Arizona Auction Results | Page 4 | FerrariChat

Arizona Auction Results

Discussion in 'Vintage Ferrari Market' started by billnoon, Jan 18, 2013.

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  1. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
    Honorary Owner

    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
    Full Name:
    Jim Glickenhaus
    Did the one off Maser sell?
     
  2. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
    Consultant

    Mar 4, 2005
    8,826
    ...its on the block today!
     
  3. billnoon

    billnoon Formula 3
    BANNED

    Aug 22, 2003
    1,176
    La Jolla, California
    Full Name:
    Bill Noon
    If you think Dino GTS Chair and Fare optioned cars have gotten pricey as of late, you should see where Dino 206s have gone. I bought one last week and had been trying for another that was a bit of a project car and seemed to be a fairly good deal. The owner and I met for dinner last night and he let me know he had sold her for $300K. That was $100K more than we had talked about less than a week ago and it was for a car needing considerable work bordering on a full restoration. I was initially shocked but then realized that historically the 206 usually had a premium over the GTS in any variation and likely still does today.

    A very, very derelict 300SL Gullwing in Texas without a drive train quietly sold to a client in German for just shy of $700K this past Summer. At the time, I was shocked. Not so much anymore.

    Many question sustainability of these types of prices. While individual models carry different formulas, a good one to reference currently is the 300SL Gullwing and Roadster market. You have a finite number of vehicles that come up for sale at any given time yet every year the pool of potential buyers grows by larger percent than those no longer interested in having such a machine. At the same time those wanting such a benchmark machine for a collection have the funds and do not have the patience to wait around for the odd deal that might or might not happen which translates to a steady rise in prices.

    My 300SL Gullwing client collector lists numbers more than 2000 people and I by no means reach and speak with every potential buyer that is out there. That is a larger potential pool than the number of vehicles actually built! I have a near constant client demand for such a car which last year meant nearly one 300SL coming and going through our doors to a new owner each month.

    The same can be said for a handful of other production cars. Porsche Speedsters and the 1973 Carrera RS 2.7 are another vehicle that is on many collectors wish lists and as such there remains more buyers than sellers which translates to a steady increase in prices.

    The saying "They are not making these cars any more" shouted out often by auctioneers is actually quite true and each year there are more individuals who would like to own a Speedster and an RS than there are cars for sale to satisfy their wants and needs.

    The model of what is happening is very similar to what occurred at the turn of the century in Paris circa 1900. You had a fairly large number of young and wealthy tourists who visited and came back home with souvenir artwork. I bet a fair number of fathers and mothers laughed hard when their children returned home from Paris with a Monet or Renoir and heard that they paid several hundred dollars for such foolish pieces.

    Cheers,

    Bill
     
  4. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
    Consultant

    Mar 4, 2005
    8,826
    Bill,
    let`s not talk about Monets, Renoirs, Picassos, Twomblys, Pollocks, etc...! Those masterworks only exist in one example. Compared to the prices paid for those paintings a 250GTO comes for pocket money!

    The 246 Dino in all versions is not a rare car. A beautiful car, yes, and every girl looooves it - but slow and -IMO- not the essence of what a Ferrari should be. Nice handling and sound - but not in the league of a V12 in full swing!

    It also does not make sense to compare it with the Mercedes 300SL Gullwing which was a true benchmark car and a milestone in automotive history.
    The Dino was nothing of that. A 250SWB, 275GTB, Daytonas are all iconic cars. The Dino only looks very nice....
     
  5. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
    Honorary Owner

    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
    Full Name:
    Jim Glickenhaus
    Comparing Art to Autos remains as silly as it always is. There are painting that have gone from $100 to 100 million USD during the exact same time that a 250 GTO went from 7K to 40 million dollars. There are paintings that are worth well more than a billion USD today.
     
  6. xs10shl

    xs10shl Formula 3

    Dec 17, 2003
    2,037
    San Francisco
    One additional consideration is the number and condition of Dinos for sale at any one time. If 1000 current Dino owners decide that $350,000 is the number they want to get for their cars, and all 1000 come to market at within the coming year, id think it's unlikely that everyone will get their price.
     
  7. BIRA

    BIRA Formula Junior

    Jun 15, 2007
    950
    I am not really looking closely at this market....but I cannot remember seeing any piece of art selling on the market above a Billion USD mark?
     
  8. 275GTBSaran

    275GTBSaran Formula Junior

    Mar 5, 2012
    966
    Zurich, Switzerland
    Full Name:
    Le Monde Edmond
    Tradeable art that is not locked up in Museums- no there is no art piece even close to $1bn.
    The Mona Lisa is probably worth at least $1bn but there is no market for it. Art that comes on the market- the records are now roughly set at $100-120m. I look forward to an Art Expert to voice his opinion- I just follow the Art market out of curiosity and am not a big collector...
     
