Anyone here used a 944 as a daily?

Well, I thoroughly enjoy driving a well setup 944 as a daily. I have two of them, picked a second one up as project car.

Obviously, the car in rough shape has been constantly needing stuff ever since I got it. My other one, has been pretty good for the past three years, the original 1984 clutch needed replacement last year, and I've had some electrical gremlins, but otherwise, runs like a tank.

I've owned 4 944's, everyone drove different, do some test drives, find one you like. My '84(3rd) has a non factory alignment, and a factory sport suspension, also a short 5th gear. Very fun car, unless you happen to be on the insterate. Then the higher engine RPM, and follow every bump in the road handling, gets old fast. The early model also has smaller seats, that don't fit me as well.

My project '86(4th 944) on the other hand, just eats up long interstate miles now that I've rebuilt the suspension. Car also above normal engine power for a 944. It has vibrations at lower RPM though, that make it a pain if you get behind someone on a highway that drives below the speed limit just as you come to an uphill, I have to downshift when I really shouldn't have to. Not sure what does it, only 944 I've had that isn't happy at the low range of things.

My prior '86(2nd) was a dog, drove it for a while until I got the '84, then it became a parts car.

My first was an early model '85, great first car, 200K+ miles, got totalled by a texting 20 something year old that didn't see traffic had stopped for a left turning car. He took about a foot off the length of my 944.

A big decision, is what version to get. If you live where its hot, go with a late '85 and up, the AC in the early model isn't as good. I can live without AC, even when its hot, but I'll always show up sweaty if I do...

 

Not a 944, but I drive a '96 993 911 C4S on a fairly daily basis. Some times it sits. But it always starts right up.

It's been pretty much bulletproof. A well-maintained 944 should be similar. Only with added water pumps and radiators!

 

Do tell us more about your airplane, Chupa!

 

I just picked an '86 up a couple of weeks ago to use as a DD. Biggest issues are an erratic temp gauge and the a/c isn't cold. I got it for $1200 so no complaints so far, gets decent mileage.

We also have the same year and model that we use as a chump/lemons car. That car has taken quite a bit of abuse without quitting, so I think it'd be tough to hurt one mechanically. Electrical/wiring sucks on these cars imo, we've had to bypass a good portion of it on the race car due to intermittent issues. I had to deal with some relay/wiring issues on my DD when I first got it before using it, so that's something to keep an eye on.

 

I had a 944, and then a 944S2, as daily drivers for 14 years. I used them on the track as well. I was quite happy with both cars.
I bought an 86 used (22,000 miles) and put 55,000 miles on it. No issues except 2 water pumps (leaking) and sun visor clips failing (chronic). Cooling fan fuse went a few times.
I traded it on a new leftover 89 S2 and put 225,000 miles on that car before selling it. The only major issue with the S2 was the water pump seizing at 50,000 miles and taking the timing belt with it (timing belt runs beside the water pump belt. Unlike the standard 944, the S2's water pump tends to seize rather than visibly leaking first). Six bent valves (the S2 has higher compression than the standard 944; no valve-to-piston clearance). After that I changed water pumps whenever I did the timing belt. Other than that, no drive train issues. Well, the rubber center donut on the original clutch went at 100,000 miles, at the end of the back straight at Watkins Glen; that was exciting. The rest of the clutch assembly showed very little wear at the time. Some accessory failures, like sun visor clips (still chronic; I made metal clips), speedometer failure, cable release to hood (Porsche does not have secondary pull cables like Ferrari). Glove box plastic stop failed (chronic). Factory alarm failed (would not shut off). Warped rotors on the track, but pad selection helped there.

My brother replaced the steering rack on his 944 Turbo (much bigger job than on a 308), but neither of my cars needed it.

IMHO the 944 is generally less maintenance-friendly than the 308 -- things tend to be less accessible -- but not horribly so, and the parts are cheaper. And the cars are pretty reliable. I never had any A/C issues with either one, and I averaged over 25 mpg on the street (closer to 30 on the S2).

