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Diagnosing convertible top: clicking noise only.

Discussion in '348/355' started by ready321now, May 27, 2014.

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  1. ready321now

    ready321now Formula Junior

    Jan 5, 2013
    484
    New Jersey
    #1 ready321now, May 27, 2014
    I have searched the forum and have not been able to pick up from where I have left off with my convertible top issue. I am almost at the point of converting it to manual but figured I would give it one last shot. So here are my symptoms:

    with the handbrake on and the windows down and with the key in the forward position (or if the car is on) I click the emergency switch and it only makes a clicking noise. I have checked the 2 fuses near the hydraulics and they are okay. When I open the top with my hand it makes a beeping sound as it should.

    my passenger seat does move electronically but the back of the seat will not recline when using the handle on the side of the seat nor will it move forward... it seems to be locked in place. I still get that beep so I am led to believe that it is not the passenger seat. if all I hear is a click when I press the button what does that mean? I checked the hydraulic fluid level and it looks fine.

    at this point any feedback would be appreciated because I feel like I've tried everything and I am still completely lost on why I just get a click everytime I press the button.... but no action.
     
  2. WATSON

    WATSON Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Sep 9, 2010
    23,505
    WI
    #2 WATSON, May 27, 2014
    Last edited: May 27, 2014
    Well, I can offer a little bit anyway.

    The top emergency switch will simply run the pump. It by passes the ECU and all the safety steps in window placement and seat alignment.

    In short, you can break a window and cut the leather in the seat or hack the plastic on the seat belt holder by operating this switch without manually placing things in the safety spot.

    The fact that you can move the switch and get a clicking sound tells me that the switch works and the relay that operates the motor is working (the click). Obviously the fuse is operating as well (FYI, sitting the drivers seat and looking forward, the fuse on the L/H side is the power seat fuse. The fuse on the R/H side is top pump fuse.

    Sooooo the next component in line is the top motor for the pump.

    If it were me, I would open everything up and find the power lead to the motor and hook a 12 volt source directly to the pump to see if it operates. I actually have an old heavy duty electric train transformer (with forward & reverse) to test stuff like this.

    If the motor works, then you have a wire harness problem and need to find the fault between the relay and motor.

    If the motor doesn't work...well, then it is broken :)
     
  3. WATSON

    WATSON Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Sep 9, 2010
    23,505
    WI
    #3 WATSON, May 27, 2014
    Then again....some more thoughts:

    What click do you here? The mechanical click of the switch or the click from the relay?

    You do know there are two switches on the emergency switch panel right? One for up, one for down.

    I would check the fuse holder. Mine was pretty wide open and that fuse would slop around in there with intermittent contact.

    I would also swap in a new relay....unlikely, but you might as well try it. I think (please check) that the seat relay is the same as the top relay so just swapping them would tell you a lot. In fact after the swap, try the seats again. Your drivers side seat issue could be the relay.
     
  4. ready321now

    ready321now Formula Junior

    Jan 5, 2013
    484
    New Jersey
    #4 ready321now, May 27, 2014
    Thanks for the feedback, much appreciated, Watson. So I swapped the relays, which are identical. The fuses seem secure. The click I hear is the relay working. As far as the passenger seat, it does not recline but it does move forward and back via the switch. The driver's seat is fine in all aspects.

    I have no idea where to start looking for the power wire to the motor since I cannot find a wiring diagram in the CD manuals. Any ideas on how to track down the power wire for the motor? I suppose checking that is definitely the next step, as you suggest.
     
  5. WATSON

    WATSON Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Sep 9, 2010
    23,505
    WI
    #5 WATSON, May 27, 2014
    According to my wiring diagram for my 1998 Spider the two wires form the Soft Top Control Motor (01235) are L-4 (blue) & B-4 (white).

    Sorry, misunderstood your seat situation. The handle is just a mechanical fix....
     
  6. ready321now

    ready321now Formula Junior

    Jan 5, 2013
    484
    New Jersey
    #6 ready321now, May 28, 2014
    do you recall which section of the manual show this diagram?thanks again I'm trying to look for it now...
     

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  7. eyboro

    eyboro Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    May 30, 2004
    989
    Chicago
    Full Name:
    Eitan
    #7 eyboro, May 29, 2014
    Check the bleeder screw by the emergency switch, make sure it's not open, also check the hydraulic fluid level.
     
  8. Carbuilder

    Carbuilder Formula Junior

    Aug 18, 2012
    550
    Bolton, ON
    Full Name:
    Rick
    #8 Carbuilder, May 29, 2014
    Read the original post again ("I checked the hydraulic fluid level and it looks fine"). Also, the bleed screw would not cause the motor to not run. It would still run (and you will hear it) it just won't put out any pressure.
     
  9. WATSON

    WATSON Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Sep 9, 2010
    23,505
    WI
    #9 WATSON, May 29, 2014
    The wiring diagrams are not readily available. There is a partial one in one of of the service manual download sites, but that is for a 1995 car.

    After a year of searching, I managed to bribe a Ferrari dealership one Saturday morning with a promise not to distribute...felt more like a drug deal than a copying session. haha.
     
  10. Carbuilder

    Carbuilder Formula Junior

    Aug 18, 2012
    550
    Bolton, ON
    Full Name:
    Rick
    #10 Carbuilder, May 29, 2014
    If you look at vol 3 of the downloaded 355 workshop manual, there is a section on "soft top (Spider)". There are wiring diagrams there, but they do not have the color coding. Looking at the motor and relay details you can figure out which relay contacts lead to the motor. That's what I did (put 12V on those contacts) to make sure the motor was working.

    Rick
     

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