Are prices falling? 246 GTS market dropped below $135k

+246. Investments they ain't , I bought mine to drive it

 

That's why we have insurance, no?

From what I remember from some posts over the years some cars have ended up in better condition after an accident than before at comparatively little expense to the owner.

 

You really think your insurance company is going to replace a car with a value of $300K?

Insurance doesn't cover rust. Insurance won't cover a dropped valve. Had to replace my timing chain, tensioner, and water pump at 15K miles. To do that, you have to pull the motor and gearbox. Once the gearbox is out, you might as well do the clutch and the 2nd gear synchro.

My point is, they may be fun but as investments, they don't make sense.

 

I don't think any of us posting here has bought our Dino's as investments ....

 

I agree. Now, what about those who bought them in the last 12 months?

 

Thanks, Phil! Fred

 

I bought my Dinos 37 and 30 years ago. Investment was the last thing on my mind. Buyers of early 458s often watched their cars burn to the ground. These things happen in an uncertain world. I agree about the possibility of accidents, rust bubbles, dropped valves, etc. However, I'm not going to refuse to leave the house because a piano might fall on my head, or I might get swallowed by a sink hole. No car makes "sense" as an investment, but then, I submit that "sense" is the last reason why one buys a Ferrari or any other exotic, no? Fred p.s.: Any more hints on the 12-cylinder in your future?

 

Classic cars are speculative investments and are listed in portfolios. There is a market, it's widely tracked and traded. Like any investment; some make money and some don't.

Are they good investments? This question can only be answered by the person putting up their money.

As car guys, we have a different perspective, but there are plenty of people out there effecting the market speculating on classic cars, probably more than we like . . .until of course we are sellers

 

Bought it to drive it. If I need to sell it some day and it's worth what I've put into it, I'll be ecstatic because it'll be the first time that's ever happened.

 

As you know I didn't but I never buy anything at "the bottom" lol

 

+246

 

In general, I try to avoid these "value" based threads like the plague. I thought I might chime in this time with an observation as I am asked several times a day for an opinion on this very subject.

Since January 1st of this year, five nice Dino's have come and gone through our doors. Only the 206GT was sold for more than $300K. We always try to have at least one Dino for sale but it is not always easy to do so. While they have been a great place to park money and "enjoy the ride" only a fool would risk his money on one purely as an investment. The same goes with any collectible vehicle or art-based item for that matter unless you do so strictly as a professional without emotional attachment. Otherwise expect to brake even at best under most circumstances and if you do profit, be ever so pleasantly surprised.

We were lucky to purchase another nice Dino yesterday, a late USA, 74 GTS and like the others it will be sold for less than $300K. Auctions might be setting some extraordinary records on some very specific Chairs and Flares USA GTS models but other than the 206GT, actual sale prices have remained stable and steady for more than a year. At least the ones that I have sold have followed a steady trend.

Today it is still easy to find a decent GT from $195K to $275K and a decent GTS from $275K to a bit over $300K. Others can ask more and the auctions can achieve more on certain cars but my comments are not based on guesses or on asking prices but real deal selling prices in the past 90 days.

No, the markets are not tumbling and there is no bubble... In my business I wish there could and would be such a shake-up as I have a near impossible time purchasing vehicle for resale when there is no one finding themselves having to sell at a discount.

Keep in mind that the ratios of newly interested buyers coming onto the market for the existing pool of available Dinos that might be sold is and has been on a steady 10% or so rise each year over the past three to five years. Those ratios alone are a clear indication of not a bubble but more likely the lost value of the whatever currency you might be using to buy such a machine in the first place. Also keep in mind the newly found interest in having such a car by a whole new generation of eager enthusiasts with new money that was not even thinking about such a vehicle ten years ago.

All but one of my Dino's that I have sold this year went to a brand new buyer who I had never met or sold anything else to and not one of them had a significant different collector car before settling on a Dino. That alone is the strongest indication of a stable, strong and dynamic market if ever there was one.

Ciao,

Bill Noon
[email protected]

 

Plus a bunch. 10 years ago, although I loved them I couldn't have remotely considered purchasing a Dino even at 1/3rd of today's prices.

Hopefully, the generation following us will have enough interest in these vehicles to want to purchase one, otherwise they will be worth squat

 

Isn't that the truth.

The market for A-Model Fords isn't exactly booming.

 

I passed one (the Ford) going down the road last night, on the way to the store, I suppose.....we nodded in passing.

Good report Bill, thanks as always...interesting insight, on the first time buyers.

 

fair but they also made almost 5 million model As...

 

It isn't so much about how many were made, but how many are still around.

 

It's about how many devotees are still around.

 

Duesenbergs and Packards seem to be doing well.

 

There's the odd one of us around. lol
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No offense but: Spoken like a used car dealer interested in selling more cars.

The fact is that people are sprucing up junker cars, putting them on auction blocks hyped by groups who don't care what they sell as long as they get their commission, and people only interested in owning "an investment" are causing inflating prices for people who have no idea what they are buying.

That new generation is not interested in owning a Dino. They are interested in owning a commodity.

Just like all commodities, when there are more sellers than buyers, prices drop. Anyone who bought this only because they felt it was "a good investment" will quickly sell as soon as they see a downturn.

 

I think most of the mass-produced classics such as MGs, Triumphs, Healeys, and even the Porsche 356 will have almost no value once the baby boomers have passed on. Many will go to the crusher for lack of interest. Those of us of a certain age think back on the day when we wanted one and can now indulge ourselves, but looking at them objectively they really don't have much to offer.

I have driven my friend's beautiful MG TC and can't imagine why anyone would want one. Yes, they look cool, but they are a horror to drive. But my friend is 11 years older than I and he feels differently.

The Dino, on the other hand, I think will always have value. The thing is drop-dead gorgeous, makes a wonderful noise, and is intense to drive in a way the modern computers-with-wheels cars are not. There will always be 4000 people on the Earth who want one.

 

The 356A and early 911 have a HUGE following. In the last year many young automotive designers have been discovering these cars. I have gotten countless emails from them. With Gary Emory's 356 Outlaw movement and the 911 based RGruppe there is no end in sight. Just go to European Collectibles and see how many cars they move at ever higher prices and attracting younger buyers.

Freeman
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My Rgruppe 911 "GT". The early 911 and 356 are fantastic in their stock form and can be amazing when they're modified correctly. They are the perfect pallet to hot rod. They are light, agile, fast and above all, pure!

Freeman
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^ very nice rgruppe. i remember when the 911 vs dino article came out in 1973(road and track?) and the 911 won.
ed