Euro 7 emissions equal death of V12 ??

Published by an industry electric website; so I wonder what side of the discussion they sit and news stories they will promote?

I must admit to becoming seriously bored with the “ev is THE answer” to all transport pollution problems band wagon.

Fortunately reality will catch up with them at some stage. Just unfortunate that with a more intelligent debate we could achieve so much more with respect to minimising environmental damage from transportation than we will in the timescales!

 

Ev will indeed have its place. Honestly they are pretty much the perfect commuter vehicle if you average around 100 miles per day in your car. In large densely populated areas they are a no brainer.

That said, the gas car is still the better choice for those living and working in more rural areas. Farmers, construction compaines, and I can see the police and fire services still relying on gas powered equipment for a very long time.

The shipping industry will not be going electric anytime soon either. Aircraft..not sure I would ever set foot in an electric aircraft. The sound of the big jet engines purring away gives me a sense of security.

Our older gas powered cars are safe for now, but driving them downtown may not be allowed. But who on earth gets any kind of fun from a performance car being locked in city traffic anyway?

 

My round trip commute is only 4 miles and there's no way I'd want to do it in an electric car. My hot hatch daily driver is a riot (the exhaust note and manual shifting being an indispensable part of the fun) and the drive to and from work is usually the best part of the day.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if they either don't teach that anymore or greatly de-emphasize it b/c it is an convenient truth for their narrative.

 

You have completely forgotten that there are other people on this planet who use a car like an appliance. They have zero interest in making zoom zoom noises on the way to work. In fact those people are the majority.

 

So what? It's nothing new that driving enthusiasts aren't the majority.
You have completely forgotten that none of that makes an electric car an ideal commuter car for me.

 

Really? You are quite self centered aren't you. These compaines do not care about you or your zoom zoom noises. The governing bodies dont care about your zoom zoom noises either. Get a grip man. You are not the only person on the planet.

 

Back in the early 70’s the EPA started with all these exhaust regulations and after 73 the performance of the automobile diminished tremendously but the manufacturer developed better engines to meet the requirements and today we have cars making 600+ hp with out doing anything too them and the aftermarket Industryis at a all time high so with all the new laws coming no manufacture is going to Lie down and die they will fill the gap and continue making products for the consumer purchase
It might not be the 12v but a. Alternate maybe a inline 4 or v6-8’s with hybrid making 1000hp lol ether the automotive industry is still and will always be the driving force behind all economies and all governments know with out cars on the roads “a lot less TAXs collected” which means less jobs etc


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With the EU "Euro 7" regulations they apparently plan on regulation of trace elements and ICE can not exist because any emissions at all will be impossible (not to mention CO2 output). You cannot make an ICE engine w/o emissions...of some type

The main "saving grace" is the fact that there is very little pure EV production in the big scheme of things and it takes time to scale up battery manufacturing, so even the most optimistic projections are maybe 10m pure EV production per year by 2028...between the EU and USA there are over 500m cars/light trucks currently in-use, so at 10m per year, would take 50 years just to "turn over" the existing fleet but one time, not to mention there are over somewhere around 30M+ new cars/light trucks sold per year...

Not even going to get into other issues such as lack of charging, etc, because no matter what, production simply will not be there for decades if ever (depending on raw materials required and those supply chains to make batteries and the electric motors which rely upon rare earths (magnets,etc))

Either ICE is 'going nowhere fast' -or- the actual plan is to eliminate personal transportation options, which is one of the EU's stated goals...

new Euro 7/VII standards will contribute to a modal shift from car-based cities to walking, cycling, and public transport

from:

https://epha.org/new-euro7-standards-the-final-nail-in-the-coffin-for-polluting-vehicles/

 

Reality will kick in some time.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/02/porsche-investing-24-million-in-e-fuels-for-traditional-sports-cars.html

Toyota’s CEO statements just before Xmas are also worth seeking out. A voice of common sense in a world of politicians and hype.

