Ferrari SCARED to face Audi in Le Mans Prototype racing.

I think Ferrari has the skill to destroy Audi if they wanted to. The problem is that prototype racing has been so difficult to sustain, as it ebbs and flows from year to year. If it were secure as it was back in the 60's then perhaps they could go back, but the other downer in LeMans racing is lack of Money and world wide TV.

Until ACO and FIA do an F-1 type TV deal for more sponsors ( diffcult since Bernie will nix that ASAP ) there will never be the money to go racing again at LeMans with a factory effort. As we all know its all about the $$$ and that is where Ferrari is now.

Personally I think LeMans / ALMS is the BEST racing out there. cars are just as technical as F-1, even more so, its super fan freindly and you have an entire day of racing, with all the different classes.

at an F-1 race, you get maybe 5 hours of on track over 3 days. Maybe. F-1 is where the $$ are, and LeMans / ALMS is where the diehards are. sad but true.

As for just going in there to beat Audi? why? Ferrari is not even close to being challenged by Audi in the market place, so they dont need the publicity. its kinda a win win for them.

F-1 does well, great, LMS, ALMS teams do well, even more publicity! for free!

 

Oofa.
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LOL, yeah, about 46 years late...

For the sake of argument, let's swap the OP's first post: Swap 'Le Mans' with 'F1', and swap 'Audi' with 'Ferrari':
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I am more than convinced that the reason Audi is frightened to entire F1 and race against Ferrari is because they know they would lose. How? RELIABILITY! Audi knows they would be logging more hours in the garage than on the track with the Ferrari's.

Ferrari has thrown the gauntlet down and have made their mark in F1 over the past 10 years.

Audi would not last hour 1 if they were to ever dare challenge Ferrari in F1.

Audi do Ferrari a favor and leave the real racing to the big boys.


***** ONE VERY PISSED OFF FAN *****

 

The next issue is, how many endurance races do we see on TV, albeit in the USA?

How much $$$$$$$$ does Audi spend on endurance racing?

I bet when you compare the $$$$ Audi spends versus their competitors it is no different than what Ferrari spends on F1 versus THEIR competitors.

How many kids grow up watching an Audi on TV, versus a red Ferrari?

In turn, how many kids say 'I want an AUDI when I grow up!'

You're comparing apples and oranges here, each manufacturer picks a series they want to aim for, which is why you see Subaru/Mitsubishi in rallying but nowhere else, Audi in endurance bot nowhere else, Ferrari MAINLY in F1, etc.

 

Luca ain't going to live forever...

 

Couple small points.
Whiskey- Subaru dropped their team in Rally and isn't it funny that as soon as that commercial showed during the Lemans coverage they switched back to live and McNish made that massive mistake and smacked the Ferrari and punted himself into the wall. Lucky he wasn't killed. I actually love McNish, but super bad judgement on this crash.

 

Why on earth would I want to go watch cars go around a track (when I can only see 2 straights and 1 corner) for an entire day? I can't watch Nascar drive 500 miles without being bored to tears, and I can see the whole bloody track.

I like F1 because it's not every weekend, qualifying is interesting, and I can watch the race without having to set aside an entire day.

 

Not meaning to be rude, but stating the obvious (in my eyes) but Ferrari could care less what a few fans think about Le Mans....they only care about F1, and that will not change in the near future. Even turbo 4 Cyls won't push them out of F1, Enzo's life was racing and to him racing was F1. It is Ferrari's destiny as they see it to win the WCC, they will focus on that.

 

If you really want an italian challenger at le mans your best bet would be alfa romeo...at least they sell diesels...

 

As a huge fan of endurance racing, I have to say this: F1 is the pinnacle of motorsport, without a doubt. The speeds at which these cars run, as well as the acceleration and braking, is unmatched by any other series. It is the ultimate expression of what a car can do.

And Audi likes to belittle F1 claiming it has no relevance to road cars, but that is quite wrong. Dual clutch gearboxes, traction control, launch control, brake steer, and KERS are a few of the F1 innovations that have made it to road cars.

And finally, you definitely need a diesel to be competitive at Le Mans. Now, whether this is due to intense lobbying efforts by Audi and Peugeot (who have a huge line up of diesel vehicles) who wanted to make diesels sporty -- or not -- that is up to personal opinion.

 

McNish "Clear precise decision making" ROFLMAO!!!

Here is another scenario for the OP, why does Audi not challenge Ferrari in F1?

 

Occasionally, I race against an ex-Factory R8. It's an older generation LMP car, but it's still hella-fast. In fact, I spend most of my time in the GT class car watching my mirrors or his taillights. I've spent a little time going over the car in detail in the paddock. AMAZINGLY thought out car, and in the words of the crew chief, "Audi spent space shuttle money" on it. I'm sure the R18s have advanced considerably from there, even.

That said, there's no reason why SpA/Michelotto can't get their hands on one (or something similar), deconstruct it, and learn from it. And, undoubtedly, the Scuderia's experience in F1 would be useful in certain aspects. BUT, F1 cars just aren't designed to go anywhere nearly as long. IIRC, the ENTIRE F1 season doesn't put as much mileage (or time, maybe) on a car as does one 24H race. So, while F1 cars *may* be faster (and, actually, I think the LMP cars are still faster in a straight line), the F1 guys don't concern or preoccupy themselves with durability anywhere close to what the endurance guys do. And, I just don't think Michelotto has the resources to go up against Audi and Peugeot.

