to pick me up and fixes the car. I can get an extended warranty too. It's a big jump in price though to a brand-new Ferrari.

 

this post reflects my opinion too...i however do own both ferrari and porsches. and likewise, bring the second pair of undies for my hot rod 930 too.

 

I'm too new to Ferrari to make the comparison yet - but I've owned and own many 911's and 914's for years and they are tremendously reliable. My 1995 993 has 58k miles on it - 15k+ are track miles and she is still rock solid. No issues. I've done nothing but regular service. All my kids started track days using her and she's still a head turner in wonderful condition. I'd jump in and drive to California and back in my 1974 991/S today!

 

Google Porsche IMS and RMS and you'll see the picture. The new Porsche isn't even a shadow of its former self.

I sat in a Cayenne and felt insulted at the lack of quality that surrounded me...even now, Ford makes an interior that is leagues above what the cookie cutters at Porsche can pinch out.

Time to fire the MBA's en masse and promote car guys.

In a time when CEO's rake in millions and Boards of Bystanders are willing accomplices....no shock that the cars they produce can hold no candle to what came before them...milk it, destroy it, then golden parachute out.

 

I think alot of Ferrari's percieved "reliability issues" stem from the
lack of use,rather than the car itself.When I had my '84 308 ,I put about
40,000+ miles on her with nothing but routine maintenance.Also
who you have service the car. I know a guy who has the money,
but insists onbuying sub par F-cars, and less thancapable mechanics,
then complains about how unreliable and expensive they are to keep up.

 

Porsche has had its share of problems over the years. From cam tensioners in the '60s/'70s, to RMS today. Overall, though, I believe that Porsche has a better build quality than Ferrari.

Ferrari has two main problems: (1) It can't (or won't) do any pretesting, it just builds em and sells em. Even worse, when things start breaking (i.e., manifolds, windows, and so on), they refuse to address the problem until you sue them. (2) Ferrari must use the cheapest bitzas in the world. There is no reason in the world for hoses that break anymore. Pep Boys carries better stuff than the OEM stuff that Ferrari puts on its cars. Don't ask how I know this to be true.

That said, there is NO doubt that Porsches are cheaper to keep running. Not only are OEM parts reasonable, but there are tons and tons of after-market parts. Ferrari parts prices are obscene. Try $5k+ for an A/C evaporator for a 550, for example.

Labor rates for the few really good independent Ferrari shops are no higher than Porsche. Even better, the good ones don't work on book rates like the dealerships do. They do what they have to do to fix the car. However, there are a lot more independent Porsche shops than Ferraris.

Frankly, I have learned my lesson. I will never buy another used Ferrari until I find out whether my go-to guy works on that model. I'm never putting myself at the mercy of a dealership again.

Dale

 

STOP smoking!

 

OK, here we go! I've owned 2 996's, 1 997, 1 Cayenne Turbo....I currently own my first and only Ferrari 06' F430 Coupe and a 08' 997 Turbo Cab.
I didn't have ANY issues with any of the Porsche's..........The Ferrari?




HOLY **** BATMAN!!!!!!!



I could have used the California Lemon Law 10 times over to get Ferrari to 1) replace my car or 2) buy it back...........

I had a new engine put in at 6K miles because of a blown header, exhaust brackets failed 4 times (needed to be replaced each time, a common issue), Blown hose in engine bay which caused it to fill with steam that torched a few sensors (went back to shop 3 times to get everything right), F1 system totally replaced (after 5 days of ownership), plus a host of other annoying and infuriating issues.............All this was in the first 18 months of ownership on a Brand spanking new right off the showroom floor with 56 miles on the odometer car..........


Before you think for a minute that I don't drive it enough.........21,000 miles in 20 months


I will admit that I have had my frustrations with my first Ferrari ownership experience, BUT............I LOVE MY 430!!!!
I never even considered replacing my car for a minute. Ferrari of North America has been on top of every issue with
my car. I contacted them early on and let them know that I was VERY unhappy with my experience with my first F car.
I also told them that I have dreamed of my first F car since I was 8 yrs old and that the 430 is better than I could
have ever imagined a car could be. I told them that I just want my car to stay in my hands and not sitting at the shop
and I asked them to please help me....All I can say is that they love the Marque as much as we all do.
FNA and the boys in Italy all know my car well and have made damn sure that Im happy. My nickname at one shop
was the Guinea Pig and as much as I didn't think I was part of the Ferrari R&D Dept, I ended up being on that team.
Everything has been repaired under the Warranty and the car contiually drives and performs better. The new
engine pulls hard as hell and 2 different Authorized Ferrari Shops both were blown away by how fast
my car is.


The moral to the story is that my 997 TT has not had any issues so far at 5K miles except that the engine has developed an idle that sounds like it may need attention soon. It is a monster of a car, the 6 speed is killer, and for a convertible it boggles the mind how solid it is but..............



The 430 BLOW IT OUT OF THE WATER! No comparison at all! So, even with all my issues with the 430 I can assure you that it will stay in my garage far longer than the Porsche.

 

generally speaking porsche is far more reliable than ferrari. porsche is a tough workhorse, ferrari is the elegant, but high maintenance, thoroughbred

 

My hat is off to you for your positive attitude...I think I would have crumbled.

 

I could go nuts shifting any porsche Ihave owned. You canm dump the clutch, drag race, and track it. These things just don't break. They are built to withstand abuse...

The testarossa has never broken down either... but from participating on this board I have learned to:

1) Warm it up for 15 minutes or so...
2) Never ever abuse the driveline...
3) Drive gingerly...
4) Protect the clutch by slowly leaving stop lights...

IE. Treat it like my grannie might treat her car. Of course I still enjoy occasional track days and spirited shifts... on occasion...

Seems to me that ferrari's are more "delicate" than porsches... hinders the enjoyment somewhat...