F12 Berlinatta w 25k miles | FerrariChat

F12 Berlinatta w 25k miles

Discussion in 'Ferrari Discussion (not model specific)' started by BrianW, Oct 24, 2019.

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  1. BrianW

    BrianW Rookie

    Oct 23, 2019
    6
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    Brian Wetzel
    Hi everyone, first time starting a thread, glad to be here. I’m finally in a position to purchase a F12 Berlinetta and believe I found a great candidate. I love the colors and no fender shields the most. I had it inspected today and look forward to the results of the inspection. I’m on the other side of the country so couldn’t see it in person. With the mileage at 25k, and the options from the factory (was $371k MSRP – MY 2016) I believe the price should be under $200k, so hopefully they’ll come down a little. But we're close enough.. My primary concern is that the car spent its entire life in Wisconsin, and was clearly driven in the rain/sleet/snow. There’s surface corrosion in the front wheel wells, and also in the rear diffuser area with the mesh. I’m not sure if these areas can be cleaned/painted, or replaced and at what cost for replacement. Does anyone know the car?

    Here’s the current ad:

    http://www.autoholding.us/vehicle-details/2016-ferrari-f12berlinetta--hillside-nj-id-32660181


    And here’s the vehicle in the Sold Inventory section of Miller Motors website in CT earlier this year when they sold it to auction after no buyer wanted to pay their resell asking price. Miller was the original selling dealer, and then reacquired the car earlier this year, but then sold it to auction. It’s been passed around to a couple of dealers as no one is offering $210k. If they’ll come down I’d love to buy the car, my kinda specs. It would be a keeper, I keep all my cars long term and would love to put many thousands of miles on this one. I’m in Las Vegas and the car would never see rain or snow. But it may have had a rough life in Wisconsin?

    https://www.ferrariofgreenwich.com/used-2016-ferrari-f12-berlinetta-c-2946.htm

    Any thoughts would be appreciated. And if anyone knows the car, service records, etc. Thanks much !
     
  2. Yellow Compass

    Yellow Compass F1 Veteran
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    Nov 23, 2015
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    Hi Brian the reviews on yelp on AH AUTO HOLDINGS are NOT very favorable.
    call me i will help you navigate the murky waters :)
    Mike 973-610-7111
     
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  3. Gh21631

    Gh21631 F1 Veteran
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    Call Mike if you want a good car at a fair price.
     
  4. C50

    C50 Formula 3
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    Aug 19, 2016
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    It’s a buyers market for these cars, especially with higher mileage.

    Unless you absolutely must have that specific car immediately, my suggestion would be to find a similarly appealing spec, closer to home, that you can inspect and PPI.

    A bonus would be to buy it from a local dealer which may help to establish a relationship, the value of which would be up to you to determine.

    If you are able to appreciate concerning wear just based on images, my sense is there’s probably other issues that are more significant than skin deep.

    regardless, enjoy the search and be sure to post images after you find your match.
     
  5. BrianW

    BrianW Rookie

    Oct 23, 2019
    6
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    Brian Wetzel
    Hi Mike, thanks, for sure will call you tomorrow. The inspection company I used has inspected 22 cars for me over the years and I ended up purchasing 17 of them. I still have most of them. I’m looking forward to receiving the inspection report soon.

    I was hoping someone here in this group may have been the former owner or may know about the car. It’s a one owner car from Miller Motors in CT and the car has spent its entire life in Wisconsin (exposure to nasty weather). Thanks everyone!
     
  6. Meister

    Meister F1 Veteran
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    #6 Meister, Oct 24, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2019
    So you seeing this corrosion from the pics in the ad or from teh inspection report?
     
  7. LightGuy

    LightGuy Four Time F1 World Champ
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    What is tge body warrnty on ferrari. Most cars in 10 years
     
  8. Meister

    Meister F1 Veteran
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    well Ive never been up close and personal with an F12, but on every ferrari I've ever owned the inner fender wells were either Fiberglas or some sort of ABS plastic composite. Thus if you are going off the pics in the ad and thinking those white spots (behind the front wheels) are corrosion on the inner wheel wells, I'm not sure that is the case. Secondly the discoloration around the exhaust tips in the rear diffuser looks more like heat discoloration/paint fade to me. I'm thinking that that mesh is made from aluminum thus no corrosion either. Obviously wait for the full inspection, but those are my $.02
     
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  9. technom3

    technom3 F1 World Champ
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    Getting Ferrari to cover corrosion issues in the past has proven difficult
     
  10. daytona355

    daytona355 F1 World Champ
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    I may be the odd one out, but I’ve always had no issues with getting them to honour the corrosion warranty. Long s the car is looked after, serviced by ferrari and the annual checks done on corrosion, they pretty much agree to cover anything reasonable. I think sometimes there are probably arguments about whether the corrosion is a defect or if caused by wear and tear on the car that hasn’t been corrected before a problem was created (stone chips left unchecked etc maybe)
     
  11. technom3

    technom3 F1 World Champ
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    Maybe I'm still bitter over my 612.
     
