Hi Gang My 89 328 (19000 km) has recently developed a strange problem. When I last tried taking it for a run I found that I was unable to select a gear... The engine starts and runs fine, but depressing the clutch pedal and trying to select a gear results in a graunching noise - possibly indicative of the clutch still being engaged. I have tried the process several times after warming the car, all to no avail. In addition I have jacked up the car and checked the cable run and the adjusters - all of this looks fine. Any ideas as to what's causing this? I'm considering trying to start the car in gear with the clutch pedal depressed as a last diy resort. Only hassle is I'm not sure what the consquences of this would be for the starter / starter pinion / ring gear etc... Thanks for any help in advance! Kind regards Ken
Please dont consider driving the car Ken if you have to start the car in gear. What happens when you have to stop at a stop sign/red light and you have to dis-engage the clutch?? You could cause an accident brother. Do you know how to adjust the clutch?? You checked it,but does it need adjustment?
The clutch adjustment should be fine - the car ran 100% last time I took it out. Plus it has just been for a service. It just seems as if it has somehow become stuck to the pressure. Not to worry I have no intention of moving the car under its own power until this issue has been sorted out...
How about the clutch pedal adjustment. Does the pedal still feel the same when you depress it?? And is it sitting in around the same place as it used to?Just taking at stab in the dark here,but my 348 did the same thing. Last xmas,drove the car one day,everything was great. Went to drive it the next morning,couldnt get any gears. Thought i had to let it warm up,which i do anyways. Still no luck. I then suspected a collapsed clutch presuure plate diaphram. I pulled the clutch pumpkin apart and found broken pressure plate diaphram fingers. Not saying you are in the same boat,but it may be best to take it back to the guys that did the service to check it out for you? Heres a pic of my broken pressure plate Image Unavailable, Please Login
Hi Given your sudden loss of gear selection, My educated guess is that the clutch is most likley ok and the shift shaft has rotated due to a loose lock nut and as a consequence, the selectors are misaligned. It is quite easy to check if this is the culprit form inspection under the car. When you are under there check to see if the clutch cable is acting on the lever arm located under the belhousing and nothing involving that mechinism is broken(you will need an assistant to opperate the clutch pedal. You should also be able to hear the release bearing slightly with the clutch engaged the noise goes away when the clutch is depresed if it is acting on the spring fingers, the engine will also increase in rpm very slightly as the gear box is disengaged. Best of luck Jeremy Dixon
Thanks for all the feedback - my sense of the most likely cause is that one of the clutch fingers may have popped as the gears will select with the car not running. Question is still whether or not could try starting the car in gear with the clutch pedal depressed. Would this damage anything???
Another possible problem I know of is your disk and pressure plate may have rusted together. This happens in areas of high humidity. There is a method to break it free, but, unfortunately, I don't remember since I live in a desert. You can drive it just fine without the clutch. I would put it in 2nd and use the starter to get it going. You can shift carefully, matching revs, especially on down shifts. When coming to a stop, push it into neutral, turn off the motor, put it in gear again when stopped and start again. I did this once for about 50 miles with a broken cable. You may want to let the car wrm up good in neutral first to reduce the load on the starter. Dave
If the car has been parked up for a while, I'd start with the simple things and Hardtop's suggestion of a rusted clutch plate is a good place to start. This is not uncommon, although normally associated with cars that have stood for a long time. I've heard all sorts of daft remedies like pouring a can of Coke into the cluch (so the acid eats the rust), similarly alloy wheel cleaning agent (phosporhic acid) would work... These ideas are great on knackered junkyard cars worth £300 ($500), but not really sensible on a valuable piece of engineering such as a 328. I'd try gentle persuassion. Securely mount car on solid axle stands. Put it into gear, then start engine to spin everything over... Work clutch pedal, listen for any engine tone changes or release bearing squeal. Step 2, switch off engine, get somebody to hold down clutch pedal and then work wheels back and forth to jolt clutch against the static engine (car in gear 1). Better done with two at the back people working both wheels in same direction, so that the second wheel doesn't free contra-rotate through the differential. Any better? if not continue... Stop engine, shift to 3rd or 4th gear... (If transmission doesn't want to shift, get somebody to turn your rear wheels until the gearbox is lined up...) Restart engine and allow to run. Now continue to work clutch pedal, but (while the clutch pedal is down) use heel and toe braking (or handbrake) induce some steadily increasing drag/load through the transmission and clutch. Try just pulsing the brakes, rather than winding up a huge drag load... Hopefully, when you press the clutch pedal the spring plate will unload the clutch plate, so the only grip it has is due to the (assumed) rust. With a bit of luck you should hear a "clunk" and the back wheels will stop, as the clutch plate lets go! Repeat until successful OR you are sure this isn't working. If nothing else, this costs nothing and is relatively kind to the mechanical parts. Try not to overheat your rear brakes in the process... If this doesn't work, move onto investigation involving dismantling things and mechanic's bills! GOOD LUCK
Thank you all for the advice. I have tried combinations and permutations of all and have decided to bite the bullet and replace the clutch. It is likely to be marginal at this age and mileage anyway. Is there a detailed procedure somewhere in the archives? I would like to tackle the job myself if its not too hectic. I've overhauled (Ford) engines and autoboxes before so am not entirely clueless in the mechanic space... Thanks and regards Ken
Ken If the clutch pedal feels normal and nothing has broken since you last drove the car try this. I have had this happen several times on 328/308/TR,s what you need to do is quite simple and will not hurt the car or the clutch. put the car into first gear push the clutch pedal down start the engine hold the clutch pedal down the whole time while the car is moving then accelerate the engine. What will happen is the clutch will pop loose of the flywheel. after this happens you can drive it normally. If this doesnt work then replace the clutch. The clutch disc will someimes get stuck to the flywheel after sitting due moisture from washing the engine or humidity.
