Has someone tuned 488 engine or experience? I plan to make a tune to around 750 hp engine power. Getrag DC -T 750 gearbox is like name says specified to 750 Nm torque, 860 Nm seems to be limit without modified gearbox software. At 488 I guess is clutch pressure higer than 458. But about 750 hp engine power is ok for me, due to extreme short gear ratios tires has also with 661 hp slip problems, I guess 0-100 mph are not much better with 90 extra hp. OBD 2 flashing is no more possible at Bosch MED 17 ECU. Hardware security module is in Infineon Tri - Core Controller monolithically integrated ( chip - card). But if opening ECU there is access to boot pin and via CAN - BUS tuning files can be uploaded. Housing of ECU at 488 is extremely fastened glued. Vou have to work al long time ( up to 1/2 hour) with " heating pistol". Some tuners drill a hole in housing to reach boot pin, but this hast to made with vacuum suction device without drilling shavings. (Hole in housing then closed with cram rubber). Here in Germany is price for ECU Tuning about 4000 Euros ( incl. VAT , prices negotiable.) Other way ist to use piggyback box. Regards Horst
I understand it's very radical and will make the car not road legal. However, would it be ultimately more flexible if one goes the adaptor harness and Motec or Syvec route? Anyone know how doable Motec and Syvec "plug and play" is? Of course, besides the hours of programming needed, hardware cost will likely be over US$10k.
For my target of 80- 100 hp surplus, 488 engine needs about 3 psi more boost, that is all, stock fuel injection valves are good for more than 850 hp. I talked to Capristo, his box is specified to 720 hp, but is not deliverable until now, but on Capristo home page showed at least since one year. The Capristo piggyback is relatively simple, only manipulating charge air sensors and manifold air pressure sensor, engine speed is read off from camshaft sensor, I had some experience on such simple piggyboxes on Mercedes DI turbo engines, but no convincing power results, no measured better acceleration times often, in some modern cars ECU detects piggyback boxes because of too high duty cycles of injection valves and can reduce boost pressure. Best piggyback for 488 is in my opinion Novitec N -Tronic box, this box includes also air mass flow meter in manipulation besides charge air and MAP sensors and can also read CAN - Bus data like speed or race mode and so tuning power can be put on race position of manettino, the basic box is same like Techart or Brabus uses, box works well in 991 turbo or C63 4.0 biturbo. Novitec takes 2 boxes, one for each cylinder bank. It is not an absolutely plug & play installation as you have to solder Can- Bus spy lead to cable train, at 991 turbo you can pin out Can - Bus plug and no soldering is necessary. As Novitec is close to my home, I will try to test a Novitec 488 with this box. Quoted power with stock exhaust of 756 hp should increase 100-200 kph acceleration times at about 10 %, 4.7 - 4.9 s should be feasible if box is working well. ECU flashing I would prefer, but if Ferrari flashes software update you loose tuning software. With OBD- 2 tuning you can save tuning software on programming handhelds like My Genius. But OBD 2 flashing is no more possible at 488. Novitec N - Tronic piggyback could be good solution, but before buying I need test drive and have to measure improvements of acceleration. Regards Horst
I have personally tuned a handful of 488's. I have done a few of the Novitec N-Tronic piggyback's, but a lot more of our bench flash tune we developed in-house on our Dynojet. There was really no data on Novitec's piggyback that we could find that shows actual dyno numbers as we offer. We remove the cover like you mentioned above and our tuner goes in and saves all the factory maps before anything so you can always convert back with ease, then utilizes our map he has developed that has picked up wonderful gains - all while being completely safe. Let me now if I can ever help with any questions you may have about optimizing the power in your 488. I have been involved with the R&D of our car extensively, so I would love to shine light on anything I can! Image Unavailable, Please Login
Do you realize Horst that all warranty on the 488 is OVER that way ? I have seen that once over here, owner very dissapointed with oem F dealer ... Is that worth the try ?
If you had a issue with the motor/trans. Ferrari would have to prove your modification caused the issue. Obviously they couldn't not cover the cars other systems because of engine mods as well. For example the radio stops working or a power steering pump or something like that would still be 100% covered.
Exactly, they'd have to have someone come in and prove any damage or failure was direct result of the ECU flash. The ECU can always be flashed back to stock map too if you have the chance prior to the car heading back to the dealership. The power gains honestly completely change the driving experience of the car, from throttle response to the entire power band until redline by over 100whp/wtq. [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNNlZNzTzEs[/ame]
Travis, you mentionned it yourself: " The power gains honestly completely change the driving experience of the car, from throttle response to the entire power band until redline by over 100whp/wtq." How about MODIS, will the notice any update ? What IF the dealer also finds that out ?
Yes, in response to when you asked is it worth the try. Your average Ferrari technician will not be able to tell by just plugging into the car. If they sent the ECU's out to higher ups and went really looking, they'd see something is on there if they really went digging. But since the tune is done via bench flash and not through the OBD-port, the flash counter will not be raised which is the first thing they would be looking at to tell if you have ECU work done. If they find out? Every dealer is different. I have had guys need to get some work done and the dealer knows 100% that the car is worked and they'll help out no questions asked, and I have seen it go the other way as well. I can say with our tune, is entirely within safe parameters - the car just had a ton stored up inside of it.
