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812 VS Rumors

Discussion in 'FF/Lusso/F12/812S' started by Frenzisko, Feb 10, 2018.

  1. Tommy Boy

    Tommy Boy Karting

    Aug 27, 2020
    164
    Full Name:
    Thomas
    I did same - I drove GTS demo, came back to the dealer and told dealer I would not be getting the car because of the sound. The plan had been to trade my 2019 SF for the GTS. I am never selling my SF.

    They gladly transferred my GTS deposit to another car and sold my allocation to someone else before I was out the door :)
     
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  3. IlModenese

    IlModenese Rookie

    Jan 15, 2008
    21
    USA
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    SS
    In my opinion, don't think that speed monitoring will have anything to do with electric cars - It will be exist - but it will be insurance companies to mandate it. You want insurance (and you legally need it to go on the road), then you will have to have a monitoring devise attached to your car. Doesn't matter if its electric or NA.
     
  4. Ferrari 308 GTB

    Ferrari 308 GTB F1 Veteran

    Feb 21, 2015
    6,744
    Thing is if they all sold already why the cat n mouse lead up to the reveal?
     
  5. MidnightRun

    MidnightRun Karting

    Nov 4, 2006
    133
    I claim no personal knowledge. Rather, all of my information on this topic is derivative, that is, it comes from people who are in-the-know. According to them, the coming monitoring/reporting technology will be required on all new cars produced after a certain date. If this coming technology is placed under the banner of life and safety, implementation in electrified cars is assured due to their inherent ability to rapidly accelerate.
     
  6. abdulla.alhajri

    abdulla.alhajri Karting

    Jul 16, 2015
    104
    same story here, I had the GTS demo for a full day to experience it and the GPF was a complete let down for me in fact i found the deep base sound to be annoying after a long drive.
     
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  8. George330

    George330 Formula 3

    Oct 19, 2009
    1,113
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    #7806 George330, May 9, 2021
    Last edited: May 9, 2021
    Incorrect in my opinion. An officer of Ferrari states specific numbers at a press briefing = public disclosure for a listed company. Unless Ferrari deny those statements and ask the press to correct their reports. If they then make more / different number of cars they could face liability and they will certainly risk regulatory sanction for making false statements to the public. This is not an anonymous “leak” it is a statement made in a press briefing and reported without comment to the contrary by Ferrari. The same applies to the Monza numbers which some people in this forum question because it is not on the website. They were first given in Galliera’s press briefing (both audio and video which is still available). The difference with the Monza is that Galliera said “up to 500” as he was perhaps unsure if all 500 would be sold. In my view if Galliera mentioned numbers to the press, those numbers are official.
    Btw my own info for the last 3 months pointed to 1000 coupe and 500 aperta, so it seems that this was extended somewhat due to demand for the convertible.


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  9. mycatisholdingmehostage

    Jan 19, 2018
    88
    Full Name:
    Alex
    I find statements like this surprising. I not going to say you’re wrong. After all how can I judge what you hear? It’s just surprising to me. I’m a pretty young guy…well young enough to still have good hearing and I’ve owned an F12, 812, and a GTS. While I definitely noticed the GTS was quieter and deeper at idle and low RPMs, all screamed like maniacs and sounded similar (and fantastic) at the high rev range.

    So in my opinion which sounds better: an open top screaming V12 GTS or an 812 without GPF but muffled much more so by a roof and trying to hear it with the windows down? It was an easy answer for me but I do know it’s subjective.