 

I remember reading about your Arrow's never ending squawk list! Congrats on the Navajo and happy landings!

 

I've owned a total of eight 944s, and have done well over 250k miles combined in them. They included three early NA cars ('83 and two '84s), two 85.5s, an '88 with an automatic, an S, and my current daily driver is a 1989 S2. I have also serviced them professionally at two different shops.

Your cheapest 944 to run for the long term will be an early ('83 - early '85) car, although the only significant costs going up to a later-style interior car will be the suspension parts should you choose to rebuild, the climate control unit and the clock. For day to day driving, the early and late NA cars are really the same; it's just a few repairs that have more expensive parts on the later NA cars.

Turbos and S2s have four-piston calipers that cost more to overhaul, and their larger tire sizes cost more. With S and S2 models, replacement of the cam chain tensioner pad and J-pipe are a "once every 80k-100k miles" cost.

Your best bet for a reliable daily driver 944 is to pay somewhere from $5k to $7k (loose guideline) for a 2.5 liter N/A from 1983 to '88 that has had all of the following done in recent years/miles:

1) Clutch. This is a $2500 job, give or take. Any 944 that still has its original clutch or had its clutch replaced prior to the early 2000s will need one very soon; the old Sachs clutch discs had rubber centers that fatigue before the lining wears out. Valeo replacements from the late 1990s and Sachs replacements from the early-mid 2000s have springs like most cars. If you have no proof of a clutch job, subtract at least $2500 from the price of the car.

2) Oil cooler seals. Less than $100 in parts (sans fluids), but a real mess for the home mechanic to fix, and a lot of labor hours. IIRC, you will be out about $1000 at a specialist (but it's been a while, so don't quote me on that one).

3) Timing belt and water pump. Make sure you have proof of when it was done. I'd go 45k miles and maybe 7 or so years before changing. Have it checked once in a while. It will be between $1000 and $1500 at a specialist. You only need to do the water pump every other timing belt. Buy a new Laso brand water pump if they are still available.

4) Motor mounts. Not a terribly expensive job (few hundred in parts, couple hours labor), and the car will run and drive fine with old, hard, collapsed mounts, but the vibration through the cabin could dampen your enjoyment of the car and accelerate the fatigue of other parts of the car/body.

5) Struts. Front struts plus wheel alignment will run you closer to $1000 than $500 after parts, labor, alignment, and tax.

6) Air conditioning. Getting it fixed costs similar to any other foreign car. Don't bother with aftermarket compressors and barrier hoses, etc.; just fix the leak with stock equipment, fill it with 134a and Ester oil, and you're good to go. It won't be as cold as a Cadillac, but it never was when it was new, either.

7) Power steering rack (1984 and newer) -- after many years and miles, they just leak. You're looking at close to $1000 parts and labor when all is said and done.

8) (On 1985.5 and newer cars) Front control arms, if the car has more than ~120k miles. The arms are ~$400-$500 each side, and installation usually accompanies a full rebuild of the front suspension (bushings, etc.)


These are the most common mechanical jobs that are significant in cost relative to the cost of the car. There are other potential issues -- for example, the clutch slave cylinders can fail, especially after sitting -- but they are only a couple/few hundred dollars installed; another example is the idle air valve. Buy one that has had as many of these things (the list above) done in the past 5-7 years as possible, and you will enjoy a car that will cost you little to run and that you can seriously rely on.


