F8 or STO? | Page 92 | FerrariChat

F8 or STO?

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by dustman, Nov 17, 2020.

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  1. wthensler

    wthensler F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 27, 2015
    3,150
    Gator Country, FL
    Full Name:
    William
    What’s ironic is the reveal colors (orange and blue) are the UF Gator colors. Shoulda realized it at the time but everything in Gainesville is blue and orange - everywhere. I realize now this car will most likely garner far more attention than I might otherwise bargain for.

    There are a fair number of retired pro athletes and coaches here. I can already see folks eyeing me up, trying to figure out who this guy is (not that it matters, lol)

    I may get a personalized plate NOT UF just to fend off the masses.
     
    AD211 and Shack like this.
  2. dustman

    dustman F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Jun 12, 2007
    8,930
    Countach was “shown” and made available for select clients 3 months ago, with more details provided last month.
     
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  3. Shack

    Shack F1 Rookie
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    May 2, 2005
    2,503
    Earth
    Pics Bro :)
     
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  4. Thecadster

    Thecadster F1 Veteran
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    Apr 27, 2017
    6,705
    I could be wrong, but I think it goes into Unica as soon as the factory accepts the order.
     
  5. Thecadster

    Thecadster F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 27, 2017
    6,705
  6. SLDriver

    SLDriver Formula Junior

    May 1, 2005
    651
    A lot of life left in the EVO AWD and RWD models. The RWD only came out last year so they can easily milk it for another 2-3 years.

    My guess is they'll be some sort of final edition EVO in 2023, probably an AdP paint special.
     
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  7. SLDriver

    SLDriver Formula Junior

    May 1, 2005
    651
    All the STO's arriving right now at US dealers are the market intro cars, customer cars will the next batch which should be arriving in a few weeks.
     
  8. Boots

    Boots Formula 3

    Jan 17, 2020
    1,663
    Canada
    Full Name:
    Jake
  9. MANDALAY

    MANDALAY F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed Silver Subscribed

    May 23, 2013
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    AUSTRALIA
    Full Name:
    ANGELO

    This girl got tags on herself ? Someone needs to tell her to keep her legs closer !
     
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  10. SLDriver

    SLDriver Formula Junior

    May 1, 2005
    651
    Not her best review and she had the lift up for most of the drive.
     
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  11. Shadowfax

    Shadowfax F1 Rookie
    BANNED

    Jun 10, 2016
    4,066
    Australia
    She’s sure giving the STO boys over there the big come on hahaha. They’re probably a bit scared of collecting their cars lol ….may need to bring their pills or she wont hand their car over.:D
     
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  12. italytrotter

    italytrotter Rookie

    Sep 19, 2015
    23
    World
    Thanks for your reply- appreciated-

    First, let me clarify on Ferrari: Pista has been in my target list since a while ago, I really like the car and i don't have anything negative to mention except some "minor personal opinions" related to the seating and the feeling of being a large car. Again it's my personal opinion, like wearing a suit, what is great for you may not be the same for me. Having driven many of the recent Ferraris - where I live the dealer organizes driving session, road and track, for existing and prospective customers - the offer is really great and the debate is really on personal level on how they handle etc.

    McLaren: thanks for calling the 650S Spider, which i owned for almost 5 year a POS!:D:D:D Maybe you are right and this overall ownership has spoiled my opinion of McLarens, but it is what is it. I decided to sell because after an engine misfire and the consequent engine rebuild took more than 5 months to have the car, it was enough for me. I know that the current production (the car itself) is a completely different from 5 years ago, but today i am not ready to handle $300-400k to the company as their dealer and service center in my location are not at a level I need for a car like that, especially if you actually drive it. On driving impressions, as customer I have been invited to many of their launch events and driven on the road and on track. 600LT spider beautiful car but after driving few times on track was not convinced by the turbo lag still present (confirmed also by the pro driver sitting close to me). On the 720, great car overall, but personally I would chose a 488 instead, better overall package.

    Overall no regrets for owning the 650 spider, I shipped to Italy for 1 years and half and drove there in so many wonderful roads, these memories are priceless and who cares if the car was a POS!

    I hope that McLaren corp will get an overhaul from the new owners, I will wait to see how the situation evolves:
    https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/saudis-pif-talks-buy-stake-mclaren-group-sky-news-2021-07-16/
     
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  13. italytrotter

    italytrotter Rookie

    Sep 19, 2015
    23
    World
    I would actually respect opinions of people who
    Hi again, let me clarify first one thing: I don't mind to be criticized on my car's opinions, feel free, but when become personal, maybe we are both wasting our precious time? And btw I personally don't mind having people providing opinions on cars that they never driven, it is interesting to see how they perceive a car and a brand.

    My original post was to gather info from Lamborghini owners who has spec'ed already the STO and see what is the consensus here on what is a must have. I did the same in real life, I called some friends in the Lamborghini club here and asked directly but especially to know the dealer and the service here, again it is a $400k commitment and i want to be sure they will take care of me properly.

