5-Digit Title "VIN" | FerrariChat

5-Digit Title "VIN"

Discussion in '308/328' started by wildcat326, May 18, 2015.

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  1. wildcat326

    wildcat326 Formula 3
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    Dec 10, 2012
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    #1 wildcat326, May 18, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Since purchasing my 79 GTS, I have had a nightmare of a time getting it titled, correctly anyway. I was told when purchasing my car that it had a clear Wisconsin title. Okay, no problem, except that the stated VIN # was simply "27785."

    I explained at the Illinois DMV (whose Chicago main office is right near my house, and has generally competent top managers) that I would like it to be recorded with the "proper" full title. They required me to drive to the nearest police station and have the police physically inspect the vehicle, as there is a "Law Enforcement Certification Form" that can be filled out to correct a title.

    When the title arrived - although the police report clearly stated F106AS27785, the state recorded it as a 328 GTS instead of a 308. They also misread the police scribble, so it came back as F106ASZ7785. That's a "Z" instead of a "2."

    Got a letter from the State today saying I cannot get a corrected title unless the State of Wisconsin issues me a formal letter acknowledging their recording error. Now I have a title with the wrong VIN, AND the wrong car model.

    I've spent the last hour fuming about State bureaucracy. Guess my question is, if I just have them revert to the Wisconsin title with only the chassis number, does anyone see that affecting value or insurability? Not that I'm planning to sell, but one wants one's classic collector car to have a proper title. Anyone else here have 5-digit titles?
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  2. SteveG75

    SteveG75 Formula Junior

    Nov 23, 2010
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    What is wrong with a 5 digit VIN? That is your VIN and that is how mine is registered in MD. You are creating a VIN that Ferrari never used.
     
  3. wildcat326

    wildcat326 Formula 3
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    Is that true? Ferrari didn't issue the VIN as F106AS*.......? I did NOT know that. You asked what was wrong with a 5-digit VIN, and that actually was MY ultimate question? Future Ferrari collectors (long after I'm gone) won't see this as a cloud on title or devaluing item? If everyone else here has 5-digit titles, I'm all in. I just assumed Wisconsin did something incorrectly.
     
  4. wildcat326

    wildcat326 Formula 3
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    PS I'm the fourth owner. First two were in IL, FWIW. I'm supposed to call some archivist at the Secretary of State tomorrow to find out how their the first two owners were recorded.
     
  5. Crowndog

    Crowndog F1 Veteran

    Jul 16, 2011
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    I had a similar issue with a wrongly recorded VIN and couldn't get it insured until it was corrected. It was Jag XJ6.
     
  6. wildcat326

    wildcat326 Formula 3
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    But is Steve's point valid? Is a VIN number starting with F106ASxxxxx not an actual VIN? What would YOU expect to see recorded, when looking at a 79 GTS? A 5-digit chassis number or 11-digit engine-stamped number? Unhelpfully, my car lost its build plate in a past respray, so I can't actually see what's in the door jamb.
     
  7. skullyspice

    skullyspice Formula Junior
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    my CA title (75 GT4) only has the 5 digit vin listed.
     
  8. wildcat326

    wildcat326 Formula 3
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    Huh, maybe Wisconsin isn't so backward after all.
     
  9. phrogs

    phrogs F1 Veteran
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    I had a mistake on a Corvette a 5 instead of a S, It was a DMV fat finger.

    I had to have a Cop check it out fill out the paperwork and sign off on it.

    At least my guy didn't scribble so I was lucky there.

    But
     
  10. robertgarven

    robertgarven F1 Veteran
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    Feb 24, 2002
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    I have had problems with the correct 5 digit number in CA. Their computer doesn't like it and about every 5 years I get a letter saying they are going to seize my car for not paying insurance. I have a letter ready to go and it has worked so far. My new car has the F106 thing on its old CA title and hoping for the best! Good luck I would keep trying to get it right, it will happen it will just take time!
     
  11. E-Dino

    E-Dino Formula Junior

    Aug 11, 2012
    378
    San Diego
    I also went down the 5 digit CA computer rat hole. It took me about 10 calls to nitwits up the chain before I got to someone that could comprehend the problem. I am surprised we made it through the year Y2K here.
     
  12. GordonC

    GordonC F1 Rookie
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    #12 GordonC, May 18, 2015
    Last edited: May 18, 2015
    The engine number has nothing to do with the VIN or chassis number - the engine number and chassis/VIN numbers don't match.

    Look on the top of your steering column, just behind the steering wheel. That's your full VIN, the last 5 numbers. Before 1980 or 1981, it was only 5 numbers for Ferrari. After that date, Ferrari used the full 11 or 13 standardized VIN as did all manufacturers from that point forward.
     