    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
     
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  10. Lukeylikey

    Lukeylikey Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 3, 2012
    2,402
    UK
    Wow, I was thinking exactly the same. I’m literally shocked people can be so dismissive of the GTS because of sound. I still have both a SF without GPF and a GTS so have ‘skin’ in both games. Our SF is our first TM car and our GTS is neither TM or Atelier so you can guess which one we planned to keep. I thought I would sell the GTS before it lost too much value but just haven’t done so. The open car sounds fantastic, different to the SF but still absolutely wonderful. I think its tone and volume are judged perfectly. It’s not as aggressive as the SF but I love it and it fits the overall GTS package really well - the GTS is a thoroughly brilliant car, a sweet spot in the Ferrari range. I have no fear that the Comp will sound anything less than amazing. It doesn’t matter if the TDF is louder, or quieter, or whatever. Each car will have its personality - sound, looks, handling, power delivery, feel. They will both be among the top echelon of cars and considered to be icons of their time. Just like the GTO, the Testarossa, the Daytona and so many other V12s. Do we say we don’t like the Daytona because the successor sounded better (many say the Boxer and Testarossa’s 180 degree V was the best sounding engine Ferrari ever made)? I doubt anyone even thinks in that degree of detail. They consider the Daytona and the Boxer/Testarossa cars as a whole and are usually glad all exist because they are all interesting and brilliant. Why do we get so hung up on one particular element? Yes, it’s important but not more important than how the car works together as a whole.

    nb. I’m obviously not criticising people for passing on the GTS because they don’t want one and would rather keep the SF, that’s entirely their prerogative and more power to them.
     
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  11. BG23

    BG23 Formula Junior

    Jun 16, 2015
    435
    Australia
    I am thoroughly confused why they didn't announce the numbers in the press release. My dealer wasn't even aware when I asked over a day after the official release. Ferrari are clearly aware this is a big deal, so to not have mentioned anywhere in the large press release must be intentional. However for the life of me I can't work out why?
     
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  13. red passion

    red passion Formula Junior

    Mar 4, 2012
    712
    Hockenheim, Germany
    The Euro vehicle emission standards set quantitative emission limits and testing procedures. They do not dictate how this should be achieved. As a car producer's chosen measure to fulfill Euro standards, setting a car's speed limit to 180 kph is rather pointless, as the WLTP focuses on real world driving emissions. With the exception of some parts of Germany you are not even allowed to go up to 180 kph, so it's not a real world scenario coverd by the WLTP.
    Furthermore your orginal point was an direct answer to MidnightRun's comment: "...future integrated speed monitoring and reporting." You suggested that it "Could be part of Euro 7 regulations...." Again, such a big brother regulation might come in some form at some some point, but that is a completely different topic than defining emission limits.
     
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  14. JJ77

    JJ77 Karting

    Oct 3, 2020
    92
    As per your earlier post, you don’t need to know somebody, it’s been all over the internet in Europe for 18 months. The date is May 2022 when all new cars sold in EU & UK must have sign recognition gps speed limiter. I’m still surprised that majority of people don’t know about what’s coming, and I’ve specifically ordered 21 model cars. Just last week I asked my local Porsche dealer about it and he was the only guy willing to talk about it..they are selling whatever they can get, 991 GT3’s GT4’s Turbo’s due to some people knowing about May 2022. He also confirmed Porsche being Porsche, are introducing this device in their MY22 cars that will start production in September this year!! I was going to order a Turbo for November delivery, but no chance now. I don’t think Ferrari will adopt the same efficiency, and leave this as close to May 2022. With regard to your 2nd post, what I understand is that they are also trying to bring in regulation that states all cars must have it retrospectively fitted by 2024... so yes I didn’t want a MY22 car and have bought earlier cars, but my fear is that for the reasons you state the insurance companies will drive this retrospective 2024 change. Bloody depressing and sorry to ruin a weekend! How it works, internet saying you come up to a speed limit sign the car is slowed down to that speed but you can drive through that by simply pushing the accelerator, or another link thinks the first year cars 2022, have the option to switch device off, but I bet insurance companies will have access to that data! I’m just hoping that this retrospective 2024 law never happens so that cars produced before May 2022 can be still enjoyed, without some electronic device taking control of our cars.....May 2022 is coming so buy up what you need before..
     
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  15. MDEL

    MDEL F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed Silver Subscribed

    Feb 24, 2016
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    What a magnificent and unique sound.
    Despite the aggressive look of the 812 C it doesn’t matter from which angle we look at the car the design shows harmony and balance. I am particularly impressed with the redesign, specially with the way the rear spoiler merges so well with all the other rear elements. IMO the rear is an exercise of very good design with the carved window louvers combining to perfection with the rear fenders vents, the tail lights blending in the spoiler and finally, the f1 type diffuser inserted between these two well sculptured air exit holes.
    This machine can’t lie it carries Ferrari’s racing DNA.


