375 MM Coupé 0402 AM ex-Rossellini SEIZED | FerrariChat
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375 MM Coupé 0402 AM ex-Rossellini SEIZED

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by Marcel Massini, Jan 18, 2025.

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  1. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #1 Marcel Massini, Jan 18, 2025
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 18, 2025
    From today's renowned Italian newspaper "Corriere della Sera".
    0402 AM, ex-Shirley, then Destriero Collection (Timm Bergold, honorary consul from Germany in Monaco) appears to have been confiscated (seized) by the Italian Government. Also involved three further classic cars including an Alfa Romeo 8C 2900 B Lungo.
    0402 AM is valued at 30 Million Euros, the Alfa at 27 Million Euros, per the newspaper report.
    Also stated: Six requested arrests and disqualification measures for fake arbitration awards and false PRA transcripts.

    Marcel Massini

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  2. Aardy

    Aardy F1 Veteran
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    #2 Aardy, Jan 18, 2025
    The pic in the newspaper shows 0402AM... :confused:
     
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  3. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #3 Marcel Massini, Jan 18, 2025
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2025
    IMPORTANT CORRECTION:
    Chassis number is 0402 AM.
    NOT 0456 AM.
    My sincere apologies.

    Marcel Massini
     
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  4. Aardy

    Aardy F1 Veteran
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    #4 Aardy, Jan 18, 2025
    Never mind ! Incredible news !
     
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  5. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    #5 miurasv, Jan 18, 2025
    On what grounds have the cars been confiscated?
     
  6. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #6 Marcel Massini, Jan 18, 2025
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2025
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  7. readplays

    readplays F1 Rookie

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    #7 readplays, Jan 18, 2025
    You know what they say: FAFO.

    While perhaps distressing news for some, it could be worse. Alfa could have been a Corto. :D
     
  8. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #8 Marcel Massini, Jan 18, 2025
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  9. merstheman

    merstheman F1 Rookie

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    #9 merstheman, Jan 18, 2025
    Can someone explain the full story here?
     
  10. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    #10 miurasv, Jan 18, 2025
  11. merstheman

    merstheman F1 Rookie

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    #11 merstheman, Jan 18, 2025
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  12. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    #12 miurasv, Jan 18, 2025
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2025
    0402 AM was nothing to do with PF. Article is wrong. 0402 AM was rebodied by Scaglietti to a Scaglietti design, not Pininfarina.
     
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  13. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #13 Marcel Massini, Jan 18, 2025
    0402 AM started life as a 375 MM Spider with Pinin Farina body in 1954 and was then rebodied by Scaglietti in 1955.
    The old Italian registration document for plate Roma 213712 describes the bodywork as "spyder aperta" (open spyder), it is from 30 November 1954, almost two months after Rossellini raced the 375 MM PF Spider at Kanonloppet in Karlskoga, Sweden (on 3 October 1954), in the sports car class on race #43 and DNF.

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  14. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    #14 miurasv, Jan 18, 2025
    Of course it is universally known that 0402 AM started life as a Pinin Farina Spyder and was rebodied by Scaglietti after it was damaged. My reference wsa to the incorrect Pininfarina redesign info in the newspaper article.
     
  15. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 World Champ

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    #15 Nembo1777, Jan 18, 2025
    Unreadable.

    You CANNOT just dump a complex text into Google translate or similar without editing it afterwards.

    This is a clear example of that. FYI I have done professional translations since 1989, including several books.

    For simple posts on fchat it works but not for this kind of article, specially anything to do with law absolutely not.
     
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  16. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    #16 miurasv, Jan 18, 2025
    Quite right, Marc. But I did get some of the gist of the article from the poor Google Translate screenshot so plesae can we have the benefit of your linguistic skills and have a good translation of the main points of the article.
     
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  17. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 World Champ

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    #17 Nembo1777, Jan 18, 2025
    To be honest the article is very confusing and I am not a legal expert, in any language...but will give it a shot tomorrow morning, busy today.
     
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  18. merstheman

    merstheman F1 Rookie

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    #18 merstheman, Jan 18, 2025
    Easier, not easiest. I have some grasp of Italian (not so far from Portuguese and French which I speak a lot better) so I filled in the blanks. Still, you can get the gist of it there.
     
  19. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 World Champ

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    #19 Nembo1777, Jan 19, 2025
    No further comment, the original article is a confusing mess to start with.
     
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  20. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

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    #20 turbo-joe, Jan 19, 2025
    may be an Italian native speaking member perfect in english could translate?
     
  21. amenasce

    amenasce Three Time F1 World Champ
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    #21 amenasce, Jan 19, 2025
    So mr taxman didn't get their cut on a 60 years old car that was already taxed multiple times and is angry?
     
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  22. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #22 Marcel Massini, Jan 19, 2025
    I can only assume it has possibly more to do with indicating incorrect values (lower than actually paid)?

    Marcel Massini
     
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  23. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

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    #23 turbo-joe, Jan 19, 2025
    the value today is much different than some time ago
     
  24. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #24 Marcel Massini, Jan 19, 2025
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2025
    The Italian registration document from November 1954, 71 years ago (see post 13), declared a value of four (4) million Italian Lire. That was probably approx. US$ 6'400 at the time (1954 US Dollars $, of course).
    Article states 0402 AM is valued today at 30 Million US Dollars $. That would be 4'687 times more. All according to google.

    Marcel Massini
     
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  25. jhgomezphoto

    jhgomezphoto Karting

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    #25 jhgomezphoto, Jan 19, 2025
    Marcel (or anyone with enough background to judge), what do you think about that $30 Million estimation? Could it be correct?

    Jorge HG
     
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