Ferrari 308 GTB CARMA FF Turbo Race car | FerrariChat
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Ferrari 308 GTB CARMA FF Turbo Race car

Discussion in '308/328' started by velocityengineer, Aug 9, 2007.

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  1. velocityengineer

    velocityengineer Formula Junior

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    Eric Dahl
    #1 velocityengineer, Aug 9, 2007
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    Alfa Romeo works driver Carlo Facetti was behind several interesting 308-based competition cars. Chassis 20457 was built on a glassfibre GTB for Felice Besenzoni and competed at several of international endurance events between 1977 and '80, including at Vallelunga, the Mugello 6 Hours, Monza 1,000km and the Daytona 24 Hours. It had lightweight body panels, a stripped interior, Group 4 wheel arches and slick tyres on wide competition wheels. Facetti always carried out its preparation work to a very high standard, and accordingly developed the dry-sump V8 in-house to produce over 300bhp thanks to high lift camshafts, larger carburettors and a special exhaust system.

    This Facetti 308, the Carma FF, was a much more developed machine built to Group 5 specification for the 1979 World Manufacturers Championship. It featured new chassis spaceframes front and rear that fixed to the original 308's tubular steel centre section while the 3.0 litre V8 engine was fitted with twin KKK turbochargers. Weight was reduced to 950kg, with output rising to 700bhp for races and 840bhp for qualifying. The bodywork was also restyled, only the cabin and doors remaining similar to Ferrari's production 308. A demonstration of just how fast this car was took place at the 1981 Daytona 24 Hours where it set the fastest lap of the race on lap two!

    A fascinating and superbly engineered piece of Ferrari racing history from the heady days when privateer development was often more advanced than that of the factories themselves. Well known, this is a highly regarded machine.
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  2. 4re308

    4re308 F1 Rookie
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    #2 4re308, Aug 9, 2007
    Oh yeah, that is a really cool 308. I like the shots of it shooting huge flames!
     
  3. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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    #3 Jdubbya, Aug 9, 2007
    700 bhp? I want one!! And most people think the 308 has no racing heritage. Thanks for sharing!!
     
  4. SMS

    SMS F1 Veteran

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    #4 SMS, Aug 9, 2007
    This car goes for sale via auction in 2 days.

    Thanks for all the pics, great car!
     
  5. tomgt

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    #5 tomgt, Aug 12, 2007
    Did it sell yesterday at Coys Nürburgring? Hammerprice?
     
  6. Harry-SZ

    Harry-SZ F1 Rookie

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    #6 Harry-SZ, Aug 13, 2007
    I think it was sold, because it was picked up by a transporter on sunday afternoon. (around 2 o'clock)
    : http://www.gummen.org/images/album/OGP2007210.jpg

    It was directly followed by a great looking Lamborghini Miura (orange), also on a flatbed.
     
  7. tomgt

    tomgt F1 Veteran
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    #7 tomgt, Aug 13, 2007
  8. tomgt

    tomgt F1 Veteran
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    #8 tomgt, Oct 15, 2007
  9. putje

    putje Karting

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    #9 putje, Oct 15, 2007
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  10. Champboat/Champcar

    Champboat/Champcar Formula Junior

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    #10 Champboat/Champcar, Oct 15, 2007
    Yeah it looks to me like a 935 Porsche Body Kit grafted to the 308, probably because this body created the most downforce and was allready tested for extreme high speeds.Basically its the Kremer Kit, I built one of these on a 912 chassis with a Mazda Rotary motor, with the Porsche Gear box it would pull 9,000 Rpm in 5 th . I really like the way it looks on the 308, maybe someday if i find a real beat up 308, I can build one of these, the kit is available from GT racing,they can even make it in carbon fibre.The looks of a 935 and the sound of a Ferrari,If I only had money....
     
  11. tvision321

    tvision321 Karting
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    #11 tvision321, Nov 9, 2011
    Does any body have a picture of the engine bay and turbo plumbing?

    Thanks
     
  12. tvision321

    tvision321 Karting
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    #12 tvision321, Nov 9, 2011
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  13. Ferraripilot

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    #13 Ferraripilot, Nov 10, 2011
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  14. tvision321

    tvision321 Karting
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    #14 tvision321, Nov 10, 2011
    Awesome pic of the rear turbine. Do you have a pic of the front turbine? Intake placement and or intercooler(s)? cheers!
     
  15. tvision321

    tvision321 Karting
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    #15 tvision321, Nov 10, 2011
    got to love EFI! just look at the space those two mechanical fuel injection pumps take up.
     
  16. Papa G

    Papa G Formula 3

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    #16 Papa G, Nov 10, 2011
    Fantastic! - and only 40 digits away from mine.
     
  17. tvision321

    tvision321 Karting
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    #17 tvision321, Nov 10, 2011
    John, I was looking more at the rear turbine plumbing; you can see the large Aluminum tubing passing from the turbine to the front collection manifold on the right above the timing belts. The radiator to the left looks to have an oil line attached. The one on the right is slender radiator or sorts, oil or water?

    I thought the Carma 308 was a biturbo, so assuming there is a turbine on the front bank of 4 cylinders. ? was there an air to air intercooler, a water to air intercooler or ....no intercooler?
     
  18. Ferraripilot

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    #18 Ferraripilot, Nov 10, 2011
    Good questions there. If it is biturbo, I bet the other turbo is located somewhere around where the fuel tank would be in that area. An intercooler certainly does not look like a possibility considering how they have everything piped. The F40 and 288 got away with intercoolers by mounting them above and parallel to the motor. I can't see how this car made intercoolers work unless they were piped to the front of the car. That wouldn't make much sense though.
     
  19. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    #19 Ferraripilot, Nov 10, 2011
    Is it jsut me, or are those mechanical injection pumps from a BMW 2002?
     
  20. tvision321

    tvision321 Karting
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    #20 tvision321, Nov 11, 2011
    Its possible, I am not that familiar with mechanical injections systems, Kuggelfischer or Lucus. It sure is a tremendous amount of spaghetti! If I remember correctly, it caught fire at the Daytona 24hr race or possibly in qualifying.
     
  21. 328turbo

    328turbo Formula Junior

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    #21 328turbo, Nov 11, 2011
    You can tell that the other turbo is mounted opposite on the front bank by the doubled exhaust pipes coming from both the turbo and the waste gate.
    This is before intercooling caught on. Most cars from the 70's didn't have that technology. Older 208 Turbos weren't intercooled until 86.

    Nobody cooks up pasta quite like the Italians! :D :D :D
     
  22. 328turbo

    328turbo Formula Junior

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    #22 328turbo, Nov 11, 2011
    This car kinda looks like a forerunner to the F40
     
  23. GrayTA

    GrayTA F1 World Champ
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    #23 GrayTA, Nov 11, 2011
    Thats pretty cool....thanks for the bump.




    PDG
     
  24. tvision321

    tvision321 Karting
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    #24 tvision321, Nov 12, 2011
    Yes, good eye; the front plumbing from the front turbine is coming under the car to the waste gate, probably likewise for the front turbine exhaust; hence both wategate and turbine exhaust tubes on a tilt;

    Does any one have pics of the front bank or side shots close up of the belt service area or fuel pump service area so as to see the front turbine?
     
  25. tvision321

    tvision321 Karting
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    #25 tvision321, Nov 12, 2011
    I would assume the original pic I posted shows the differntial cooler at the edge of the picture.
     
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