Minor Annoyances: Some less-expensive things that don't affect your ability to get from point A to point B will occasionally go bad: Sunroof gears on cars with power sunroofs ($15 or so for a pair of gears, about 45 minutes in your driveway to change). Power window switches or regulators occasionally fail (just for being an old car). Power trunk release rod can pop out of its ball/socket joint. On early cars, the heater control slider assembly can break (<$50); on later cars the electronic control module can break ($400+). Odometers fail due to a plastic gear that becomes brittle over the years. Plan to spend a long evening carefully removing the instrument cluster and replacing the little gear, which you can purchase for about $25. Hood/hatch gas springs go bad with age. These are all little things that you may encounter, but should not complain about as you are driving a 25 year old car, and some things just fail with age. All old cars will have little issues similar to these, and it is not a reflection of the inherent quality or reliability of the model.

When 944s were new, they were like Boxsters have been in the past decade -- they were insanely popular, highly lauded and praised, perennial "10 best" cars, and as reliable as anything. A well-maintained 944 is still, today, a reliable and rewarding car to drive every day.

Buy one whose body and interior are in good condition, as that stuff can get expensive. Buy one with no accident history, unless the repairs were done at a Porsche dealership or specialist. There are plenty of well-taken-care-of models, and they are starting to come out of the woodwork now after a lull for 6-7 years, so there is no need to buy a $2500 beater. The sweet spot in the "driver" market, in my opinion, is the well-cared-for 944 with about 80k-120k miles. At this mileage there are still plenty with nice paint and interiors, and they have done enough miles where most of the big jobs listed above have been done. Those 30k-40k mile cars that have been turning up for $7k-$9k usually haven't had any of the jobs on the list above done. There is absolutely no substitute for the lack of wear and tear that comes with low miles, but a low mile 944 that has had none of the big jobs done will cost you thousands more in about 20k miles than a well-maintained higher mile car. And the 100k mile cars still feel very solid and tight; 944s are really well-built -- a 100k mile car will feel like a 50k mile car.

With correct maintenance (especially fluid changes), you can expect 500k miles out of a 944 engine. They are that good. If you keep them clean, you can expect the same mileage (or more) out of the body; they are galvanized, and have some of the highest quality rust-proofing underneath and throughout that you will ever see. The design of the body has very few nooks and crevices in which to trap dirt and salt, and the cabin's ventilation system forces air through the rocker panels to keep them from rusting from the inside. If kept reasonably clean, a 944 should go at least 10 winters and 100k miles without any bubbling or rust; 15 years with winters and no rust issues is not far-fetched.

I have often likened an 8-valve NA 944 to a diesel Mercedes of the same era; if you take car of them, they just keep on going forever. They are really great cars. Buy a good one and you won't be disappointed.

- Tony K

 

Nice write up Tony.

I can highly recomend it as a DD. I had a 944 Turbo S as a DD for many years. Sold it. Bought it back. Did DE with it till I wanted more power.

Still my nominee for best $15K sportscar.

30 MPG ... if you try. It's a four cylinder you know.

0-60 in 5/0 sec. w/ stage two chip.

168 MPH

Seats four, I did five once, with that hatchback versatility. Carried a ten speed bike inside with the hatch closed. Try that with anything else.



I consider it a junior supercar. It sure was when it was made in '89. The only weakness. Low Torque off the line, and turbo lag.

 

+1 great handling cars

my experience was a first year model, was well used when i acquired it, but still in fairly decent condition ....the motor mounts needed changing, once that was done much of the harshness went away ...next wear item were the suspension bushings, once changed the car felt much improved, but it revealed that the shocks needed changing, did those too ...replaced the tie-rod ends, rebuilt the brakes & changed fluid (was discolored), and changed the transaxle fluid (i think was still original in there) that helped with shifting a bit when did that ...throttle linkage needed repair, was told how that was sometimes an area neglected ...then the fuel tank developed a small leak, that required droppping the tank to fix, but was fine once done ...biggest chore was to change the water pump, that audi sourced engine was not designed to be mechanic friendly

....hmm, quite a list once i think back on it ...but loved the car still the whole time i had it!

 

http://bringatrailer.com/2012/09/03/no-lag-28k-mile-1989-porsche-944-s2/

On BaT today. Looks promising, though I don't know anything about these cars...