  9. mdw3

    mdw3 Karting

    Jan 2, 2005
    194
    Los Angeles, CA
    Full Name:
    Michael
    There have been verified private transactions in which single, iconic 20th century modern paintings have sold in the $200-250MM range. More than that, I have not heard about. And yes, I am in the art resale business.

    Michael
     
  10. BIRA

    BIRA Formula Junior

    Jun 15, 2007
    950
    Oscar,

    You stared at goats for too long...among those recently sold were the 2 from/ via DK and the asking price was 4.5 GBP which is in excess of 5Meuro. Both sold relatively rapidly , i assume close to asking price.

    So what we have is a hierarchy with steel SWB around 6.5 USD, competition one but without race history around 8.5MUSD , competition with decent race history in the 9.5- 10.5 MUSD and those with stellar race history above this level with the caveat that very often they are no longer so original as racing takes a toll on cars.
     
  11. 275gtb6c

    275gtb6c Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Oct 30, 2006
    1,929
    europe
    Full Name:
    oscar
    Bonjour Pierre,

    Yes I know, I do spend my time on other things, but when I bought my 275 for a fraction of their current value, a SWB was around 1.2-1.6 M if I remember correctly...and for me that was yesterday, but hey, that was us doing the TA also.....

    Time travels fast,
    Ciao
    Oscar
     
  12. ClassicFerrari

    ClassicFerrari F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 7, 2004
    16,798
    Toronto
    Full Name:
    Vasco
  13. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
    Honorary Owner

    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
    Full Name:
    Jim Glickenhaus
    So far but there are works of Art that may become tradable that would bring MUCH higher prices than that. The sales you mentioned were to a "Museum" that has more finincial resources than most countries.
     
  14. Wolf

    Wolf Formula Junior

    Nov 17, 2003
    499
    Anybody watching day 2 of the Gooding auction who could keep us updated?

    Regards

    Wolfi
     
  15. Daytonafan

    Daytonafan F1 Rookie

    Oct 18, 2003
    2,748
    Surrey, England
    Full Name:
    Matthew
    Watching on the live feed View Live Auction | Gooding and Company

    300SL Roadster $1.4m Hammer
    Porsche 718RSK $2.85m Hammer
     
  16. mdw3

    mdw3 Karting

    Jan 2, 2005
    194
    Los Angeles, CA
    Full Name:
    Michael
    What you say is true. There are certain private and quasi-institutional buyers chasing trophies whose presence in the market make it possible, even likely, that new record numbers will be achieved in the near future.

    Michael
     
  17. Daytonafan

    Daytonafan F1 Rookie

    Oct 18, 2003
    2,748
    Surrey, England
    Full Name:
    Matthew
    Maserati 150GT Spyder prototype sells for $2.8m Hammer
     
  18. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
    Honorary Owner

    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
    Full Name:
    Jim Glickenhaus
    Cool Car.
     
  19. Daytonafan

    Daytonafan F1 Rookie

    Oct 18, 2003
    2,748
    Surrey, England
    Full Name:
    Matthew
    Ferrari 250 Speciale $2.15m at hammer
     
  20. John B

    John B Formula 3

    May 27, 2003
    1,564
    NJ
    #95 John B, Jan 19, 2013
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2013
    '65 289 Cobra $1.2mm vs 850-1.1mm, new record.
    '72 Dino 246 GT, $265 vs 200-250 est.
    '57 250 GT Berlinetta $760 vs 675-800 est.
    '56 Porsche 356 Carrera Coupe $350 vs 250-300 est.
    '56 Lancia Aurelia Spider America $730 vs 400-450 est. Gooding as principal
     
  21. billnoon

    billnoon Formula 3
    BANNED

    Aug 22, 2003
    1,176
    La Jolla, California
    Full Name:
    Bill Noon
    Dino 246GT hammered at $265k
     
  22. Daytonafan

    Daytonafan F1 Rookie

    Oct 18, 2003
    2,748
    Surrey, England
    Full Name:
    Matthew
    Dino 246GT $265K hammer
     
  23. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

    Apr 26, 2003
    13,477
    Never home
    Full Name:
    Dr. Dumb Ass
    Or could it just be that the dollar just isn't worth what it used to be anymore?
     
  24. billnoon

    billnoon Formula 3
    BANNED

    Aug 22, 2003
    1,176
    La Jolla, California
    Full Name:
    Bill Noon
    Boano sold for $760k
     
  25. billnoon

    billnoon Formula 3
    BANNED

    Aug 22, 2003
    1,176
    La Jolla, California
    Full Name:
    Bill Noon
    Hammer price.
     

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