Hi Nathan, I have all your earlier Ferrari books and would encourage you to do this. The beauty is that on this site there is a collective "brains trust" from around the world with a passion and wealth of knowledge for each model in the 308 range. Guys like Alberto in Italy on the 208/Turbo cars, Nerofer in France on the 328, Martin on euro carby 308 GTB/S, Big Tex on same USA market cars, Dr Tommy on 308 QV USA market cars, myself on RoW 308 qv etc: ( Apologies to anyone who I may have left out!)..... I find the differences in the models for different world markets fascinating in particular! I'm sure we would all help to create the definitive book on the topic? As the Nike ad slogan says "Just do it!" Grim
No harm done, Martin. We discussed a book with "Triple Black" and two or three other friends a few years ago, and came to the conclusion that we were not ready, this for a number of reasons. For once, five years ago, we were still missing the exact time schedule of the apparition of many details during the production of these cars. [And we still miss a few, by the way, such as why there is a jump in engine numbers during the 328 production, from # 3300 to #10000 (= no engine with a number between 3300 and 10000); why a few 328s during the production, between 80450 and 80650 received "older" engines in the 103xx range instead of the more normal 165xx range; when did the - flat - spare wheel change from aluminium to gunmetal color, etc, etc...] so at the time we came to the conclusion that nothing definitive could be printed, and this is why we decided on an Internet site, which is maintained by "Triple Black", as it allows more flexibility to add new information or correct things and put them right when the information is available. Then was the question of the scope of a potential book. There is indeed a decision to be taken on what to include and the level of detail wanted; if it has to be a comprehensive book describing the cars' evolution, engine, transmission, parts, tool rolls, brochures, luggage, etc... in great details, on the line of the "Dino Compendium" (not to say anything about serial numbers...) then one book is clearly not possible: it has to be at least four volumes: one for the 308GT4, one for the 308 GTB/GTS, one for the 328, one for the "other variants": Turbos, etc...the proof of this is Alberto's book on the Turbo cars: there is enough material on the "Turbo" cars already for one book. And finally there is the question of the work involved, which also means an author. As for myself, one thing is sure, I can be of no help whatsoever; I do not consider myself as qualified enough to handle the cars that I know best in that family (= the 328s) and furthermore, certainly I am not persistent or courageous enough to write a book; I'm probably one of the laziest person on earth and keep delaying things: for instance, I have promised a page on tool rolls for the 308-328 site to "Triple Black" that I keep postponing... Keep safe! Rgds
I have several 308/328 books for sale in case anyone’s interested. Actually in addition to those I have lots of Ferrari books as well, for sale Greg Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
Hello, Regarding myself, I can only confirm everything that nerofer said. We decided to make an online site because it is more accessible to everyone, then it allows us to have feedback, questions, comments that allow progress. No-one never try to address the author of a book to submit a clarification ... one just take him down in comments on a forum... The compendium was the benchmark in terms of standing, but positioning itself as a constantly growing wiki was also for us, an interesting prospect. I am often asked to do a paper version of the site on the 308 but we had from the start with all the authors, a level of requirement that makes such a business impossible as it is. The Bluemel was a bible for me when I bought my 308 and it has been the reference for a very long time. Only it came out in 1997, and therefore we have over 20 years of additional knowledge. Some of the books cited above contain much less errors, such as the last one by Robert Foskett which is really of good quality. Transforming all the knowledge that we have compiled on our site is a big job that would only have the defect of being frozen in time. Apart from this, we make very regular corrections of date, layout, addition of details .... and the iconography of the site, which is very rigorous, is impossible to buy as it is, copyright management would be a nightmare. Some pictures come from the end of the world, and cannot be easily redone (there are a good thousand pictures). Here, however, I am willing to share all this and much more if such a book is in the works rather than seeing this information looted (without even sometimes changing the syntax of the sentences) as is so often the case on the social networks without citation of the authors ... (I am not alone, we are a true community, I just take care of the technical interface so I appear more frequently) Finally, a little note to clarify Alberto's words about the only elements that are worthwhile, namely the manual and the spare parts catalog, I completely agree, only there are as many catalogs as there are versions (and so, manuals).. Plus the updates, it's a lot to know by heart .... (there are already nearly ten for the only version with carburetor) I started to buy them all in their original version to offer them online with a quality much higher than the copies that can be found for purchase but I cannot put them in free access, they are under the copyright of the factory... A beautiful and nice project certainly in perspective.
a book is much more difficult to produce and complete than a webpage or a facebook page. The copyright is always a problem for a book, while usually is not on a web page. A good idea would be to put together all the Manuals and the technichal updates Ferrari Service department produced during years, adding some notes given by our ecxperience, but this is impossible due to Ferrari Copyright. On my one I could have put many Ferrari official drawings, tech pages from the Italian Motor Department (with official performance data, measured, data you won't find anywhere else) and so on, but they are all Copyright protected. So it's not easy at all to add something new on a book: I could add something new asking to the ones involved, as you can write what they tell you. Pay attention to Copyright before starting the project and good luck for this exciting idea! ciao
Hahahaha! Copyrights??? Having looked at the website somebody listed a bit earlier I see that a series of my 308/328 photos were simply stolen from my posts, not caring about copyrights at all. Welcome to the new crazy world. So easy to simply steal photos and put on your own website............and then become automatically an expert...... Nobody cares about intellectual property. Copy and paste. As simple as that. What a shame. Marcel Massini
Marcel do you agree there is a market opening for a fully comprehensive reference book on the 308/328 series which up till now does not exist ?