But, I'd love to see SpA return with an LMP car and fight for the overall win. I just don't see it happening for a number of reasons. At least, not anytime soon.

I wouldn't say SpA is scared, but they do have limited resources (like everyone), and they're not exactly setting the world on fire right now in their premier, chosen venue, are they?

CW

 

We should start a fund and convince Mr.Jim to enter ALMS next year. I'll take a year off to be part of the team and will work strictly for food, I could be that guy "hey cowboy get me another water" and every team need's a babe magnet!!!!

 

+1. They could compete. They simply have to decide to make it a priority. I dont care if its diesel. Its all oil based fuel. Ridiculous to think otherwise. Its just fuel. Audi's cars are amazing!!!

 

Actually Alfa Romeo had a plan to take the 8C to LeMans under the control of Pininfarina. This was to coincide with Alfa's return to the USA market. Sadly, the world wide economical issues changed that plan, LeMans and coming back to the USA. Andrea's passing probably also affected the program.

 

I recall Piero Lardi being very fond of Sports Car racing, wasn't he one of the proponents of the 333SP?

I also recall reading that Enzo Ferrari coveted winning the Indy 500, FWIW.

 

I would love to see Ferrari back in factory supported competition in the highest class at Le Mans, but they haven't been in there for a long time and it doesn't look like that will change in the foreseeable future. Unfortunate as that may be, Ferrari has to make choices in how and were to spend their money. If they don't see enough return on investment in taking part at Le Mans, than it is their perogative to not enter. Easy as that. Could Ferrari win if they did? Perhaps, but not without a further change in rules to level the playingfield between diesel and petrol cars.

Untill that time, Ferrari is happy to see it's cars do well in the GT class. The 458 came a little bit too early for Sebring, won the 1000 KM of Spa with Farnbacher Loles and came second at Le Mans with AF Corse. Not bad eh? Of course, those are Michelotto built cars and by no means factory entries, but the general public sees a Ferrari. And that is exactly what it is.

 

How come Carroll hasn't chimed here? She is the ultimate ALMS fan.

The most fun I have had at any motor sports event in over 40 years is LeMans. The old Camel GT was a temporary fix, cars looked the same as LeMans. The most exciting racing I have ever watched in person, is the Daytona 500, multiple occasions. The best first 10 laps of any race anywhere, the Indianapolis 500, over 25 occasions. For shear mechanical poetry, it will always be F1.

The problem with LeMans/ALMS is limited events with limited television. With F1 at 20 events all over the world, Ferrari's $400+ million budget gets the best value for the dollars spent for nearly 10 months of the year. Whereas even with an Audi budget of $100 million just for LeMans, the value and the exposure isn't the same.

Ferrari sells all the cars it makes, F1 participation is for image and heritage, not to sell more cars. Audi would love to sell more and more cars, so LeMans gives them the exposure they need to hopefully sell more diesel powered cars. Win on Sunday, sell on Monday. Nothing to do with fear, it is all business. For Peugeot, LeMans gives their non-glamorous street cars, a little glamour. Ferrari needs neither to sell more cars or more glamour. Besides, Audi's BOD would never approve the type budget that Ferrari/McLaren/Red Bull have for any racing series. The stockholders would revolt, so you will not see Audi in F1 other than just an engine supplier.

 

Not according to Classiche! Just saying...

CW

 

I read somewhere that Enzo heard about an Italian driver in the USA named DePalma that won the Indy 500, and at that moment, Enzo decided he wanted to race cars. I think the 637 was the only official Ferrari for Indianapolis, never ran, thought have been used to scare the FIA.

Ferrari at Indy, what coulda shoulda:
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For all intents and purposes, the point of factory involvement in LMS/ALMS and endurance racing in general is to develop & prove new technologies which will directly transfer to the showroom floor. TDI is the clearest example of this.

Of course, only a diesel can win the overall. So unless Ferrari are planning on building a diesel road car in the near future, I wouldn't hold your breath waiting for a prototype with the cavallino on the nose.

 

PF had nothing to do with the 8C my friend Willy Eggar designed it for Alfa in house.

The aborted GT3 program was a privateer and had nothing to do with PF.

Farnbacher no longer has any involvement with Loles.

 

Actually; some crucial parts (engine/gearbox) now have to last around 15 hours, a huge mark up from 7-8 years ago when they pretty much put in a new engine after 3 hours of running...

as for that an LM prototype car does more mileage in 1 race than an F1 car in a whole season, unless you're comparing it to an HRT, not true either. A race is 300 km's, there are 20 of them, so already 6000 KM's. A quick google reveals that the furthest ever driven in a the 24h of le mans is 5400km's.

We can't compare the two, utterly different cars.

I occasionally tune in for the Le mans, watch small parts of it but I can't watch the whole thing. Same goes for the Indy 500. I don't care that along with the Monaco GP and the 24h of Le Mans that its the most prestigious races, I don't watch it really...1 of the reasons is that it's on ESPN and that means for every 5 laps you get 7 laps of adverts. Even if Ferrari fielded a competitive car in both series...couldn't be bothered.

The only people that will watch all those races just because Ferrari has entered are the same people that dress up in Ferrari everything to show their dedication.

 

Dual clutch gearboxes did not come F1, they are banned.

 

Certainly most teams aren't using the same chassis for the whole F1 season.