Barn find : need identification | Page 3 | FerrariChat

Barn find : need identification

Discussion in 'Bugatti' started by Olivier NAMECHE, Sep 14, 2009.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 29, 2006
    18,214
    Twin Cities
    Full Name:
    Tim Keseluk
    This IS the Bugatti site.

    Is there any other? ;)
     
  2. lazarus

    lazarus Rookie

    Dec 2, 2009
    28
    #52 lazarus, Dec 4, 2009
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2009
    Fritz and Hans Schlumph purchased the remaining cars and patterns from the Bugatti factory in the late sixties.After they were "expelled" to Switzerland the factory was taken over by the workers [illegally but with the conivance of the french goverment] The reserve stock at a warehouse in Malmasbach was taken under french police control and moved to "safe" storage.Eventually after the death of the two Schlumph brothers,Arlette Schlumph,who had never stopped fighting to get the property back,won her case in court.She was given loads of money and the reserve stock.Quite a lot of things had gone missing whilst in "safe" storage.Patterns were stolen and even complete cars.Bruno Vendiesse,Jack Braun Ruben,and Peter Mullen then bought everything.Peter got most of the Bugattis for his museum in the states.I was the only person interested in the prototype patterns and I bought them.Photos were always forbidden at the Bugatti factory.Of course very few people had cameras either.After the war it was worse,the company were doing military contract work for hispano and there was total secrecy around the development department making the T251 and T252.Fortunately the last boss of the prototype dept had a camera and did take photos inside.You will have to buy my Book....Surprisingly the workers in the factory were also not allowed to go into any dept where they were not working.Even Macoin [seen in one of my photos] a senior designer at the factory did not have right of access to the prototype dept.The photo that i showed here of the T252/3 chassis being built was taken inside the prototype dept by Roger Fellerath the last boss and also test driver.He did 25.000 KMs in the T252.
     
  3. lazarus

    lazarus Rookie

    Dec 2, 2009
    28
    When I said that the factory was taken over by the workers,I mean of course Schlumphs Museum in his old textile mill.
     
  4. Steveny360

    Steveny360 F1 Veteran

    Sep 5, 2007
    7,070
  5. tritone

    tritone F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 8, 2003
    6,864
    On the Rock
    Full Name:
    James
    lazarus - my hat is off to one who "puts his money where his mouth is". thank you for your posts and photos. please direct us to the 'Bugatti site' you refer to. and please also continue to post pictures as much as you wish!

    Tritone
     
  6. El Wayne

    El Wayne F1 World Champ
    Staff Member Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Aug 1, 2002
    18,043
    San Marino, CA
    Full Name:
    L. Wayne Ausbrooks
    I would imagine that John's referring to the forum at BugattiBuilder.
     
  7. lazarus

    lazarus Rookie

    Dec 2, 2009
    28
    your imagination is not letting you down.BugattiBuilder is indeed one of the Bugatti sites i frequent.Funny no one has asked me about my Ferrari.....
     
  8. lazarus

    lazarus Rookie

    Dec 2, 2009
    28
    #58 lazarus, Dec 4, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Well as you ask so nicely here are some photos of my new Type 73c engines,and also T73c005 running in at Goodwood.And lastly my T252 Colombo engine in my T252 replica.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  9. lazarus

    lazarus Rookie

    Dec 2, 2009
    28
    #59 lazarus, Dec 4, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  10. lazarus

    lazarus Rookie

    Dec 2, 2009
    28
    #60 lazarus, Dec 4, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  11. Il Vecchio

    Il Vecchio F1 Rookie

    Dec 27, 2007
    2,572
    Near Pasadena, CA
    Full Name:
    Peter B.
    IMO, it looks alot like the T50B...one of my favorites. J

    ust beautiful.
     
  12. Teenferrarifan

    Teenferrarifan F1 Rookie

    Feb 21, 2003
    3,098
    Media, PA
    Full Name:
    Erik
    I'll bite what is your Ferrari? Also, I read Bugatti Builder it is a great site and forum to visit.

    Erik
     
  13. lazarus

    lazarus Rookie

    Dec 2, 2009
    28
    I dont talk about it ! Just to say that I hated it and gave it away to my girlfriend,she did one small rally and hated it so she sold it.Iam afraid once you have played with Bugattis nothing else will do.
     
