F40 Turbos | FerrariChat
Buy

F40 Turbos

Discussion in '288GTO/F40/F50/Enzo/LaFerrari/F80' started by red-riot, Jul 31, 2005.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

Page 1 of 2
  1. red-riot

    red-riot Karting

    Nov 14, 2003
    203
    Westchester, NY
    Full Name:
    Jon
    #1 red-riot, Jul 31, 2005
    So I blew a seal on the left bank turbo this weekend just running down the street for some milk. Scared the cr&p out of me as the backend of the car was covered with a nasty mixture of oil and coolant? Once we tore it down it was apparent the problem came from the turbo.

    I was hoping to get some opinions on upgrading to the LM Turbo setup that Carabou racing is marketing. I've gotten several comments from the folks who rebuild the engine that the LM turbo's are too big for the type of street driving I do and would probably be disappointing unless I planned to track the car. Their comments are that the larger turbos take longer to spool up, so I'd experience more lag at the bottom end. I spend most of my miles on the street as I only get to the track once or twice a year so I'm not looking to build a top-end monster.

    I also got a strange response from FNA when I asked about availibility of a replacement turbo, they said that there where two turbos mfged, a standard on the older cars and an "enhanced" they said they only have enhanced in stock so if I indeed have the older turbos I'd have to replace both? Anybody ever hear of this?


    Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

    Thanks

    Jon
     
  2. ivo73

    ivo73 F1 Rookie
    Consultant

    Mar 3, 2005
    3,475
    Switzerland
    Full Name:
    Ivo Pucci
    #2 ivo73, Jul 31, 2005
    hello Jon,
    the only information that i can give you is that,that the turbochargers
    supplier ( IHI) produced new turbo's in 1995.
    new part number 164358 and 164359 in replacement of the older part no.152161 and 152162.
    I'm not sure if the part number changed again in the last years....
    hope this helps a little.
    regards from switzerland
    ivo
     
  3. zsnnf

    zsnnf Formula 3

    Sep 11, 2003
    1,877
    #3 zsnnf, Jul 31, 2005
    Hi Jon,
    Here's what I am lead to believe.....
    Yes, the only turbo that is available now IS the updated turbo.
    I believe this is the turbo that was refered to as the "LM" turbo.
    It is not bigger. It has roller bearings instead of bushings. The inlet does provide better airflow. The impeller design is improved also. It actually comes in sooner, not later. Therefor it is more driveable, not less.
    So your choices are to either rebuild your turbo, find a used one (I have 2 but I don't want to sell yet) (they make great upgrades for a 288) Or buy the new turbos with new chips. You should see another 35+/- HP with this change.
    You can get the Turbos and chips from Rod at FAI 949 631-6373 or from Tate at Carabu 949 722-9307. Rod should be a little cheaper. I think he builds the chips for Tate.

    Rick
     
  4. mrknowitallf40

    mrknowitallf40 Formula Junior

    Feb 20, 2005
    306
    #4 mrknowitallf40, Jul 31, 2005
    A few years back I bought just the turbos from Rutland's for $3800/pair
     
  5. GiB_@!

    GiB_@! Formula Junior

    Jul 24, 2005
    337
    New Zealand
    Full Name:
    Alex
    #5 GiB_@!, Jul 31, 2005
    Sorry this is a tiny bit off-topic but does anyone know how many pounds boost the F40 runs stock ? Thankyou :)
     
  6. zsnnf

    zsnnf Formula 3

    Sep 11, 2003
    1,877
    #6 zsnnf, Jul 31, 2005

    1.1 bar or about 17 pounds.
    Here's a site you can find all kinds of Ferrari facts. http://www.ferrariturbo.com
     
  7. rammsteinmatt

    rammsteinmatt Formula Junior

    Jul 26, 2005
    371
    Glendora, CA
    Full Name:
    Matthew Shinavar
    #7 rammsteinmatt, Aug 1, 2005
    this might sound dumb, but why couldnt you run a stock turbo on one bank, and an LM on the other? in hopes of getting low end boost from the stocker, and high end from the LM.
     
  8. red-riot

    red-riot Karting

    Nov 14, 2003
    203
    Westchester, NY
    Full Name:
    Jon
    #8 red-riot, Aug 1, 2005
    Hi Rick,

    Thanks this is very helpful. The dealer just quoted me 8k for replacing both turbos (parts only)! Well everytime I think I'm gonna finally upgrade the brakes boom there goes the piggy bank!! I'm gonna shop around and see if I can locate a old style turbo before going down the upgrade route.

