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Dashboard lights

Discussion in 'Boxers/TR/M' started by C1C7M, Sep 23, 2018.

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  1. C1C7M

    C1C7M Karting

    Jun 11, 2018
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    While driving with the headlights up/on tonight, my dashboard lights went out suddenly (speedo, tach, temp, etc.). They were illuminated fine before and there was no warning (such as flickering, etc.) before they went out. The gages themselves continue to work fine, they just weren’t lit up orange anymore. In the past when this has happened on other cars I’ve owned, it was due to the light dimmer switch inadvertently getting turned all the way down, but no such switch was found (car is newer to me – FYI). This is an ’86 TR. Any ideas?
     
  2. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

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    I also would say the dimmer if there is all other working. otherwise may be a blown fuse
    when you have the miles counter in the center console then there are 2 knobs, one for the clock and the other is the dimmer.
     
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  3. jgmblair

    jgmblair Formula Junior
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    #3 jgmblair, Sep 24, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2018
    Do you have a copy of he wiring diagrams in the WSM? Message me your email address. I see you are relatively new here, I also have an 86, post some pictures of your car would love to see it.
    Cheers
     
  4. ago car nut

    ago car nut F1 Veteran
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    The rheostat that controls the instrument lights is behind the tachometer. This sometimes gets oxidized and the lights go out. You have to disassemble and clean the surface with a pencil eraser.
     
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  5. flash32

    flash32 F1 Veteran

    Aug 22, 2008
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    Check the fuse ..If blown I would bet on struts of rear bonnet are shorted .. or dome light in engine is shorted

    Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk
     
  6. C1C7M

    C1C7M Karting

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    Thanks to all who responded.

    This was helpful in locating the dimmer switch, but the switch did nothing.

    I don't have a copy--will do.

    This is a great idea. Is there a thread with steps on completing this or do you have any basic tips to getting the project started?

    The fuse was checked. It looked fine, but I changed it anyway--nothing.
     
  7. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Jan 11, 2001
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    Are you saying that the dash and central tunnel instrument lights are not working, but the rear parking lights (and rear side running lights, if present) are working?

    Also, what version TR? US, euro, GB, etc.?
     
  8. C1C7M

    C1C7M Karting

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    That’s correct—the dash and central tunnel lights do not work (except the digital clock). The brake and reverse lights work fine, as do the headlights and fog lights, but not the side running lights. The car is an early US spec TR (‘86 single mirror).
     
  9. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
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    That combination (no instrument lights and no side lights) is what would happen if fuse #13 was blown. If you are sure fuse #13 is OK:

    Remove fuse #13, rotate the headlight stalk knob to "on", and measure the voltage from each female terminal in the fuse #13 socket to the negative battery post. One of them should be at +12V DC. If not, the suspicion would move upstream to the ...006 relay with the "K" on it (Outside lights control relay - of which there is only one so not easy to do a test swap). If you do have +12V at one of the female terminals in the fuse #13 socket for the conditions described, give a shout back and we can try some voltage measurements at the ...006 relay socket (unless you've got a spare ...006 relay lying around ;)).
     
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  10. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Mistyped. Should've written: "If you do not have +12V at one of the female terminals in the fuse #13 socket...". If you do have +12V there, but don't have the dash and side lights with a good fuse #13 = would require multiple downstream problems so doesn't seem likely.
     
  11. C1C7M

    C1C7M Karting

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    Thanks for the follow-up. I’ll take a look tonight and report back. It may not matter, but I’ll mention that the dash lights to either side side of the speedo & tach (such as parking brake on, hood ajar icon) do work.
     
  12. C1C7M

    C1C7M Karting

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    #12 C1C7M, Sep 25, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2018
    One more thing I’ll throw out there for what it’s worth, the car has the Dave Helms fuse box installed.
     
  13. C1C7M

    C1C7M Karting

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    UPDATE: Checked fuse #13 and it had in fact blown. Changed it and the instrument cluster lights up again. Thanks to Steve for pointing this out. The confusion was in the fuse diagram in the manual. It seems to list 2 “instrument” fuses, but one conspicuously so (#22?) and the other not (#13)

    However, when referencing the fuse diagram on the back of the fuse box door, it is clearer. But what is not clear is why said diagram lists a 7.5 amp fuse for #13 whereas mine had a 10 amp installed. (I swapped it out for another 10 amp). Any ideas on why this is so? Should it be changed to a 7.5 amp?
     
