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430 F1 actuator failure, how often this happens

Discussion in '360/430' started by Mario Andretti, Oct 27, 2021.

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  1. Mario Andretti

    Mario Andretti Formula 3
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    #1 Mario Andretti, Oct 27, 2021
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2021
    Hi,

    For the connoisseurs...
    My 05 F430 F1 came with a reconditioned pump actuator, seems to be done by GTE, looks like the one in these pics:
    http://www.gte-engineering.com/f1-actuator-rebuild.html

    The documentation I have shows shifts failing, and " F1 system oil is dirty and shows signs of metal in fluid. Common symptoms to actuator failure. R&R actuator , sent to reconditioning".

    It was done in 2018, when car had 15,xxx miles. Is this a typical failure.. or is something else at play causing these failures? I read that early models like 2005 were more prone, did Ferrari improved these units in later years?

    Also, when doing upshifts at high rpm and high throttle in race mode, shifts are pretty violent... Is that normal? It is very smooth when going low rpm and low throttle, I don't have to lift, shifting very nice.
    Downshifts are very nice, rev matching and all that..

    This is both in Sport and Race mode. Low traction mode is the smoothest still, but kind of long, so I stay away from it.

    Thanks for any input.
     
  2. chenglo1

    chenglo1 Formula Junior

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    #2 chenglo1, Oct 27, 2021
    Not sure what part you are referring to. The F1 pump or the Actuator? I know the older F430s before a certain VIN used an older pump. I believe mid 2006 and up got the updated pump. Im not sure which is the actuator tho. Sorry. I can tell you that high rev aggressive shifts can be violent...heavy metal rock song head banging style. Im talking near redline from a stop in gears 1, 2 , 3 for sure. Ive only attemted this on racetracks and country roads in Mexico. When i recently test drove a Huracan 580-2 and 458, the shifts were like..."meh". Hope u get it sorted out.
     
  3. Mario Andretti

    Mario Andretti Formula 3
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    #3 Mario Andretti, Oct 27, 2021
    Actuator... long device with valves sitting tight on the right of the gearbox. It actually engages the clutch.
     
  4. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    #4 Qavion, Oct 28, 2021
    It engages the gears, not the clutch.

    The Power Unit (with pump, pressure reservoir and 6 solenoid valves) sends carefully controlled hydraulic pressure to the Gear Engagement/Selector Actuator (long device on the gearbox) and hydraulic pressure to the clutch actuator. There is a dedicated solenoid valve on the Power Unit for the clutch hydraulics (and separate hydraulic line).
     
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  5. mwstewart

    mwstewart F1 Rookie

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    #5 mwstewart, Oct 28, 2021
    Actuator failure isn't unknown, but it isn't exactly common either. Sorry no hard data, just an opinion based on what I've heard of and read over the years.
     
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  6. RedTaxi

    RedTaxi F1 Rookie
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    #6 RedTaxi, Oct 28, 2021
    Full throttle shifts are pretty violent. Does your rebuilt actuator have a problem? It may have needed rebuilding because the fluid was never changed. Have you had the fluid changed and bled, if not it's due.
     
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  7. Mario Andretti

    Mario Andretti Formula 3
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    #7 Mario Andretti, Oct 28, 2021
    Hi,
    Thanks for replying. I was not sure how it should shift at full throttle, hence my question and concern. I don't have any problems with the actuator; it only has 3k miles since replacement.. Car drives nice.

    I have not bled/ changed but will do so. I was just curious how often do they fail, as it failed in this car at 15k miles.
    This is what was done at 15,280 miles:
    "Road test top verify. Cannot verify complaint. F1 system is dirty and shows sign of metal in fluid. Errors are common to actuator failure. R&R Gearbox actuator for sublet overhaul. Reinstall actuator, replace shift position sensor kit as preventitive, bleed actuator, clutch and e-diff systems. Perform shift self learn. Check and adjust pis. reinstall all components. Road test to verify proper operation"

    So at worst case scenario my fluid is 3 years old and 3k miles...

    Funny thing is, at the same service, they also replaced : rear main seal, release bearing seals, flange seal and o'rings. (service said "rear main seal is damaged from improper installation" !! - so someone butchered it there before)

    They also replaced F1 pump, and in-line fluid filters.

    So major work done, the bill was over 16k !

    Anyway, I hope it's good to go now :)
     
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  8. Mario Andretti

    Mario Andretti Formula 3
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    #8 Mario Andretti, Oct 28, 2021
    Since we are on topic, what is the best fluid to use for flushing this F1 system?
    Thanks
     
  9. Jackson32

    Jackson32 Rookie

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    #9 Jackson32, Oct 28, 2021
    i have read someone suggested, but have not used it myself.

    Liqui Moly Central Hydraulic System Oil 20038
     
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  10. Extreme1

    Extreme1 Formula 3

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    #10 Extreme1, Oct 28, 2021
    I think I used Mobil 1 ATF for the flush. I have a Launch X431 so was able to do it myself.


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
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  11. chenglo1

    chenglo1 Formula Junior

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    #11 chenglo1, Oct 29, 2021
     
  12. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    #12 tazandjan, Nov 4, 2021
    Most problems with F1 are due to lack of maintenance. Ferrari unfortunately did not recommend changing F1 fluid until the 599 came out. Should be done at least every three years.



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  13. tbakowsky

    tbakowsky F1 World Champ
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    #13 tbakowsky, Nov 4, 2021
    Actuator failure is NOT common in the F430. 360 cars did have issues..but they were resolved with the 430 units. Having had the actuator rebuilt at 15k miles tells me incorrect diagnosis was performed.

    Almost all shifting issues with the f430 f1 units can be traced to either a failing accumulator, or even more common the shift potentiometers needing replacment.

    I have seen more misdiagnosed F430/360 f1 issues then anything else on these cars costing owners a ton of money needlessly. Be careful out there..
     
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  14. Mario Andretti

    Mario Andretti Formula 3
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    #14 Mario Andretti, Nov 5, 2021
    I believe you; just reporting what I saw in the service documentation...
     
  15. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    #15 Qavion, Nov 5, 2021
  16. tbakowsky

    tbakowsky F1 World Champ
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    #16 tbakowsky, Nov 6, 2021
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