Hi folks, My '01 360M has been throwing the P0442 CEL, and I needed to take the car in for a yearly service anyways, so I asked the mechanic (T&R Automotive in San Francisco) to diagnose..(I had already tried tightening the gas cap as other posts mentioned). Tony @ T&R mentioned that the CEL is being thrown due to a leak from the EVAP solenoid valves... He said 3 out of 4 are leaking, and suggested replacing all 4 of them at a cost of about $2900. Each valve part costs on the order of $400. He also mentioned that not fixing this leak means that the engine will run too lean and use more fuel as with the leak, the air/fuel ratio will not be right. From my searching on the forum, I haven't seen any posts describing this part (EVAP solenoid valve?) or this issue, so was just looking to see if others have run into this issue as well. Is this common? Has anyone been able to DIY a solution? Does this all make sense, or am I being taken for a ride? Thanks in advance.
I'm not sure which valves he's referring to. There are two "washing valves" and an "On/Off" valve shown in this parts diagram (USA 2000 and later): https://www.eurospares.co.uk/parts/ferrari/360-modena/engine/antievaporation-device-40649 The total cost for these three valves is shown as less than U$400 plus P&H/taxes. Where are you located? I would check the location of these valves to see if they can be accessed easily.
Thanks Qavion.. he mentioned they were not easy to access, and I'll share this diagram with him and ask him to clarify which part he is talking about. I also see a similar diagram here https://www.scuderiacarparts.com/part-finder/ferrari/430/oe/17/2673/49993?h=11233 that shows 2 solenoid valves (part 6) and 2 on/off solenoid valves (part 21)... Similarly all 4 should add up to < $400 in cost..
I'm not sure if your translation from the Technician who did the diag is correct, something is missing. The EVAP system is pretty basic. I't my understanding it's a GM system. You have two normally closed (power off) Purge valves #38 which under certain criteria open to allow fuel vapors from fueling stored in the canister #1 into the intake to be burned. The Vent valve #11 is a normally open valve (power off) to allow the gas tanks to vent to the atmosphere as fuel is used, otherwise they would collapse. This Vent valve is only closed when the system is checked for leaks (a requirement by the Feds). The process to check for leaks is only performed under certain conditions, it's a two step process. First the Vent valve is closed and the Purge valve is opened drawing a vacuum in the system which is monitored by the ECM through the fuel tank pressure sensor, it's looking for a vacuum. If it's passes (Large leak Test) then both valve close and the ECM looks for a pressure rise (Small Leak Test). The Purge valves are a Bosch part found on EBAY for 30 to 50 bucks each. The Vent valve is a special Ferrari part which is hard to find. The Canister is another Ferrari part, and it should be checked as it contains small charcoal pellets for vapor recovery which can dislodge and ruin the valves. All the valves are fairly easy to access and can easily be check as they are two wire solenoids (power and ground applied). The Canister can be checked by removing and seeing if charcoal falls out the tube. The lines can be checked by Smoke for intergrity. Hope that helps.
Uhhh.....$2900? IF he is talking about these purge/solenoid valves in the pic, they are available from Rockauto for under $25. Used them when I rebuilt my entire canister/EVAP system last year since all the hoses were disintegrating into goo. They were not difficult to get to once your take off your side shield. BUT If he's talking about your rollover valves on your fuel tanks like I suspect he may be, that's a bit of a different story as they run a couple hundred apiece. Definitely get some clarification before proceeding. Image Unavailable, Please Login Purge valves: https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=283608&jsn=720&_nck=ZExt1ysfqhqWnq%2BEvUNdS3Txyey60IDtnjPWF5UU9J0BWQv7pvqZbkEUk86%2BAYIhFUNxSQbBt9FtCvnAG5QgjPSTp%2FEa4IAlPLTnu6tQGfjRrRCWWqbcFYo1pws3NaBWcgxaLqgoqB9g1xTohMrrznNXBDaxR8rRowAzl2UKXv2PwrxUb%2B8pDVXbDh8sQPtveBM8%2BtbT85PYn4nYc1l%2FUBGfaF6cJDzCF%2BSCY5hpdipTSUskhSU1MlUwTvgReiS3Np1ZRklmluN1ftydvEdNoSitPRIFRXy0MlBWLtYHOPyTp%2BKB5rPl88q%2Bpg%2FpMkV1iUT2sTBv4DTkhkjd59Hlmyp1zXdArZeZ
Thanks for this explanation and detailed information, I will try to discuss with the mechanic today to better understand. When I linked him to the valves above from Eurospares or Scuederia automotive he simply said "There are several iteration of these valves and there is a split that year. That is why I don’t purchase parts except from Ferrari North America. I cannot verify if these parts are the correct ones for your car." In the estimate provided there is only this info (first $ column is parts, second $ is labor) Image Unavailable, Please Login The mechanic said he did a smoke test to find the leak, and the smoke test was not enough to find it.. Eventually he found it using soapy water and looking for bubbles..
