Boxer wheels | FerrariChat

Boxer wheels

Discussion in 'Boxers/TR/M' started by boxerman, May 28, 2004.

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  1. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    #1 boxerman, May 28, 2004
    Anyone tried different wheels on a Boxer. Seems like 16 inch would be similar profile to orgional with the opportunity for much better tires, especialy for track fun.
     
  2. atheyg

    atheyg Guest

    #2 atheyg, May 29, 2004
    Dave F put some 17" on his 365, he's on the other site f-talk.
     
  3. boxerboy

    boxerboy Karting

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    #3 boxerboy, Jun 2, 2004
    I had ordered a set of modular 17" wheels from SL Comp out of "Forza" mag. Had issues and sent them back. I am expecting a new set of 17" wheels with splined centers from Kinesis, same magazine. Am mounting Michelin Pilot Sports, expect them to transform the car. If you want more info, [email protected].
     
  4. msdesignltd

    msdesignltd F1 World Champ
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    #4 msdesignltd, Jun 3, 2004
    Just My Opinion, Enzo would roll over in his Grave knowing you altered his perfection.
    Kind of like Julia Roberts getting a leg transplant from Dom Delouise
     
  5. boxerboy

    boxerboy Karting

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    #5 boxerboy, Jun 4, 2004
    Really, the issue with many older cars, not just Ferrari's, is that tires are no longer available in the correct sizes AND appropriate speed ratings. An H speed rating cannot be used on any Ferrari safely, unless all you are doing is trailering the car from show to show. It's only getting worse, not better. To get the correct speed ratings, you need to up the wheel size to match currently available tires. We are fortunate that some suppliers make wheels to fit spline drive cars in the current sizes. Besides, the original wheels remain with the car.
     
  6. Ferrari_UK

    Ferrari_UK Formula 3

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    #6 Ferrari_UK, Jun 4, 2004
    You could try these :)
     
  7. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    #7 boxerman, Jun 4, 2004
    From experience there are two realities to boxer wheels. On the street they are OK, but after a bit of experience pushing out of tightish corners at
    70-80 you can get the whole car crabbing sideways, so the lower limits with stock tires are ok, and probably provde some of the challenge and fun, but they are also reputedly hard riding and require pressure in the high 30s for really alive steering limiting what you can do with shocks or ride.

    The bigger reality is these cars are hard to really enjoy on the street in the Northeast. My one experience on the track showed serious limitations to the stock Michelin tires. In hard cornering they felt like they wanted to peel off the rims and turned to melted gum. They are also expensive to replace, so to really drive as Enzo intended I think some newer wheels and tires will probably give a better ride and superior roadholding, with the opportunity to play on the track as well. Or origional wheels can be for street and others for track, after all Ferrari did it with the BBLM.

    Newer wheels and tires gives the opportunity for more fun, ie the track. People change their exhausts to enhance the car in a way regulation did not allow the factory, wheels are a similar improvement and as long as not chromed out monsters dont affect the look. after all the 288gto had aftermarket split type rims to take advantage of newer tyre technology for a small production run.

    The real question is how does a boxer ride with newer wheeels and what are the suspensiuon settings, a big question because Ferrari certainly made a number of changes from the bb to bbI in order to handle the newer tyres at the time.

    Then of course there are brakes, but a pad upgrade does wonders.
     
  8. henryk

    henryk Formula Junior

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    #8 henryk, Jun 4, 2004
    As a Boxer owner, I too, would like to find a "reasonable" alternative to the metric wheels.........something that can accept std type tires. Coker sells the original for $400 each, and the rears don't last that long.

    I don't track the Boxer, since I think it is just too heavy........close to 4,000lbs, with fluids, driver and necessary upgrades. I feel the cost of upgrades........suspension, brakes, wheels, etc. would be rather high. And, of course, one still runs the risk of damage to the car. I think it would be better to just buy a true "track" car........like the Lotus Elise.......and enjoy the Boxer for what it is.........a fine cruising car!!!!!!
     
  9. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    #9 boxerman, Jun 4, 2004
    I agree the boxer is a bit heavy for the track. But would love to try it at some FCA events like Pocono where there is room to run. I agree the car is excellent even cruising with a burst here and there. Boxer is alo a great car to wring out as it comes reall alive at 9/10ths pace. The question is where. I agree a track chews up a car but it is a last resort for some real running.
     