We should have our 488 tune available soon. There is so much potential in this engine. Ferrari left a lot of room for growth.
Other maps have to be modified when changing turbo pressure - but just basic timing/fuel/etc. Looking forward to see what you put out Shiv!
That is definitely component. But the more supporting mods you do, the less it plays a roll. It's not unusual for a car with supporting mods (downpipes, exhaust, HF cats) to make 100hp more than a car running stock hardware while still running the same boost level. The reduction of of exhaust back-pressure and intake charge temps will allow more ignition advance (which improves engine torque and the thermal efficiency) and less fuel dumping which is usually used to reduce cylinder temps and for knock suppression. Ferrari provided us with an awesome place to start! You too guys. Exciting to be tuning a twin turbo V8 again!
Torque is mostly what will hurt a transmission, not as much the horsepower output. We monitor transmission temperature and slippage all on our Dynojet to know if/when we are pushing the transmission outside of normal operating parameters. If we went up further from where we are now with the tune, I could see the trans getting hot and starting to slip. But zero issues how we offer it now.
I really like the Novitec Box's. It really is a good solution. The difference in power between the standard mode "SPORT" and the upgrade power "RACE" is certainly noticeable. I would encourage anyone who is interested to come by here and take our 488 for a spin!
So far as I know, no gearbox software for Getrag 750 DCT is available on tuning market, Mercedes GT has same gearbox, for Porsche ZF PDK software is available for up to 900 Nm, also reinforced clutches for more than 900 Nm torque. Warranty is sure an issue, but if you want to tune a car, you know this. May be I will wait another year, but in my life I always drove tuned engines, 6 Porsche 911 turbos and had no problems, but much fun. If I compare my 488 GTB to my 997.1 turbo with Softronic software and 200 cell cats and sports exhaust, so my 488 is 200-300 kph only a little bit faster, my Porsche has 860 Nm torque but only 590 hp. 100-140 kph my Porsche goes in 3. gear 2.0 s and 488 GTB in 1.8 s in manual race mode, in 4 th gear ( similiar ratio than Porsche in 3 rd ) same time 2.0 s 100-140 kph, same road, tank full, no co - driver, measured with Performance Box Over 200 kph 488 could be faster. Until 120 mph it is ok. But I guess, 488 engine has enormously potential up to 900-1000 hp
If you see dyno sheet from Fabspeed above, stock engine reaches max power at 6000- 6800 rpm, on dyno you have to switch at latest at 7400 rpm as at 7500 rpm rev limter hits, 8000 rpm you will never see on 488, only in specs. @ Travis ( Fabspeed) : Do you can remove speed limiter at 330 kph? Is possible to increase rev limiter to 7850 rpm like engine switches in LC mode? Regards Horst
In this video you can see it is al little bit work to open Bosch MED17 ECU https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ydZjNxw9cQs
For those with warranty concerns, and who don't want to spend the high figure for the Novitec tuning box, we do have our tuning box available. https://www.vividracing.com/catalog/2017-Ferrari-488-GTB-tuned-ecu-tuning-box-kit-ferrari-488-gtb-p-151343903.html $1600 MSRP. We've provided quite a few of them for the 488 and the similar option we offer for the Cali T as well. Ferrarichat members get 10% off and free shipping within the US, so $1440 delivered. This unit can be installed / uninstalled in roughly 30 minutes and doesn't leave a trace. Uses factory harnesses / connections. No cutting or splicing required. https://www.vividracing.com/catalog/2017-Ferrari-488-GTB-tuned-ecu-flash-tune-ferrari-488-gtb-p-151449514.html We also have our full custom bench flash available. This does require removal of ECU's and them to be shipped to us. On this, Ferrarichat members receive free overnight shipping each direction within the US. We provide you with an overnight label, and we then overnight it back to you free of charge. $2000 all in. -James
you gonna break your car, let me know your vin# so when its for sale with "minor modifications" or trying to sell it to a poor chap, I will make sure to stay away from it.
Where are Bosch ECU's located at 488? At my 430 behind seats, at 458 behind grid of rear wheels and at 488? If it is easy to remove, I make it myself and ship them to Tuner for remapping
This is Capristo piggyback, box has very, very simple manipulation, only boost pressure sensors, may be manipulation of 0.1 bar less boost pressure can work, as 488 has manifold airpressure sensor also and air flow mass sensor, manipulation only of boost pressure sensor has risks, if boost pressure is manipulated for ECU lower than manifold air pressure sensor value, ECU can detect piggyback and reduce boost pressure. Capristo specs 720 PS, price in Germany for the box 1690 Euro, but high price for an absolutely low cost solution Image Unavailable, Please Login
here connection layout of Capristo piggyback, extremely simple piggyback, only boost sensor left/right is manipulated. 1690 Euro is a lot money for a very simple box, if 720 hp are stable on long term, then ok, issue is, that ECU can detect piggyback on long term, fast dyno run can be tolerated Image Unavailable, Please Login
Sometimes, I wish for an open platform for tuning. Of course, I can imagine all the challenges that come with that.