  13. robertgarven

    robertgarven F1 Veteran
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    Gordon,

    Thats not the point everyone (all these US DMV's) assumes all cars have the 15 digit or whatever VIN number not thinking we are all driving 40 year old cars! :)
     
  14. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
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    Not able to say anything of any value about the USA, but we had a long discussion on this forum about a year ago on the implementation of the full standard 17 digit VIN by Ferrari.
    For the carbed 308s, the only cars seen so far with a proven, attested 17 digit standard VIN are the very last batch of Right Hand Drive carbed cars for the UK, perhaps only the last half-dozen cars.
    All other carbed 308s have only the Ferrari designation system, that is the type of the chassis *F106AS* for a GTS (and *F106AB* for a GTB) plus the chassis number.
    The injected 308s got standard, 17-positions, VINs.

    Rgds
     
  15. wildcat326

    wildcat326 Formula 3
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    Finally, an answer. So, Ferrari DOES consider the VIN number of a 1979 US car to include 11 characters, not 5? Per Gordon's earlier post, I understand that the engine itself and steering column have different numbers (I was referring to the chassis stamping in the engine bay). But, if asked by a future Owner, Insurer, Auction House, etc, Ferrari SpA would say my VIN number F106ASxxxxx, correct?

    If so, then I will pursue this matter with the State. Otherwise I'm gonna let them revert it to the Wisconsin 5-digit version. Ultimately my question was WHAT DOES FERRARI CALL MY VIN?
     
  16. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
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    Justin,

    I BELIEVE (= I can't state it formally) that Ferrari would say that they do not consider that your car has got a VIN at all...
    The VIN, or "Vehicle International Number" is an internationaly established standard that only has 17 digits, or positions. There could not be such a thing as a 11 positions, 13 positions, or 15 positions VIN: a VIN has 17 positions, period.

    Before it was implemented (1979?), it did not exist, and any constructor was using the designation system they deemed fit to their needs. For Ferrari, your car is a 308 GTS, factory type F106AS (homologated in Italy under that designation), chassis number 27785. It has no VIN.

    The first Ferraris with a 17 position VIN were, as far as I know, some 400 in the 29xxx chassis number range.

    Rgds
     
  17. Dorsetgem

    Dorsetgem Karting

    Nov 15, 2014
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    When I registered mine in Australia, they couldn't find it on their system when they asked me for the VIN, as I gave them the Chassis number. After a stressful few minutes (thinking I may have been conned) they finally worked out that a VIN number is not a Chassis number. Well not on the Australian system.
     
  18. st@ven

    st@ven F1 Rookie

    Aug 4, 2008
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    I think it's worthless now indeed. I'll take it for lets say 15K to get you out of this misery.


    Honestly Wildcat. You are worth your name.....
    Not trying to be disrespectful but reading through your thread and now this. Before you act, think twice and follow the advise some gave you. I appreciate your enthusiasm but especially with Ferrari’s, think twice before you act, surf the net, get really used to the ins and outs. It will save you a lot of heartburn, and money.
     
  19. don_xvi

    don_xvi F1 Rookie

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    They screwed up reading the form they require to handle this process, they should get on with fixing it. And record the entire vehicle ID. A clerical error of this sort can't be uncorrectable.
     
  20. dinogt4guy

    dinogt4guy F1 Rookie

    Oct 31, 2004
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    I've had my 5 digit vin in Washington St and Texas no problem with either! The vin is only 5 digits.
     
  21. Meister

    Meister F1 Veteran
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    when I had my 1980 GTSi in WI the title only had the last five. When I moved to MN they switched it to the full vin without me doing anything. That doesn't help you much since you now have the car in IL, just some background info.
     
  22. greg 19425

    greg 19425 Formula 3

    Jan 6, 2011
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    AZ no problem with a 5-diget Vin. They did not even ask about it, just did it. Love AZ. :)
     
  23. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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    I'm in WA too and only have the 5 digit chassis number in place of the VIN. No issues. Although here to license it as a collector car I had to send the title in and they record the license plate number on the title. The best part is it's a one time fee and I can legally drive with no front plate.
     
  24. bpu699

    bpu699 F1 World Champ
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    Dec 9, 2003
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    Suprised wisconsin listed your mileage. When I got my titles for my testarossa and 930 they both said something to the effect "mileage unknown." The girl at the desk said they put that in for all cars over 20 years old... sigh...
     
  25. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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    Yep same here. Although now mine would read "in excess of mechanical limits" anyway since it's over 100K.
     

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