  10. msdesignltd

    msdesignltd F1 World Champ
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    #10 msdesignltd, Jun 4, 2004
    FERRARI PARTS: Testarossa & Boxer custom-built wheels 17" & 18". Ferrari 348 four taillight conversion kit. Speedline/BBS modular wheels 18" & 19" for 575/550/360. Carbon fiber wing for 348/355/360/550/F40. Challenge wheels for 360 Modena & 360 Challenge. Forged magnesium wheels for F40. Ferrari factory wheels & custom-built wheels made for most cars, 308/328, Mondial, etc. FERRARI PARTS: Testarossa & Boxer custom-built wheels 17" & 18". Ferrari 348 four taillight conversion kit. Speedline/BBS modular wheels 18" & 19" for 575/550/360. Carbon fiber wing for 348/355/360/550/F40. Challenge wheels for 360 Modena & 360 Challenge. Forged magnesium wheels for F40. Ferrari factory wheels & custom-built wheels made for most cars, 308/328, Mondial, etc. 10/03
    www.GaRedcars.com, 478-929-9454 (GA)

    found this add in fml
     
  11. GaryReed

    GaryReed F1 Rookie

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    #11 GaryReed, Jun 4, 2004
    I've looked into buying aftermarket wheels for my Boxer and may ending up ordering a set when my TRX tires start getting worn down some.

    Compomotive Wheels makes a nice looking one that they can custom machine to fit the Boxer center lock hubs. It looks very similiar to a 288 GTO wheel. They will make a set in England and then ship to their US distributor.

    http://www.usacomp.com/ts.htm

    Their 17-inch "TS" three piece wheels (8" wide fronts, 10" wide rears) are apx. $2,000 for a set of four. Very reasonable price.

    If anyone is interested, write to Norris Boyd at Compomotive Wheels USA. He's been very helpful in answering all of my questions about Boxer wheels. [email protected]
     
  12. atheyg

    atheyg Guest

    #12 atheyg, Jun 4, 2004
    My 512BB has stock 15" wheels and Pirellis are on them.
     
  13. boxerboy

    boxerboy Karting

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    #13 boxerboy, Jun 6, 2004
    "henryk" Coker may have the fronts, ie 215 70 vr15, but they haven't had the rears in over 12 months. As I said 2 days ago, the tires just aren't available that we need in the speed ratings that won't kill us. I spent over 2 months looking in the US and Europe, and they aren't there anymore. Michelin may spit out some more xwx's, but with ferrari F1 team on Bridgestone's, I wouldn't hold my breath. If you doubt me,call Coker and ask them if they bought the xwx molds from Michelin [current rumor], they will tell you "no" The only alternative appears to be newer wheels 17" or 18" with current tires, save the orig wheels for shows. Also, someone else mentioned GAREDCARS.com, an ad in Forza. I will not injure a business's reputation on the web, but if you are considering garedcars [aka SL comp], get hold of me at [email protected]
     
  14. atheyg

    atheyg Guest

    #14 atheyg, Jun 6, 2004

    I think a BB or 365 would make a good track car, the BB weighs in at 3080 dry,massive instant torque from the flat 12 and in addition its dry sump would do well, my BB also has modded Brembo cross drilled brakes also, the prob is extremely expensive and unobtainium parts if you crash it so its not worth the risk.

    Where did all the extra weight come from on the BBi's?
     
  15. henryk

    henryk Formula Junior

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    #15 henryk, Jun 6, 2004
    Boxerboy,

    The BBi has only one size tire........240/55 VR 415 TRX. These are metric. The tires you quote are 215/70 VR 15, seems to be standard type US tires!!!!!

    The Coker web sited has these for $399 each.
     
  16. henryk

    henryk Formula Junior

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    #16 henryk, Jun 6, 2004
    atheyg,

    The manual states the BBi weighs 3484 lbs. I don't know if they are referring to dry, or wet weight. If wet, then add a driver and related safety items, and one will approach 3700-3800 lbs...........quite a lot, IMO, for racing. If dry, then, one will approach the 4,000 lb mark. It seems that tracked Boxers, as like the Daytonas, have a big problem with braking. I attribute this to the excess weight.

    I wonder what they did to make the BBi 400 lbs heavier than the BB??????? Sure is hard to tell, just by looking at the cars.
     
  17. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    #17 boxerman, Jun 7, 2004
    I put new rotors, the old ones were shot and too thin to grind, and aftermarket pads on my boxer. Have not tried it on the track with this setup, but the difference on the street is huge, car has more braking power than tires.
     
  18. Frank R. Masiarz

    Frank R. Masiarz Karting

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    #18 Frank R. Masiarz, Jun 7, 2004
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Hi..........

    The 15-inch and metric wheels on the Boxer severely limit tire choice. See attachment for some old ideas. Note that the old V speed rating is equivalent to the new H speed rating, as of 1991. Check the Tire Rack site for information on speed ratings and tire care.

    One major problem: the typical need to "scavenge" the splined hubs from the Ferrari wheels for transplantation into the new wheels. Any supplier with a set of Boxers wheels "with hubs" should be a popular supplier.

    Questions for Boxerman or anyone with a new brake system on their Boxer. Don't keep them a secret....what rotors and which brake pads ?? Did you need new calipers too ?? Will these brake system upgrades "fit" inside the old Ferrari wheels or only new ones ??