EDIT: Actually maybe not that promising, but as always the BaT comment pool is a treasure trove of knowledge!

 

Hello,

Owned a '88 Porsche 944S and regret selling it. Wonderful car. Best steering feedback ever. Light, nimble and handled very well. In the seven years of ownership, only one unscheduled repair. (fuse box issues - aftermarlet alarm)

Constantly searching the classified ads for a nice '87-'88 sixteen ventiler.

IMHO

Joe

 

Anyone had a 944 and a Boxster... I'd love to hear what the driving experience feels like comparing the two?

I've always thought of the 944 as the Boxster of its day, when you looked at its place in Porsche's line-up.

Having bought a 2012 Cayman, and always wanted a 944 from my days as a broke college student... I'm still playing with the idea of picking one up for a bit more of a classic driving experience.

 

Late to the thread. I've owned my '90 S2 for almost seven years. I bought it at 89K miles and I've got 220K miles on her now with very few problems:

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8442/7964107536_0201cea669_b.jpg

Tony's post is spot on. In my experience these are robust, well built cars and by the time the S2 rolled around they had most of the kinks straightened out. Just be obsessive about the timing belt and that seems to keep the catastrophic bills at bay. Most of the things I've had to fix are simply age issues:

• Power steering rack
• Clutch
• Brakes
• Timing belt/tensioner pad
• Window switch

The 951s (turbos) offer a platform for a lot more power but they also bring far more complexity($) to the mix. The S2 gives you the big engine without the headaches.

It's getting time to think about either pouring more money into it to keep it going for another 100K (and I've no doubt that it could) or find something else. I've always wanted a 911SC or Carrera but if I could find the right low mileage S2 I'd probably buy another one. They're entertainingly fast (210hp, 6sec), they can haul a ton of stuff, they handle beautifully and they're very comfortable for DD or long trips. Do your research, get a PPI and pick the right one and you'll likely be very happy.

 

I got my 944 in late February and have used it as my DD. (it's my first and only car, so I kinda have to). Be very careful about the timing belt and make sure it has been replaced. It's an interference engine, so the timing belt is VERY VERY IMPORTANT! If you are replacing the timing belt, replace the water pump at the same time. My water pump went out right after I put in a brand-new Dansk exhaust system (grr). Repair bills will eat you alive if you are a teenager like myself. Also be wary of grinding in first and third gears, as the syncro will then have to be replaced. I have put more into repairs than the car cost to buy.

 

Yes, we have a 2005 Porsche Boxster (Hers) and a1988 Porsche 944 Turbo (His/Me).

Each car has around 245 HP. Boxster is a Tiptronic, 944 Turbo a manual, of course.

Boxster is a modern car, it does everything well. Very very well in fact. It is totally factory standard. 944 Turbo feels like it is carved out of a piece of granite. Not as planted as the Boxster, but some slip is good! I love driving each, as each has it's own positive attributes. Boxster sounds great with the engine right behind your back. 944 sounds uninspiring, unfortunately, although better inside than outside.

Boxster has only done 33,000 Klms, the 944 Turbo 233,000 Klms. 944 Turbo has won my States Concours five years in succession. There is always a better example, but realistically it is probably as good an example of the model as you would find here in Australia. Like most, I think the 944 Turbo was better built and engineered, comparing time of build to time of build for each model.

My 944 Turbo sees regular track use 4to 5 times a year on Toyota R Spec tyres. Car has Koni Coilovers front and rear, camber plates and Limited Slip Diff. Certainly does not embarrass itself even with modern 911s. Will quite easily see 250 KPH if so inclined. Boxster is forbidden to see track time. Although on well known roads near where I live the Boxster will achieve a very slightly higher speed through corners and up hills. I can only report that on a track, (compared to Boxsters that I see on track) the 944 Turbo is a few seconds quicker, but of course it has been slightly modified and is not factory standard as the Boxster is. A couple of seconds is a lot . The 944 Turbo feels much faster than the Boxster, due to the Rush of turbo power. In any rolling situation, the 944 is significantly quite a bit quicker (I have tested this side by side on the highway). The 944 Turbo is also quite significantly quicker on a Drag Strip, again from personal testing and experience, although the Tiptronic does dull some of the feel of urgency away compared to a manual in the Boxster. 944 Turbos do get quite hot at a track and this is just the way they are. On road, temperatures in a properly working cooling system are not an issue.