 

The 'eFuels' will never work, creating fuel in Chile and shipping it to the EU? At what price? I heard $30/gallon and unless there is a captive market it will never work...not to mention terrestrial transport by tanker, but how, what 'gas stations', it's highly unlikely to ever amount to anything as it has no ability to scale to the current levels of gasoline production and use...

https://theicct.org/blog/staff/e-fuels-will-not-save-ice

 

E-fuels or synthetic fuels are for sure the only feasible way looking forward. I expect Ferrari to join the Porsche path sooner or later.

 

The population of the Earth has tripled in my lifetime.

 

Distribution will be very difficult if ever tried and I thought more oriented, at least from Porsche's perspective, for maintaining their new car production...not classics/collector...as the issue is regarding emissions of CO2, but, e-fuels will go no where at all because Euro-7 will likely, quite likely, only allow zero-emissions vehicles at some point in the near future for 'new' registrations.

 

A carbon neutral vehicle will be more environmentally friendly than an electric vehicle.

 

Apparently these emission changes are "agenda driven" not "reality driven"...unfortunate in many ways. But I believe reality will prevail, just not sure when.

 

Great for them. And the car enthusiast really is a tiny fraction of the average car owner. So let the average person drive EV's, whether they like the fact they're quite or believe that the EV is green.

Why must the car enthusiast be punished? Factually speaking, a Ferrari is far more environmentally friendly than any mass production car on the road (whether it's a diesel Golf, a hybrid or some kind of EV). When a mass production car is 15 or so years old and something breaks that costs more than a few grand to fix, the cars gets picked up and thrown into the salvage yard, waiting till inevitably get crushed (this last part is a bit more difficult for hybrid/EV's because the battery needs to be discarded in an environmental way).

A Ferrari (for example) will keep going forever. When an expensive part breaks, it'll get fixed. Unless there is a catastrophic failure (i.e. a crash beyond recognition), a Ferrari will not end up in a salvage yard or crusher. Even when they do, every last usable part will get taken off and reused on another Ferrari.

When Ferrari is forced to go full electric, will it be the same? I've got sincere doubts. For sure batteries will still need to be changed every so often so there is that. And that battery will need to be manufactured at great expense, with the old one discarded also at a significant expense. I don't think an EV Ferrari will have anywhere close to the love and want an ICE Ferrari has, so I could see an EV Ferrari end up in the scrapyard after ~20-30 years of use.

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The sensible answer should be, for manufacturers such as Ferrari, to allow some leeway. Sure, for them to be carbon neutral in production by protecting forests for example. But to take Ferrari's heart away and replace it with batteries will quite simply kill the company.

 

Interesting article; but their arguments are clearly blinkered and thus flawed.

They clearly state the only solution is for all cars to be electric. This is not possible; everybody knows this.

Similarly they comment on the energy cost of the process and demand for renewable energy. Elon Musk recently stated that it will take 20 years for cars to be all electric and electricity demand in the world will double as a result! Robbing Peter to pay Paul springs to mind.

I also didn’t see anything in the article about fuels for planes, ships, heavy industry, agriculture etc, non of which will work on electric. Some fringe bits will but the majority won’t.

And let’s not forget that petroleum is an integral part of our world, every plastic component, your car interior, tyres, seals, lubricants, packaging, computer monitor, tv etc etc. The drive for electric cars, whilst very valid in some market sectors, will not stop petroleum production completely.

So, let’s get a balanced, real view and those maximise investment, opportunity and thus maximise emissions. Band wagons will only minimise what’s possible.

All that said; the real issue is as pointed out by Solid State; population growth.

 

You’re talking with too much common sense. Politicians will have a hard time grasping these points. I completely agree!

 

A few years ago guy from the major oil company showed me (at the time it was already old) presentation, with their predictions how will car engines develop in future. It showed a transition from ICE (2013), through different levels of hybrid engines - from "big" 4-banger with small eletric unit (2018) to plug-in high-voltage electric engine with all sorts of ERS's and small auxillary 2-cylinder ICE unit running on syntetic mix of fuels (2050).
And that was important for this company, because they have planned their strategy, research and future products on those predictions.