    Does anybody have any good recommendations for a shop that can rebuild my dead turbo? Might as well have it operational for when the new one sh?ts the bed....

    If FNA is moving the enhanced turbos does anybody know if that requires a chip change or does the FNA turbos run with the standard chips?

    I bought my drop gears and LM exhaust from Tate so I'll give him and Rod a call to see who can source them at the best price maybe they have a few old turbos laying around.....

    Jon
     
  9. red-riot

    red-riot Karting

    Nov 14, 2003
    203
    Westchester, NY
    Full Name:
    Jon
    #9 red-riot, Aug 1, 2005

    Thanks I'll call them tonight! Just got quoted 8k for the same....
     
  10. red-riot

    red-riot Karting

    Nov 14, 2003
    203
    Westchester, NY
    Full Name:
    Jon
    #10 red-riot, Aug 1, 2005
    Thanks ivo,

    The Turbo came off of the left bank (drivers side) it had the part number 136421. Go figure....

    Jon
     
  11. rexrcr

    rexrcr Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 27, 2002
    1,578
    Kalamazoo, MI
    Full Name:
    Rob Schermerhorn
    #11 rexrcr, Aug 3, 2005
    There are a few in the US. Turbonetics is the last place I used.

    BTW, the OEM, IHI, changed the spec on the turbo more than once. I had a customer that blew three, all left side (that pressurizes the 1-4 bank). Each one sourced from FNA had the same Ferrari PN, but different IHI numbers. Last one I used had VU-11 on it (and I dont' have the rest of my notes), this was 1997. After the last one blew (this was a modified car... 26 psig), we designed and built a system with big Garretts, T3/4 hybrid, 50 trim, ceramic ball bearings <is it getting hot in here?>....

    Back OT, each succesive update did flow differently, but FNA said direct replacement. Turbonetics may be able to modifiy the sets to flow the same, they volunteered this service to me, but we upgraded and never followed through with modifying the stock turbos.


    Best regards,

    Rob Schermerhorn
     
  12. mrknowitallf40

    mrknowitallf40 Formula Junior

    Feb 20, 2005
    306
    #12 mrknowitallf40, Aug 3, 2005
    Try Ferrari UK. That is where most of these guys get their parts. They are always cheaper.
     
  13. red-riot

    red-riot Karting

    Nov 14, 2003
    203
    Westchester, NY
    Full Name:
    Jon
    #13 red-riot, Aug 3, 2005
    Rob,

    Thanks for the info I located a set of the "enhanced" turbos at Rutlands, and should be getting them on Monday, I only wish your shop was closer the folks in NY have no imagination!

    Jon
     
  14. Roland E Linder

    Roland E Linder Formula 3

    Nov 3, 2003
    1,814
    COLORADO
    Full Name:
    Roland E Linder
    #14 Roland E Linder, Aug 5, 2005
    Red riot, check your PM
    Roland
    F40LM
     
  15. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 19, 2001
    22,611
    The Brickyard
    Full Name:
    The Bad Guy
    #15 ernie, Aug 5, 2005
  16. Roland E Linder

    Roland E Linder Formula 3

    Nov 3, 2003
    1,814
    COLORADO
    Full Name:
    Roland E Linder
    #16 Roland E Linder, Aug 7, 2005
    IHI can't be rebuild , get a Garrett with changeable carthridge. Check with Turbo Engineering in Golden Colorado.
    Roland
    F40LM
     
  17. F5506M

    F5506M Formula Junior

    Nov 3, 2003
    921
    New Jersey
    Full Name:
    Ray
    #17 F5506M, Aug 9, 2005
    Classic Coach in Elizabeth, New Jersey has extensive experience with F-40's as i see they always have a few customer cars in there at all times. From what i know they have experience with and usually have in-stock suitable replacement/re-building for LM Turbo's. I don't have an F40 but just ran into this thread and saw that you were NY. You can call CC directly at 908-352-3939 and they could probably answer all your questions all better than i could. Ask for either Felix or Rocco and mention my name.

    As far as CC's reputation they have done all the work on my Ferrari and Lamborghini and i have never had any problem with their work.
     
  18. staatsof

    staatsof Nine Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 13, 2005
    95,304
    Fuggetaboutitland
    Full Name:
    Bob
    #18 staatsof, Aug 23, 2005
    I have been speaking with them about this recently and they don't use the IHI units any longer. I think they have a Garret configuration they use now.

    Bob S.
     