    McLaren: yes i owned the car for almost 5 years, I never mentioned in my post that i didn't like the car, I said that has a massive turbo lag. I kept so long because it was a very old school driving style, with cool woosh sound etc, and being spider added a lot to the experience. It was not my primary car and I didn't feel the need to change. The issue with this car has been the questionable after sale support in my location, that's the reason why kept me away to later models, again small things, but massive delays to fix minor parts, run a diagnostic, do checkups etc. I sold (2 months ago btw) because after having an engine misfire taking down the car for 5 months, I thought was time to move on form me. This is my story, I don't regret to have owned this car a single second, but now I prefer to wait a bit to see how the corporate situation evolves.

    GT3RS: lack of power compared to a 720/488 etc...I meant this: have you tried to jump from one car to the other? Yes that feeling, you feel sitting still when you go from a 488 to the GT3RS...

    Hope I clarified a bit my post
     
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  14. italytrotter

    italytrotter Rookie

    Sep 19, 2015
    23
    World
    How do you compare to a Senna? Not driven a Senna but I have been a passenger in one, would be great to hear your impressions
     
  15. Shack

    Shack F1 Rookie
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    May 2, 2005
    2,503
    Earth
    Absolutely loved my 600LT spider and drove it in anger many KM's but no track time. Funny - I did not feel any noticeable turbo-lag
     
  16. Shadowfax

    Shadowfax F1 Rookie
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    Jun 10, 2016
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    #2291 Shadowfax, Jul 20, 2021
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2021
    I drove 600lt on track in anger and absolutely concur with italytrotter that 600lt was dreadfully laggy. The only way to avoid it was to enter the corner under hard braking in second with the engine virtually touching the limiter, but on power down upon apexing there was only a very short window of revs before an immediate upshift into 3rd was required, but then only a short rev span again before next upshift again. It was quick, but the 600 engine was unquestionably very low turbo tech compared to a 488 or Gt2 (VTG) where those two engines have bags of torque right throughout their entire rev range and an absolute joy to use in comparison. The 600 basically had a lag free boost window of about 1500 - 2000 rpms tops before it smacked into the limiter. Drive it under that window and it had no torque at all and the recovery was miserable until the boost recovered with the high revs. The engine was the worst part of the 600lt - if only it had a 488 engine in it!!;)

    It was so bad it put me right off buying that car.
     
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  17. Coincid

    Coincid F1 Rookie

    Dec 9, 2014
    3,577
    Canada
    Cannot comment on the Senna since I have never driven it.
     
  18. exoticcardreamer

    exoticcardreamer Formula 3

    Dec 9, 2014
    1,051
    usa
    Full Name:
    doesitmatter
    People like to say all sort of things on car forums. I get a chuckle out of them and especially when they don't conform to the stuff happening on the ground.

    My dealer tells me that they have 75 customers who have bought 3 or more mclarens... but hey online posters with loud opinions think their feelings are how the actual and real buyers perceive things.

    Fastestlaps is an indicator of a car track prowess but it doesn't tell the entire story (very few people will post the lap times and many cars are modified and you don't know how modified they are (I'm talking about Porsche's, BMW's, etc.). Here is the top rankings at Buttonwillow (focus on the driver (ie; 765 is slightly behind but it has a different pro driver).

    Fwiw: i own/owned all the mclarens in the top 4, have tracked at buttonwillow and own a pista. - the senna lap time is my car. he wasn't satisfied with the lap time on fresh cup2 tires with mercedes spec. He can get it below 1:40.

    1. McLaren Senna (P15) Billy Johnson 1:43.45 800 / 1364
    2. McLaren 600LT Billy Johnson 1:45.58 600 / 1404
    3. McLaren 720S Billy Johnson 1:46.02 720 / 1428
    4. McLaren 765LT Will Wattanawongkiri 1:46.16 765 / 1368
    5. Dodge Viper ACR (Mk V) Chris Winkler 1:47.70 654 / 1536
    6. Modified Porsche 911 GT3 (991) Will Wattanawongkiri 1:48.54 - / -
    7. McLaren MP4-12C (625 PS) Billy Johnson 1:50.18 625 / 1448
    8. Modified Ford Shelby Mustang GT350 Will Wattanawongkiri 1:50.32 - / -
    9. Porsche 911 GT3 RS Billy Johnson 1:50.40 520 / 1474
     
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  19. SoCal to az

    SoCal to az F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 25, 2012
    14,209
    Arizona
    I have limited time in a 600 but did not feel any turbo lag. My time in the car was not on a track.

    Where do you think the 765 can end up with a different driver? Faster than Senna?
     
  20. exoticcardreamer

    exoticcardreamer Formula 3

    Dec 9, 2014
    1,051
    usa
    Full Name:
    doesitmatter
    Laguna seca - same pro driver in my senna and 765 -

    Senna 1:27.2 (production car lap record);
    765: 127.9 (only two production cars in the 1:27's is senna and 765.

