360 - 3D Printed Crankshaft Locking Tool (AV 3207) | FerrariChat

360 3D Printed Crankshaft Locking Tool (AV 3207)

Discussion in '360/430' started by EastMemphis, Aug 13, 2023.

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  1. EastMemphis

    EastMemphis Formula 3
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    May 25, 2019
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    John
  2. LorenzoR

    LorenzoR F1 Rookie
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    Awesome, great work
     
  3. colorfull

    colorfull Formula 3
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    Sep 12, 2020
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    John Napoli
  4. RedNeck

    RedNeck F1 World Champ
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    Honestly, this is probably a much better solution that the HE or Ferrari version because it may allow you to lock the crank at or near TDC. You are doing the Lord's work here, John.

    My only concern is strength, will it bend or buckle under the stress of loosening the crank pulley bolt since they apparently need to be tightened at 200 million ft lbs?
     
    EastMemphis likes this.
  5. GCalo

    GCalo F1 Veteran

    Sep 15, 2004
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    Greg Calo
    John is very astute with his engineering.

    I would be he has taken into consideration the strength factors knowing the application.

    I would bet that the file could be converted so the part could also be CNC'd in metal
     
    Kevin Rev'n, RedNeck and EastMemphis like this.
  6. EastMemphis

    EastMemphis Formula 3
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    May 25, 2019
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    I loosened my crank bolt with zero flex in the tool. The feel was very firm and I gave it a good impulse (whole body tug on a 22" breaker bar) to loosen the crank nut. I haven't torqued it back yet but I put in enough force to loosen the thing as it would take to torque it, probably a lot more. No issues. The tool looks untouched.

    The reason why I selected the toothed gear over the clutch housing like the factory tool, is that the toothed gear offered multiple points where stress would occur, and also the stress would be in multiple directions, most were compressive, which bodes well for plastic parts. The most important reason is that the toothed gear is very close to the edge of the opening so the moment arm of the force would be shorter than if I was using the clutch housing, which is smack in the middle of the inspection cavity. I also added two plugs that go into the access holes in the transaxle to keep the forces on the screws to a minimum. The twisting force imparted on the tool would be absorbed by the two posts in the holes, which would lessen the force on the screws.

    I used PLA (Amazon basic Black) and printed at 0.2mm thickness, 0.4mm nozzle, and 80% infill. My printer is a Prusa MK3S+.

    @GCalo - The .stl should be able to be directly carved with a CNC. I removed the negative draft angles on the gear teeth so that the tool would slide straight up onto the gear. That would allow machining from the vertical axis. I thought about making it out of aluminum, like the factory tool, but that would require a large billet to end up with a small tool, so printing it is far more efficient. Besides, the aluminum tool is way overkill. The weak part in this design are the small (3mm) screws holding the inspection cavity plate in place. They are tiny. By moving the stress from the screws to the access holes in the transaxle, I was able to use just two screws and they essentially keep it from falling out.

    I spend too much time staring at stuff.
     
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  7. GCalo

    GCalo F1 Veteran

    Sep 15, 2004
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    "The reason why I selected the toothed gear over the clutch housing like the factory tool is that the toothed gear offered multiple points where stress would occur, and also the stress would be in multiple directions"

    My exact point

    This makes far more sense to me than the OEM or HE tools for the reason of the attaching point

    Well done, John.
     
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  8. EastMemphis

    EastMemphis Formula 3
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    #8 EastMemphis, Aug 13, 2023
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2023
    One interesting tidbit about this project.

    In order to get the grabbing part of the tool right, I needed to model the flywheel and the toothed gear. I had trouble finding the diameter of the flywheel, and it's a btch to measure, so I asked Bard and ChatGPT and they both gave the same answer: 10.5". That was good enough for me to get the teeth and curvature of the gear right on the first iteration. Thanks AI!

    There are 64(ish) teeth on the flywheel gear so that gives a 6 degree resolution as to where it can lock. I'll know in a few days if that also lines up with TDC as I'm doing a belt service.
     
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  9. Flyingbrick242

    Flyingbrick242 Formula Junior
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    Feb 26, 2017
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    Northern AZ.
    Well done.!
    I don't have a 360 but the tool should still work for the 430 unless I am mistaken..could come in handy if you want to secure the engine while removing or torquing the PP plate or flywheel.

    I see a group buy for F chatters in the future...hoping anyway..
    Thanks.
     
  10. EastMemphis

    EastMemphis Formula 3
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    It's free (well, $2.16 for the filament). All you need is a 3D printer that prints PLA well. That should be virtually any decent 3D printer.
     
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  11. EastMemphis

    EastMemphis Formula 3
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    I finished my belt job and torqued up the crankshaft bolt to the right specs. The crankshaft locking tool worked perfectly. I noticed some distortion on the leading edges of the teeth of the tool. It seems like the removal of the bolt took more torque than the setting. I suppose that's from Loctite.

    Here's the tool after using it:

    Image Unavailable, Please Login

    This amount of distortion is completely tolerable but since it's plastic, those distortions would be additive and the tool would eventually fail if used often enough. I would suggest a maximum of two belt changes be performed with this tool before discarding and printing another. Since the tool only costs a few dollars to print, I further suggest chucking it in the trash after a single belt change. Just print another when needed. No sense in keeping it around for years.
     