  14. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

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    I would change to a .7.5 A
    but may be someone add something to this fuse and because of this changed to 10 A?

    good that we have steve here in the forum - our absolutly electric specialist :)
     
  15. lear60man

    lear60man Formula 3

    May 29, 2004
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    This issue is not uncommon. Rear deck lid grounds out and #13 fuse blows usually after a pot hole jolt.
     
  16. C1C7M

    C1C7M Karting

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    A stereo amp and CD changer have been added but otherwise the car is pretty much stock. As mentioned, the fuse box is the upgraded Dave Helms unit, and so perhaps this is the reason for the difference. The #13 fuse isn’t the only one that mismatches its amp rating relative to the diagram. There is at least one other.
     
  17. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #17 Steve Magnusson, Sep 26, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2018
    That's good that you (and I) don't have to go hunting a Gremlin ;), but now you'll need to check if the RH rear bonnet gas spring body has a wear scar on it (and do something about it) as lear60man indicated (try a search on "wear scar" for prior threads with pictures). Another possibility that can blow fuse #13 is the license plate bulb wiring touching a hot exhaust pipe and melting thru the insulation so that's another place to check.

    Using a larger fuse in position #13 will give some more margin to the fuse blowing if the short-to-ground event is quick (fuses are really a "current x time" thermal devices) so maybe Dave thought it a prudent thing to do. IME, if the trouble is the RH gas spring occasionally banging into the rear bonnet edge, the wear scar in the paint on both surfaces gets more and more "clean" so the contact get better and better; therefore, a 10A fuse might give some relief initially but not later. AFAIK, the Helm's modifications would have no effect on the amount of current in fuse #13, and having a 10A fuse there isn't a disaster, but it should work with a 7.5A fuse (if, for example, you solve the real problem by bending the lower RH gas spring mount outward by a few mm or adding some shrink tubing to cover the gas spring body).
     
  18. ago car nut

    ago car nut F1 Veteran
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    Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login It seems you sorted your problem. But for any body that wants to clean the oxidation off the dimmer rheostat on the rear of the tachometer. or remove the gauge pod to change light bulbs etc. Here are a few tips: Put the steering column in the complete downward position, a 7 mm nut removes the trim panel. You need a 1/4" drive extension and universal joint. After you remove the trim panel you have access to the two 10mm nuts that secure the gauge pod. Disconnect the three wire connectors under dash: 2 white and one tan. After removing the 10 mm nuts swing the gauge pod up and out. The washer that is under the 7 mm nut, cut it in half, then the next time you don't need to remove the nut completely. It is a real bear to thread the nut back on. The black box is the dimmer. Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  19. C1C7M

    C1C7M Karting

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    Thanks for posting. These instructions will come in handy.
     
  20. C1C7M

    C1C7M Karting

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    Ok, checked the RH gas strut and found these marks. Is heat shrink tubing still the prescribed fix?
     

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  21. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
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    I preferred to bend the lower RH gas spring mount outward a few mm (by removing the lower gas spring end and then giving the "ball" end mount a few gentle whacks with the sledge hammer to bend the flange welded to the chassis ;)) as this gives no evidence of modification, but others have reported that using the shrink tubing works too.
     
  22. C1C7M

    C1C7M Karting

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    Two good options, thanks!
     
  23. C1C7M

    C1C7M Karting

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    UPDATE. I just turned the dash lights back on for the 3rd time since replacing the fuse, but this time they flickered briefly and went back out. Apparently the heat shrink tubing on the RH has spring isn’t the fix. I’ll look at the license plate bulb wiring in a bit, but what is the best way to repair / alter it, assuming that it is touching the exhaust?
     
  24. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

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    before you think over how to repair you may have a look what is the problem. not sure that it is from the license palte bulb
     
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  25. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
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    No specific advise about repairing/rerouting the license plate bulb wiring if it needs fixing -- usually just a tie-wrap or two to ensure it doesn't touch anything hot. With regard to the RH gas spring wear scar, you can just unplug the yellow wire from the bottom end male tab to take it completely out of the (electrical) picture for sure as a final test -- unplugging it would only disable the underbonnet engine lights that only come "on" when the lights are "on" and the engine bonnet is raised so all the external lights should still work like normal. If the #13 fuse still blows with it unplugged, then you know that you have to look elsewhere.
     
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