    My coach/pro driver thinks he can lower both by about 1 second but is confident that at Laguna the time difference between the two is .7 seconds.
     
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  21. SLDriver

    SLDriver Formula Junior

    May 1, 2005
    651
    Just got word Lamborghini will have a lounge at car week and my dealer hooked me up with the "siliver ticket package". Is anyone else heading down?
     
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  22. Need4Spd

    Need4Spd F1 Veteran

    Feb 24, 2007
    6,644
    Silicon Valley
    Modern turbo supercars are so good you don’t feel any turbo lag…until you drive one back to back with a responsive NA car like a 458. But there’s no question most if not all of the recent McLarens are faster around a track.


    Sent from my iPad using FerrariChat
     
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  23. Shadowfax

    Shadowfax F1 Rookie
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    Jun 10, 2016
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    #2298 Shadowfax, Jul 20, 2021
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2021
    Im not following the message which you are conveying here?

    Are you saying 600 has a very noticeably laggy engine or, does not have a very noticeably laggy engine?

    Of course lag can be provoked in every type of engine - turbo and even non turbo - depending upon the gear selected and the engine rpms at that time. This is not news. In lower turbo tech engines lag can be provoked far easier than others with superior turbo tech. That is a fact!

    However, the point in question is specific to the degree of lag manifested in 600s engine vs similar sized turbo engines in competitor cars, and not at all to do with vehicle lap times which most would be aware are frequently used as a measure of a drivers skill in a specific vehicle and/or the vehicle itself vs the competitions vehicle, using either the same driver or drivers of similar skill set.

    With regard to the 600 engine, lag is indeed very prevelalent in comparison to other engines when at the same rpm and gear. This is a reality.

    Using a 488 engine and/or a Gt2rs engine as a comparative, these two clearly have a far broader spectrum of usable rpms than the 600lt which clearly indict a far superior level of turbo technology employed specifically to reduce turbo lag.

    The 600 engine otoh has a far less flexible engine/rev range to where if not above a certain rpm bogs down quite badly. At the same level of rpm these other two engines (488/gt2) do not suffer this problem at all, therefore have a far broader (usable) spectrum of rpms. Another reality.

    Lag in a turbo engine is certainly very noticeable in the 600lt unit particularly if caught out in 3rd gear on corner exit at full throttle. Its like the engine has the available torque of a 2 litre NA engine and, leaves a very noticeable dead spot before the boost recovers. This takes some getting used to holding it in second - even though you no alternative - because the engine is already revving well above where you would desirably want it be so you still have enough revs left to wind out under full throttle before the next upshift. With 600lt its like you have so little revs left on the tach in second on corner exit before an urgent shift into 3rd id required. With the 488 or GT2 you can attack the same corner (even in third gear) and have bags of torque and rpms left on tap with zero lag happenning when you pin the throttle. If you do the same in a 600lt it just dies in the ass. 600 is a bit like a gt3rs in that whem you enter a tighter radius corner you are better in second even though the revs are still well over 5 at the apex except 600 sadly doesnt have a 9000rpm to work with so is out of revs in the nano second it takes for the engine to move from 5/5500 to its 7k peak. With the RS youve got 9000 revs to work with so it never catches you short like the 600 can do/does. This can unsettle the car through the corner too if you need to upshift.

    Anyone who is unable to notice this is full of it - has nothing at all to do with lap times or how fast the car is. No one is suggesting a Mac 600 is a bad car but it does have a rather laggy engine in comparison to the comp. No question about that. The engine id the cars weakest link.
     
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  24. wthensler

    wthensler F1 Rookie
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    Apr 27, 2015
    3,150
    Gator Country, FL
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    William
    Interestingly enough, my 458 seems to have a slight lag pulling out of low RPMs ( < 3000 ) that isn’t there at any other engine speed. always been there and almost feels like a lumpy cam. Pulls hard after that and no problems to redline….mechanic thinks it’s a characteristic of the engine, but I have no comparator.

    The F8 (which admittedly I have only demo’d) has a slight but detectable lag, not enough to bother me, but under real world conditions, we’ll see. Exactly how much of that power I’ll be able to use on the hard Appalachian roads remains to be seen.

    Someone on this forum keeps saying it’s more fun to drive a slow car fast than vice versa. I can confirm the slow part; the latter I’ll find out soon enough.

    The NA STO is an unknown, at least to me. I don’t know of anyone that demo’d it before ordering, myself included. But if it’s a mere kick in the pants above the 458 it should suffice for me.
     
  25. Shadowfax

    Shadowfax F1 Rookie
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    Jun 10, 2016
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    #2300 Shadowfax, Jul 20, 2021
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2021
    Just like the GT3rs, STO will be more than fast enough ive no doubt about that.

    The turbos do have that hand of god acceleration though, and when all the elements associated to emotion and driver connection are combined, working in proper symphony with one another this is what really separates a brilliant car from a great car - especially when that hand of god acceleration is part of that package.:D
     
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