  12. rizzo308

    rizzo308 F1 Rookie
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    Wow john... u da man !! thank you so much.
     
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  13. BillyD

    BillyD Formula 3
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    Thanks
    Tho I'm not a 360 owner at the moment, I see it in my future.
     
  14. jim94-348

    jim94-348 Formula Junior
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    Aug 19, 2010
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    Hi,
    Great post here. I am new to 3D printing. I bought an AnkerMake M5C printer and some black AnkerMake PLA+ filament. When I try to remove the bolt the teeth snapped off. I tried printing it a couple more times with the same outcome. I am using 80% infile, 0.2mm thickness, 0.4mm nozzle. The part fits well (first one was warped) but I guess someone over-torqued the bolt. Anyone have a suggestion on a different filament or anything I can try?
     
  15. 066/8

    066/8 Karting

    Sep 29, 2023
    217
    - Check if the height of your nozzle (relative ro the printers bed is set correctly)

    - Changing the orientation of the print might work, but not sure if that is really worth it.

    - Adapting the design: wider teeth and radii (i.e. fillets) at the tooth roots
     
  16. jim94-348

    jim94-348 Formula Junior
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    Quick Update:
    I increased the temperature so that all layers were 230C from 230C for the first layers and then 200C for the remainder. I was able to get the bolt loose after reprinting. Can't wait to get the belts finished tonight and to get the car running again. Thank you EastMemphis for the suggestions and help!
     
  17. sltillim

    sltillim Formula 3
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    Nov 22, 2009
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    @EastMemphis - just want to say thank you for sharing your IP and all here for sharing your best printing practices. For all those who don't have a printer, there are services like Xometry (and many others) that do 3rd party 3D printing - I think if East Memphis is okay with it. But they need guidelines and material specs for printing. I don't plan on purchasing a 3d printer but understand the value.

    I am a complete noob at all of this - I am learning on the free Fusion 360 Personal to specifically help on a 360 engine trans swap project which i will shortly announce in the 360/430 forum and one other fchat model specific forum. I am going to be doing some cool stuff and contributing ideas and designs for the greater good, like you guys. So I am sorry if my kindergarten level suggestions here are not helpful.

    WAIT.... Ferrari 360 - Fusion 360 !?! I think we have something here!

    Since you are discussing printing techniques and such - I recently have been following this guy on youtube. This is all about printing from the car hobbyist perspective. Part of this is a non-commercial for the printer he is using and getting good results. At 12:48 he discusses best filaments for test vs. final working parts and tools. Again, sorry if this is Wheel of Fortune to your Jeopardy conversation. At very least, I feel this guy is one of us and is not cheesy and my kind of humor. He built an off road Viper and is building a land speed car.



    Cheers,
    Spencer
     
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  18. kaj750

    kaj750 Formula Junior

    May 9, 2022
    260
    Fresno, CA
    Just tried this today. My 3D printed tool shattered in a three pieces lol
    I guess the guy that printed it for me did it differently. Looking at the broken pieces, the part almost looks like a honeycomb on the inside. I expected it to be solid All the way through.
    Guess I will be donating an organ to get a proper tool. Lol
     
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  19. 67bmer

    67bmer F1 Rookie
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    lol - there is a lot to know about printing! Getting things done, they assume you only care about the outside appearance and they fill the interior with less dense less expensive filler. There is no way a filled one would have enough strength! If you tried hard enough, you could probably crush it between your fingers.
     
  20. 066/8

    066/8 Karting

    Sep 29, 2023
    217
    The honeycomb inside is typical for 3d printed parts (It significantly reduces weight while keeping reasonable mechanical properties.)

    Perhaps it
    Yeah, parameters matter. I have the HE tool, if not, I'd print with the settings specified by @EastMemphis (i.e. 80% infill).
     
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  21. 67bmer

    67bmer F1 Rookie
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    FYI - I bought the Hill tool from an Fchatter. Mine is not perfect! The screw holes do not line up exactly! Mine needs to be modified to increase the slot widths to be able to use their shoulder bolts.
     
  22. kaj750

    kaj750 Formula Junior

    May 9, 2022
    260
    Fresno, CA
    Agreed. I didn't try, but I'm pretty sure I can snap in half with my hands. Sure does look cool, though! Lol


    I'm bummed. He printed it for free, so my plan was to use it and then give it away to the next guy who needed one. Trying to save somebody a few hundred dollars.
    For the price of a 3D printed part, I can buy my own printer and do it the right way, then hand those out for enough to cover the cost of filament.
     
  23. Djack005

    Djack005 Karting
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    Oct 13, 2024
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    67bmer, flash32 and EastMemphis like this.
  24. jtn0514

    jtn0514 Rookie

    Aug 16, 2024
    26
    Austin, TX
    Just want to say thanks to @EastMemphis for making these tools available. I'm sure others have done this 1000x, however just need to continue to state they're extremely helpful and designed well and great for the community.
     
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  25. 67bmer

    67bmer F1 Rookie
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    How are people getting their driver side belt cover off without removing the cooling pipe? I don't recall that being possible...

    When I got my car, inspecting the belts was one of my highest priorities and I couldn't get the cover(s) off.
     

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