  19. ghost

    ghost F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Dec 10, 2003
    10,046
    Singapore
    #19 ghost, Aug 24, 2005
    Jon, just read about this. Sorry to hear you have to deal with this.

    How'd you end up?
     
  20. red-riot

    red-riot Karting

    Nov 14, 2003
    203
    Westchester, NY
    Full Name:
    Jon
    #20 red-riot, Aug 24, 2005
    Hey Vik,

    Good! Rutlands had the parts, abeit I had to replace both because I couldn't find anybody who would sell me one of the old style turbos. WWOC slaped them in and she's running great. Ran it down to my house in Longport last weekend with no problems! So far so good! I'm gonna tool around the Philly area this weekend and tweak the wastegate a bit.

    Jon
     
  21. zsnnf

    zsnnf Formula 3

    Sep 11, 2003
    1,877
    #21 zsnnf, Aug 24, 2005
    Glad to hear you are back on the road. What did Rutlands charge you for the turbos?
    Does the power curve feel any different? Are you makeing any more boost? How much total?

    Rick
     
  22. Node

    Node Karting

    Aug 22, 2005
    83
    Stinson Beach, Ca
    Full Name:
    Benjamin J Martin
    #22 Node, Aug 24, 2005
    you do know that turbos are rebuildable

    should cost about $200 or maybe a little more.
    I'm fairly sure that IHIs are rebuildable but not positive

    Unless your turbo is trashed, I don't see why not rebuild it unless you want to have all brand new parts (as it is a ferrari afterall) or want an excuse to upgrade.

    Try to find a IHI turbo dealer and check some of the turboed import forums (supra, rx-7, etc) as they use IHIs on some of the aftermarket kits......APEXi is one of the manufacturers that uses them.
    They actually have a ball bearing abraidable seal IHI. very very fast spool.

    *EDIT*
    D'oh, a little too late of a reply and seems that someone says that IHIs arent rebuildable. oh well.
     
  23. red-riot

    red-riot Karting

    Nov 14, 2003
    203
    Westchester, NY
    Full Name:
    Jon
    #23 red-riot, Aug 24, 2005
    Combined they set me back $5800. The power curve feels much different, I've got the wastegate set very conservatively as I wanted to put on a few hundered miles before really dialing them in. They seem less binary then the earlier models, the boost builts more evenly across the power range. Prior the Turbos would come on and the acceleration was scarey, now its less violent. I'm hoping this is all wastegate tuning as I loved getting pasted to the drivers seat....

    Again I'm not sure if this is the turbos or the gate but I'll let you know when I start playing with the wastegate. I'm thinking about doing the chip change as well, but I want to make incremental changes to see each components effects on the cars behavior.

    The thing thats upsetting me is the reduction of the turbo swoosh - or as my wife calls it the dentist chair in the rear. Its definitely not as pronounced a sound - oh well small price to pay.

    One thing I wanted to tell you is that when the shop put everything back they put the cat's back in with my LM exhaust (normally I run test pipes) I was shocked when it sounded just a bit louder then my street tubi exhaust. I left the cat's in for the break in period (I'm sure the guy next door paid the shop)....Its strange I don't think I'll ever go back to my street Tubi after hearing the difference.

    Jon
     
  24. red-riot

    red-riot Karting

    Nov 14, 2003
    203
    Westchester, NY
    Full Name:
    Jon
    #24 red-riot, Aug 24, 2005
    No D'oh thanks for the post, simply put I couldn't wait to get the car back on the road again, being in NY everyday the weather is good is a good day to take it out. I couldn't contemplate the level of anxiety I would have missing some of the best driving days of the year as my Turbo's where being rebuilt.

    Thanks

    Jon
     
  25. zsnnf

    zsnnf Formula 3

    Sep 11, 2003
    1,877
    #25 zsnnf, Aug 24, 2005
    Jon,
    Funny stuff :)
    Yea, I miss the WHOOOOP of the stock turbos also... :) That sound was soooo cool!!
    I too am running test pipes and a tubi but may switch to cats and LM pipes.
    I think the Cats and LM's have a throatier sound to them over the test pipes and Tubi's.
    Or Hell, maybe test pipes and LM pipes to wake up the 'hood :)
    The new turbos do seem to kick in sooner for me also. My car can spin the rear tires with a part throttle squeeze at 100 mph.
    Anyone got a source for a rear wing??? I REALLY need one.
    I think you should try a set of chips. Rod has them 949 631-6373.

    Enjoy,
    Rick
     
Page 1 of 2

Share This Page