OK after seeing that, I'm almost certain he is talking about the rollover valves on the fuel tanks themselves.
Thanks Redneck.. given that, does the quote look more reasonable to you? Do you think replacing the rollover valves is a good candidate for DIY?
That all depends, I have a Modena and personally have not performed that service on my car, also didn't see whether you have a Spider or coupe. Since we are talking about fuel system components (if I'm correct in my assessment), then it all comes down to comfort and experience so I won't say one way or the other. A fuel leak from a seal that wasn't set correctly could have catastrophic, if not fatal, consequences.
Makes sense.. I have a Modena coupe. I haven't worked on fuel system components before, so I will most likely ask the mechanic to do it after getting clarification that it is indeed the rollover valves. However I've seen other posts about replacing the fuel pump, which seems to solve the "tank wont fill till full" problem, so I'm reading more and thinking about tackling that issue myself, and debating whether to combine with this valve replacement..
Suneet, you've provided a link to the F430 vacuum system. I don't know enough about the P044x codes to know if the vacuum system is included. Here's the vaccum system on the F360: https://www.eurospares.co.uk/parts/ferrari/360-modena/bodywork-lighting/pneumatics-actuator-system-40643 Again, the solenoid valves are nowhere near $400 each. Perhaps you could clarify with your tech what the Ferrari part number is.
I would ask for the Ferrari part numbers so you can double check. Tank won't fill is caused by either broken evap valves or a full charcoal canister, not from fuel pump issues. The Evap system is a GM/Delphi sourced system - the $300 Ferrari charcoal canister is shared with several GM products of the late 1990s and can be purchased for about $90 without the prancing horse on it. Same for the Evap valves. They are very simple one-way valves.
Thanks for the additional info.. For now I've asked the mechanic to order the valves and do the job, despite the fact that I may be getting ripped off considerably this time. I did choose a mechanic that was recommended by many others here in Fchat in the Norcal forum... so that is the "trust" I am going on here.. Even getting the part #s from him is not trivial, as he stated "I ordered them through Ferrari based on the vin number and the assembly number of your car" and so it seems he doesn't have the exact part numbers... I've asked him to share the part #s/photo of the parts when they arrive..
Almost certain to be the roll over valves at the top of the fuel tanks. Hard to access on a spider, easy to access on a Modena. The valves are expensive, however there's an o-ring under them which leaks (there's a newer more reliable seal in green colour) and it's a very cheap part. Old valves are prone to going brittle and cracking too, and can break on removal. Not a bad idea to replace all 4, you don't want a fuel leak in that area.
Mechanic has ordered the parts and is still waiting for them to arrive, car is still at the shop. I asked him to send me pics of parts when they arrive and will post when I get them..
Do you know specific GM vehicles, or GM part numbers, that share the 360 canister? Sent from my SM-G781U using FerrariChat.com mobile app
Parts came in and I have the car back! This is what they look like. Each valve is a different shape. On the paperwork from the mechanic they are referred to as both "EVAP float valves" and "Tank float valve"... He mentioned the plug into the fuel tanks and the EVAP system. So I think these are indeed the "rollover valves" as mentioned here.. Will need to get some miles in and monitor how the car is doing now, haven't had a chance to drive it much yet. Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
Thanks for the follow-up. I see two of these valves sitting on top of the fuel tanks (parts 9 & 7) https://www.eurospares.co.uk/parts/ferrari/360-modena/fuel-system/fuel-pumps-and-pipes-40645 “complete float valve” For some reason, the N. American versions of these valves are 4 times the price of non-N. American
Hey, going back to this discussion to see if that fixed the smell issue. Did that solve the issue? I really love the Ferrari officials who charge USD 80 for 4 seals that can be found online (Eurospares) for GBP 2.40 each LOL.