There is one other possibility which happened to me, thsi has got to be fairly low probability though. I had the same problem on a 308, when I took the clutch apart eveything was perfect and I saw nothing wrong until just before I was about to put back on the pressure plate. Then I found out the problem..... While adjusting timing on my car somehow a 12 mm nut had fallen into the removable cap on the bell housingand had lodged itself in between the inner/ outer plates on the pressure plate so that even on full movement of the clutch the pressure plate was not moving on one part of the diameter and the result was that the clutch felt permanently engaged, simple fix was to remove the nut. You might find you have some form of debris in these between the two pressure plates. Anyway as you can select gears with the engine off it must be a clutch problem so just take it apart and have a look, will be something simple
There's a pretty good clutch service write-up in the Expensivecar.com online service manual. Go to: http://www.camerafilters.com/ec/ & click on the word Ferrari. If you haven't already done so, go to Steve Jenkens private document collection (search arvhives for link) It has a 328 WSM, & a 328 tech specs/recalls along with parts catalogs for other 3x8s. The 308 FPC there will help you see how the clutch goes together.
Get plenty clear space in front of the car. Put the car in fifth. Depress the clutch fully. Turn the key briefly. If the car tugs forward, then the clutch is not releasing. The clutch could be fubar or stuck. If stuck, doing the above may unstick it. Dont do it more than once or you will fubar the starter. However unlikely, if you suspect a stuck clutch.. try push the car in first gear, with the clutch depressed. If you cannot push it, then the clutch may be stuck. If you can push it ... the clutch is not stuck, but rather fubar. If you cannot push it, it may be stuck, then try rocking it by pushing the car backwards and forwards with the clutch depressed to try break it free. Be quite firm with her. but My feeling is that it's most likely that the clutch plate is fubar. Skin.
Thanks for all the advice guys - I'm going to try the starter trick but don't want to b*gger up anything else so will do it carefully.... Have tried rocking the car with it in gear and the clutch pedal depressed and had no joy. Will get back to ya' all... but it seems as if the total cost of ownership of this 328 is about to go up somewhat.. :-( Cheers Ken
All the parts for a clutch job should be less than $400 & you'll have a new clutch. Maybe another $150 to have your flywheel surface machined flat & balance the flywheel & pressure plate together. So you're looking at $500 - $600. As F* repair costs go, this is dirt cheap. BTW, the 3x8 clutch is the easiest clutch to service of any car I've every worked on. You don't have to pull the engine, or even the tranny! You will need to buy or borrow the special ring nut tool to remove the transfer gear from the end of the trans. input shaft. BTW, there's a little ring like spacer that slides over the C-clip on the shaft. It often gets scraped off & drops down inside the bell housing while you're removing the bell housing. Easily fished out with a magnet once you know it's there.
Thanks guys - tomorrow is a public holiday over here so hopefully I'll be able to complete the investigations and testing process. Have pre-emptively investigating ordering the clutch bits. Verell, $400 sounds awfully cheap (by SA standards) for the parts - is that OEM stuff? Local costs run at around R7000 (around $1100) as far as I know... Cheers Ken
Ken, FYI: Since my 30K major I've had the exact same problem twice.... Both times after I let the car sit after a good San Diego Rain. ( rare for us ) I tried the rocking thing while in gear and no-go ! It didnt work .. Here is what worked... 1) I warmed the car up for 15 minutes.... 2) Started the car in gear (while going down my driveway) {I'm on a hill } 3) I drove down the block hitting the gas and pumping the clutch ( jerky ) Then It broke free.....!! The first time it happened I was having my garage floor epoxied and the car sat for 6weeks and it rained pretty good a few times. That required a lot of jerking to break free!!! The second time it happened (16Months later), the car sat for 20 days while I was in Ireland and it rained also. That broke free pretty quick .. in 4 yrs that's the only problem I've ever had... Now the car stays in the garage ! Hope that helps ! Patrick ** Note: leaving the car out of gear wont help ! There's a thread on f-chat that gave me some insight !
Hello All, I know this thread is older but I wanted to comment. I absolutely love Ferrari Chat. I bought my 328 almost a year ago and have been able to address various issues with help from all of you. I have had no problems with the transmission, clutch, etc. Took the car for some final work, in this case a total polishing of the car with ceramic coating and sealer to be applied. The guy called me that he could not engage any of the gears. I ran over and checked the linkage, I checked the tranny fluid, it was so full some leaked out and it was clean. Finally, after reading the comments here, I figured the clutch plate had stuck. As recommended, with the car turned off, I put it into first gear, depressed the clutch, and had someone rock the car back and forth and, PRESTO!, the plate released and I was back in business. Thanks so much. Ivan
You will need the special socket to undo the locking not on the lower drop gear & some anaerobic sealant to put the drop gear case back on. Otherwise its fairly standard stuff. https://www.ferrariparts.co.uk/Diagram/Ferrari/328-GTB-GTS-(1988)/026-Gearbox-Transmission shows the basic layout. There is a tutorial for a 308 here: http://www.birdman308.com/service/clutch/308_clutch_replacement.htm There are a couple of small differences with the way the 328 is put together but if you look at the respective parts diagrams you will see. Probably worth taking the flywheel off & checking the RMS while you are at it.