  12. daytona355

    daytona355 F1 World Champ
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    What was wrong with yours? I had some corrosion under the paint on the front of the nose, came (so they said) from the hand finishing where a hammer was used that had also hit some other corrosive metal and bashed some into the aluminium, hence the impossible corrosion. They did fix it though, and respray the car to make it right
     
  13. Steinhart

    Steinhart Formula Junior

    May 21, 2019
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    Scottsdale, AZ, USA
    #13 Steinhart, Oct 28, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2019
    mind sharing with us which PPI company you are using?

    would be helpful for future purchases, thanks

    good luck with your purchase!
     
  14. Themaven

    Themaven F1 Rookie

    Nov 2, 2014
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    Having owned a 12 cylinder Ferrari that had been driven in winter before and which had corrosion on its exhaust, suspension, and almost every part of the underbody that could rust, I would suggest you buy a clean car. There are lots around, and there’s always another perfect car for you around. Always.
     
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  15. BrianW

    BrianW Rookie

    Oct 23, 2019
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    Brian Wetzel
    Hi everyone, thanks so much for the input. Unfortunately, I’m gonna pass on this example. The inspection was great, the car is super clean, immaculate underneath, especially for 25k miles. It’s been serviced at Ferrari up to date. It’s eligible for the two year warranty extension as per my local Ferrari dealer based on the VIN and after they see the car in person of course. The crud and stains on the front inner wheel well splash shields was no big deal, and the light scratches underneath the bottom of the rear diffuser area were also no big deal. The car is perfect, for me, except for the price, was just a little high, but I thought was close enough that two willing parties would find a way to meet in the middle. If they came down a little bit I probably would have pulled the trigger, don’t mind paying a few bucks over market for my favorite colors and options. But they actually raised the price to $220k (from 208k to 220k, no joke), apparently they add 5% transaction fee to their sales transactions, the price on the website doesn’t include their transaction fee. I offered $200k flat, and ready to send the wire, and come pick up the car in person today, willing to overpay a little even though I think it’s a 190 – 195k car. The only downside to the car IMHO regarding the value proposition was the mileage, and some would argue that having no fender shields reduces the value / pool of buyers. In this case, and with the yellow brake calipers, I actually like it better w/o fender shields. I’m gonna keep hunting, and as next year comes around, even more clean F12’s will become available for sale. Please keep me in mind everyone, if you’re ever gonna unload your clean F12 (or know someone) in the $200k range. Apparently, F12’s with over 20k miles that are super clean will value somewhere at/around $200k these days, but the market is softening as more F12’s come onto market. Thanks everyone, I’m learning a lot from this chat community and appreciate being here !! Sincerely, Brian Wetzel.
     
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  16. BrianW

    BrianW Rookie

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    Brian Wetzel
  17. Alcav5

    Alcav5 F1 Rookie
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    Mine will be on as soon as the bumper is fixed. I'm hoping within 2 weeks.
     
  18. Meister

    Meister F1 Veteran
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    have you seen the F12 here in the classifieds for sale?
     
  19. RonH

    RonH Formula 3

    May 29, 2016
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    Brian good for you. These people are scum. I looked at the add. It clearly says $208. They are the seller. That is the advertised price. To add 5% onto that is absurd and, frankly false advertising. Everyone should put these idiots on their do not call list.
     
  20. BrianW

    BrianW Rookie

    Oct 23, 2019
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    Brian Wetzel
    Yes that looks like a great car, and a great deal. But the colors aren’t for me, especially the interior. Wow such great bang for your buck. It’s a buyers market for these cars for sure. Thanks!
     
  21. RonH

    RonH Formula 3

    May 29, 2016
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    Brian, a personal level, I agree with you. The interior is boring when you look at the exterior. You need some pop somewhere.

    On the legal side I think they retained Chuckles The Clown as their attorney to draft their disclaimer. They state in the ad:

    “All advertised prices exclude government fees and taxes, any finance charges, any dealer document preparation charge, and any emission testing charge. The price for listed vehicles as equipped does not include charges such as: License, Title, Registration Fees, State or Local Taxes, Smog Fees, Credit Investigation, Auto Holding Vehicle Certification, Optional Credit Insurance, Optional Maintenance Packages, Physical Damage of Liability Insurance, or Delivery Fees. Auto Holding makes no representations, expressed or implied, to any actual or prospective purchaser or owner of this vehicle as to the existence, ownership, accuracy, description or condition of the listed vehicle's equipment, accessories, price, specials or any warranties. Any and all vehicles that qualify and/or are sold under our 14 day return policy, are subject to a 20% restocking fee from the purchase price. Any and all differences must be addressed prior to the sale of this vehicle. Auto Holding is not responsible for typos and exact options list as it is automatically decoded from the VIN number. Dealer will not be liable for any inaccuracies, claims or losses of any nature.”

    Where does that disclose the 5% “transaction fee”? Also, they say they make no representation as to the “existence” of the vehicle or its “ownership”!!! So if they sold you air that that they didn’t own and you were lucky enough to qualify for their 14 day return policy they would charge you a restocking fee of 20% or $40k on a $200k purchase? People should RUN from anybody that even thinks of stating such nonsense.
     

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