IMO, the Turbo is better suited to being a road car than a track car because it has very high gearing. I will see 160 KPH in third gear for example.

As for which do I prefer to drive? I kid myself that I prefer the older car, but then when I drive the newer one, well we all know how great a modern car is. Bottom line is I absolutely love both, but it is the 944 I will probably never sell.

As for the original question, is a Porsche 944 suitable as a Daily Driver and which is the best? Yes they are, but in moderation as they are now 25 years old. Informed opinion is the 944 S2. Again, a 968 is better, as you would expect and as it should be. 240 HP and the last in a long and well developed line of front engine 4 cylinder cars. These cars are modern enough to get decent airconditioning (an absolute must for Australia) and electrics, stereo, power windows, power steering, sunroof etc. Of course, to each his own!

I love my 944 Turbo because it is still a quick car and I love the Rush of power as the revs rise. It suits me very well.

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Thanks for the detailed answer... very helpful!

 

I had an 87 944 for over 20 years and a 99 Boxster for more than decade. I don't think the 944 is a "classic" driving experience -maybe in terms of power but certainly not feel/precision - its rock solid. The only glaring weakness when compared to the Boxster are the brakes. They're not bad but don't have the power and bite of the newer systems. For the price they trade at you might as well get one if you have the room.

I LOVED the 2.5L Boxster. I often thought about buying an S during the time I owned it but never did. Above 4500 rpm the engine had the old air-cooled growl which the more powerful Boxster motors never did. With only 200hp it was rather anemic, however it came alive on the twisties as long as you kept the revs up. It was a beauty. My current Boxster Spyder feels like a completely different car in every way compared to the 2.5L - lower ride height, stiffer/better suspension, bigger brakes, gobs more power and waaaaay more precise turn-in when the pucker factor increases. Great car but not necessarily as much fun to hustle through the canyons as the 2.5L.

I'm a big believer in the theory that its more fun to drive to a slow car at its limit than a fast car well below its ever increasing crazy limit. The same is true for bikes. The most fun I ever had was tracking my ex Aprillia RS 250

 

My daily driver is this 1987 951 which I purchased new. Five years ago I added the Lindsey Racing Instant RWHP kit to make it run better. I've enjoyed 93,000 trouble-free miles with my 944 turbo.
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My 968 was a supremely comfortable and competent commuter car, with reasonably good gas mileage. Wish I could say the maintenance costs were low, but they weren't. This car gave me good and faithful service until I sold it with 172K miles.

I've used Boxsters as commuting cars with equally satisfactory results, albeit in a mid-engine configuration. The things I look for in a commuter car are all there - comfortable/supportive seats, good performance (braking, steering, acceleration, etc.), and fun to drive (all my Porsches have been stick shift, by the way). My gas mileage averages about 28 or 29 in mostly highway driving.

The 968 was good (real good, in fact) and I miss it, but the Boxster is a superior car in every way.

 

I drove a 944 as my daily driver for several years here in Colorado. (year round) and I loved it. I would certainly recommend a very good set of snow tires and wheels if you have to deal with snow at all.

The only thing that I had to deal with was a bad water pump, which is quite expensive as most shops will want to change out the timing belt, and do other maintenance at the same time since these parts have to be removed anyways, but outside of that issue it always started first time around no matter what the temp outside and was an absolute blast to drive and own.

Go for it.

Erik