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  16. Solid State

    Solid State F1 Veteran
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    Feb 4, 2014
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    Chief Ten Bears
    Disable GPS.
     
  17. JTSE30

    JTSE30 Formula 3

    Oct 1, 2004
    1,480
    Austin TX
    So how do you feel about it being a cave inside, with zero rear glass, completely dark?

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    Until now that was not part of Ferrari DNA.
     
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  18. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini F1 World Champ
    Honorary

    Mar 2, 2005
    16,341
    That will become illegal.

    Marcel Massini
     
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  19. Newjoint

    Newjoint Formula Junior

    Jan 17, 2016
    386
    I fully expect aftermarket bypass devices or software hacks to fool the device will be developed-
    It may take months or years to happen but the market will dictate. As for the 2024 law- it may have unexpected consequences- fewer speed cameras in use for one!


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
     
  20. Eilig

    Eilig F1 Rookie
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    Aug 31, 2001
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    Next will be a new "aero-pano" roof option for a mere $20k :) :) :)
     
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  21. mepassione

    mepassione Formula Junior

    Aug 17, 2019
    400
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    Passione
    How about no front screen and a video and voice telling you in which direction to go + fake engine sound in the cabin?
     
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  22. clockem

    clockem Formula Junior

    May 18, 2009
    980
    Chicago
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    Gary
    In complete agreement. For one that works with Public company’s the statement made about production numbers is a material “event”. If a company deviates from that, they should expect a shareholder lawsuit unless a correction or update is made.


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
     
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  23. Challenge64

    Challenge64 F1 Veteran
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    Jul 28, 2004
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    Not in Arizona. I have every intention of taking mine off. Please feel free to inform the Swiss authorities
     
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  24. roma1280

    roma1280 F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    I feel unhappy about it quite frankly. I continue to think the solid rear window with the protrusions is gimmicky and goofy and will age horribly. I hate the idea of the cabin being so dark. Combine this with the cost being more than double what a beautiful 812SF can be bought for on the secondary market and the excitement of the 812C is lessening every day.
     
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  25. JTSE30

    JTSE30 Formula 3

    Oct 1, 2004
    1,480
    Austin TX
    Good points, and, if there is no "digital rear view mirror" then the car, I believe, will be dangerous to drive because you will have no idea what is going on behind you, even for track driving it would be a dangerous proposition.

    Yes, the "rear view" shown in the side screen is present when car is in reverse gear, that is required for homologation regardless of a rear view mirror being functional.

    Of course, the presumption is a digital rear view mirror will be implemented.

    However, no such device has been shown or written about.

    Yes, there is what appears to be a 'camera' on the rear cover, but for what purpose?

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    It seems to be situated too low for use by a digital rear view mirror, for instance, the C8 placement is at the top of the roofline:

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    From the reveal:

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    each image above (from the track video) clearly show a regular (glass) rear view mirror, not a digital rear view mirror.

    For safety's sake, let us hope a digital rear view mirror will become available.
     
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  26. Eilig

    Eilig F1 Rookie
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    Aug 31, 2001
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    When building cars, such details not overlooked. When building "product," why get bogged down w/such details.

    Seeing out back = "minor detail"?!?!?!
     
  27. JTSE30

    JTSE30 Formula 3

    Oct 1, 2004
    1,480
    Austin TX
    I just found this from CAR magazine, it is, thus far, the only explanation I have found, surprising Ferrari's own lengthy release does not provide any guidance...
    https://corporate.ferrari.com/en/812-competizione-and-812-competizione-two-interpretations-ferraris-racing-soul


    From:

    https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-news/first-official-pictures/ferrari/812-competizione/

    But it's at the rear, with the Competizione's almost completely blanked-out screen, that's the biggest visual differentiator.

    It's an all-aluminium panel and, given rear visibility is almost down to zero, the rear-view mirror has been replaced with a camera.

    Ferrari also says that this panel allows buyers – or those with particularly deep pockets – the chance to customise their new car a little more, too.

    What could that mean? Customize the rear panel??
     
  28. Eilig

    Eilig F1 Rookie
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    Aug 31, 2001
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    For that you tick the "HEHV" (High Emotion/High Visibility) plexiglass aero-pano hatch option at cost of $35k :)
     
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