    Frank........23005
    www.masiarz.net/bb_resource
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  19. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    #19 boxerman, Jun 7, 2004
    The new rotors were stock, the old ones were warped and just shot. The new rotors were nitrided which supposedly helps. The pads came from California, I dont remember where and were some kevelar type, they fit the origional calipers which were rebuilt. One consequence of the new braking power was the realisation that the front end in general needed a rebuild as the braking rorce overcame all the slightly worn bits and made the car squirilly under hard braking.

    Basicaly I got the car in 1993 and changed belts etc. From 1998 onwards everything started to get renewed, suspension, brakes, steering clutch all hoses etc. Did a thorough engine out six months ago. Essentialy the car drives significantly better than when I got it. Boxers can run great if maintained like an aircraft.

    Interestingly when run against a Daytona throuh the top of 4th gear the cars run neck and neck. Above about 50mph it is a slow run away from a 355, seems having less gears to shift and more tourque does the trick.
    I have also found huge performance differences based on how the injection is setup, and weather conditions. Running right the car is awesome, but on a hot day with the engine running rich it is a sluggish beast.

    From my experience i can say that on the right day when the car is feeling happy its simply awesome. I have read that boxers are not Ferrari's best. Certainly theyre not the most acessibile or easy to drive properly. However if theyre set up right they are fast and can really do the job provided the driver is totaly comitted and ready to push, a freind once said that it is a car you have to grab by the scruff of the neck and really wring out, you can find yourself going slower than most cars and still be working hard or you can just really go for it all the way, the car will let you know what going on as everyone else gets falls behind, of course youll be mentaly shot at the end. Its a car of comittment, comitted maintanance and totaly comitted driving As fast as a Daytona with the ability to handle a variety of curves so it can be fun below 80. Its a car for really pressing on, everything comes together and the car just sings. Below 4000rpm the response is sluggish the ride rough and you wonder why youre there. Above that the muisic starts to play.

    And no I don't abuse it. Its properly maintained has its orgional paint, the engine and car all run better at speed, even the ac works when it has good airflow. Would like to take it to the silver state classic in Nevada and really see what a boxer will do on the right day on the right road. In the meantime some new wheels and tires would help out for some track fun. It may not be the best on the track but as an old Italian motorcycle rider once told me its not only how fast you go but als how you go fast.
     
  20. atheyg

    atheyg Guest

    #20 atheyg, Jun 7, 2004
    Questions for Boxerman or anyone with a new brake system on their Boxer. Don't keep them a secret....what rotors and which brake pads ?? Did you need new calipers too ?? Will these brake system upgrades "fit" inside the old Ferrari wheels or only new ones ??

    Frank........23005
    www.masiarz.net/bb_resource[/QUOTE]

    Since I just purchased the car I am still trying to figure it out,I am dealing with a clutch issue now as the car has been sitting 2 years since an engine out major and one of the discs may be stuck, but a PO spent about 25k on custom valved Koni shocks and new bushings along with the brake mods, I can definately see the cross drilled rotors not so sure on the calipers if they are stock or modded, once I find out more I'll let you guys know.
     
  21. henryk

    henryk Formula Junior

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    #21 henryk, Jun 7, 2004
    Gary,

    Thanks for the info.......I just sent Norris Boyd an e-mail about new wheels for my car.
     
  22. Frank R. Masiarz

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    #22 Frank R. Masiarz, Jun 8, 2004
    Hi...........

    The Boxer is indeed a beast in many ways, but "hence its appeal". Awesome acceleration through fourth gear to 145 miles per hour, with seemingly endless amounts of torque. However, in fifth gear, everything calms down, except for that wonderful sound at the rear.

    Boxers are heavy and were designed for autobahn work, not mountain roads with endless numbers of curves. The cars are subject to "off-throttle oversteer", which can result in a spin "into the weeds" at high speeds. As long as there is weight on the rear tires, they will provide traction and lateral acceleration. If you suddenly "unload" the rear end by releasing the throttle and transferring weight to the front end in a corner, the car may "rotate" suddenly and you will leave the pavement.

    Porsche has struggled with the problem for years with their rear-engine cars and this "at the limit" effect underscores the need for great tires on Boxers and a knowledge of vehicle dynamics at speed.

    Beware at open track events !!

    Frank.........23005
    www.masiarz.net/bb_resource
     
  23. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
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    #23 boxerman, Jun 8, 2004
    I know what you mean about lifoff throttle overstear. From experience at a track event I would say that just feathering the throttle at the extreme limit will put you into a big time spin necessitating new tires, assuming no collisions. On the street where you push less the warning signs are clear, and you can back off just before it goes. Essentialy though its best slow in fast out.

    The real problem is we don't have autobahn's here so one must make compromises, unless someone knows a good open stretch.
     

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