  14. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 29, 2006
    18,214
    Twin Cities
    Full Name:
    Tim Keseluk
    ROFL! I expected nothing less! :D
     
  15. lazarus

    lazarus Rookie

    Dec 2, 2009
    28
    #65 lazarus, Dec 5, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    To be fair,it had spent fifteen years of its life in a private museum in Denmark.As a consequence the rubber suspension bushes would have been in poor condition.But it was very low mileage and I was disapointed. I realise that it was the lowest of the low in Ferrari terms !!! Here is the lucky man who bought it. Diana is looking very glad to see the back of it !!
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  16. Carsleuth

    Carsleuth F1 Rookie

    Dec 22, 2006
    4,331
    Chicago/NYC
    Full Name:
    Dan C.
    #66 Carsleuth, Dec 5, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    :D
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  17. lazarus

    lazarus Rookie

    Dec 2, 2009
    28
    Sooooo ! Bugattis are more interesting than Ferraris.........LOL
     
  18. krisdisk

    krisdisk Formula Junior

    Mar 29, 2009
    500
    Flanders Belgium
    Full Name:
    Kris De Bruyne
    Not sure about that, but I gotta give it to you... these wooden patterns are GREAT! How do you make new pieces then? does it work with pressed sand too? Or do they pour melted aluminum in wooden patterns???
     
  19. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 29, 2006
    18,214
    Twin Cities
    Full Name:
    Tim Keseluk
    The patterns are used to form the sand mold.
     
  20. lazarus

    lazarus Rookie

    Dec 2, 2009
    28
    #70 lazarus, Dec 16, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Sand casting has been around since at least the time of the ancient egyptians.The exact methods used have not really changed much since then.At times horsehair and even cow dung have been used to stiffen up the sand over long lengths to keep it together during pouring of the hot metal.These days resin is mixed with the sand which sets off and holds it together.Yesterday I had cast in england one part of the Bugatti T251 engine.It is from the most complicated area in front of the engine.There is a drive out of the middle of the motor,on the right side is a scavange oil pump,then a pressure feed oil pump,oil filter/pressure relief valve,then a magneto.And on the left side is another scavange oil pump,then petrol pumps, a water pump and the second magneto.This is the most complicated Bugatti componant ever produced.People complained that the T251 was taking too long to make in 1954,I am not at all surprised that it took so long to design and make work.It is quite exquisite.I am missing some of the patterns for this assembly,and have to invent them.But now I have the middle [biggest bit] casting out of the five castings that make up the assembly.Not having the drawings is somewhat tiresome as well.But I will succeed.Here is the photo of this extraordinary part.PS.If any of you Italian car people recognise the little petrol pump on this photo,It is certainly Italian,I am trying to find some of them.Please let me know.Ta.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  21. Olivier NAMECHE

    Olivier NAMECHE F1 Veteran

    Aug 18, 2007
    5,079
    CANADA
    Full Name:
    Olivier
    It will stay as a crap where it is by now... the old lady is firm on her price... she remembered her late husband paying 350.000 FF so about 50.000 € !!!

    Finally I've negociated the Lambo alone...and the bench of cars will stay there. After all I spent so much time to find out where was that particular Islero these 3 last years calling people, sending letters, travelling so many times in France for nothing... I'm rewarded since I've discovered it !!!

    I will sent a "barn find" picture to one of this classic car magazine... after publication may be there will be someone less aggressive & more comprehensive that will tell me what was that car...

    BIG THANKS to Lazarus, are you living in Belgium ?
     
  22. lazarus

    lazarus Rookie

    Dec 2, 2009
    28
    Dear Olivier,If you join Bugatti builder.com you can send me a private message.I live in France 86430.This barnfind is interesting.It is made of steel,so was a serious company job.It does look very much like the strange bodied Bugatti's made at that time and shown on this site.But on a completely non bugatti chassis.I think that it should be restored,although I do not think it has any sort of Bugatti value.Usually when cars like this are discovered on Bugatti chassis,they get rebodied as "proper" Bugattis.My friend in Belgium [ RD'I in Bruxelles ] I am sure that you know who I mean,has a couple of similar later bodies put onto T57 chassis [ one is in glassfibre ] not pretty and so the bodies have been removed and RD'I has saved them as "art".I will be in Bruxelles tomorrow night for the preview evening for the Bugatti 100 ans at Autoworld.My T252 is there on display.Maybe we might meet? I like the Islero,my friend Peter Hampton had a 400 from 1963 I think and I always thought that was a stunning car [ although too much like a Volvo P 1800s ! ]
     
  23. krisdisk

    krisdisk Formula Junior

    Mar 29, 2009
    500
    Flanders Belgium
    Full Name:
    Kris De Bruyne
    that's true! Like finding a needle in a haystack. I'd love to go to the Bugatti exhibition in Brussels soon.
     
  24. James_Woods

    James_Woods F1 World Champ

    May 17, 2006
    12,755
    Dallas, Tx.
    Full Name:
    James K. Woods
    Yes, that is it - and there are a couple other pictures later in the thread. Doesn't one of them with the open hood show an 8 cylinder engine? Again, like others, I don't see how a straight 8 could fit into the engine bay of this abandoned car in question.
     
  25. James_Woods

    James_Woods F1 World Champ

    May 17, 2006
    12,755
    Dallas, Tx.
    Full Name:
    James K. Woods

Share This Page