No. I do not. There are already at least ten individual 308/328 books in several languages. None is perfect, of course. Plus countless articles in magazines all over the planet. With a bit of time and personal effort one can easily find a massive amount of information. Marcel Massini
I had the same problem with a website I had (not Ferrari related). The problem in the US is that unless you register your copyright, it's not enforceable. And if you do register it, are you willing to spend the money to enforce it?
Which ones do you actually rate Marcel? I have at least 7 books on the 308/328 series and all are fair at best. None come close to a Dino Compendium or even a Joe Stackey Ferrari 288 or Muira book. I think the 308 is an important enough model that deserves that sort of reference book.
So true...countless articles all over the planet, but how many good ones? How many are at least "adequately researched"? (Not "thoroughly" researched, simply "adequately") Almost all these articles, even the most recent ones, repeat over and over again the same mistakes regarding the same old matters (the weight of the "Vetroresinas" at 1090 kgs; or the "712 vetroresinas production"; or "the bulged wheels on the serie 2 328s meaning ABS", etc, etc...) NONE brings any interesting matters regarding the production figures at least for the main markets, not to mention the smaller ones (number of RHD cars produced for other markets than U.K and Australia, for instance; number of cars in South America today?); NONE brings any interesting information regarding the engine numbering system / principle... Note that I'm not asking for the most detailled information, for instance evolution of the tool rolls, that would be for the more perverse among us...or for pointing out that the factory sold the "serie 2" cars with the revised suspension from February 1988 to September 1988 with an owner's manual that gives the former suspensions settings (camber, toe in...) that were wrong for the revised suspension... As for myself, I have stopped reading and buying anything about these cars a long time ago, because I'm tired of the same duplications and reproductions without some research beforehand, meaning that the same incorrect information is printed over and over again. Rgds As for books, the Bluemel is not that bad; it has a few errors, but not too many, and gives adequate coverage of the differences of the models. Dirk-Michael Konradt's book (Autos, die Geschichte machten, Die Ferrari 308 und 328, 1990) is by far not perfect but has many interesting information and annexes, but you have to read German, These are the two that I use. I have a personal principle that if I haven't openend a book again after five years, its use is "limited" shall we say; and these two are those that I do open from time to time. (My old education forbids me to say anything about Alberto's book, as he is a friend, and you are not supposed to gives credit to a friend publicly, so I won't say that his book is very good and thoroughly researched)
Correct, Bruno. A ton of mistakes, some even on Ferrari official site. You can do a book and add something new or, at least, correct: the 255 hp, the 1090 kg story (a b....hit) and so on. Who reads Fchat knows they are stupidity, but many (famous) writers doesn't care: they just copy without spendind any time to learn if what they copy is correct or not. Ciao
If I may, we had a conversation about the subjects of the photos I wanted to upload long before they were used (in December 2018). It was a tour of the factory in the company of several members of the CCF who introduced me to you. I regret that you were offended to see them again. I am at your disposal to talk about it but you had given me permission to use low-quality images for the internet. Copyrighting is the whole part of my job so I know the problem very well, that's why I'm so careful about it.
And the moral of the story is: We need a 308/328 Compendium which can compete with the Matthias Bartz Dino Compendium. But I see a lot of negative talk here, which does focus on concerns rather than creativity. I thought this being a typical german attitude, but have to see, that some neighboured countries are just as bad. Means, we need someone, who just dares to do it. Regarding copyright: From the beginning of this discussion I promoted a cooperation project created by owners and therefore I am sure there could be an agreement about copyrights. What we would need for a cooperation project, would be an experienced book author who put things together. Who is coordinating things and "adjusts" the style how it's written. Like Nathan. @alberto: none of the "bibles" corrected the VINs. Our Carb GTBs still don't exist within the works of the self-proclaimed historians. BTW; talking about the Dino Compendium. I am in lively contact with Matthias Bartz these days sharing old stories about my dad's Dino 308 GT4, sending him contemporary pictures of my family's ownership and trying to convince him to publish a second issue of the english language Dino Compendium. And I feel, that the Dino Compendium was just a labour of love. Therefore I think, the best result we could get with a 308/328 compendium would come from contributors who do NOT earn their livings with anything Ferrari. Best Martin
I would have a book by Nathan even if the subject were already well covered, just for its worth as an object, because I know it will be much more than a dry source of information, even though I can also be certain it will have been researched to the Nth degree. Those who own or have read any of his books will know what I mean. I will commit to purchase a copy of a GT4-328 book as soon as he accepts reservations, just as I did with his 550/575 book.
Yes Jack. Nathan's books are among the best. The 550 doesn't interest me at all, but his 512BB book is in my top ten among my 400 automotive books. But like said above, I would love to see him as a coordinator and final lector of a cooperation project between longtime owners, technicians and home mechanics. And I think, such way it could become a great result even avoiding Marcel's copyrighted pictures. In Ferrari relations the cars are not so rare and the worldwide community is huge. Best from Germany Martin
Much less than about F40. And not about F40? Why only about 308? I think this happens for every Ferrari, expecially the ones from the seventies onwards... I'm not an F40 expert, but (looks incredible) I even added something new about F40 on my book, and without considering that several Ferrari guys I spoke with asked me "please do not write this, this info is confidential", so I had to erase some parts. So, as here on 308 Fchat section there are several 308 experts, do you really think we could not add many new info, experiences, tips and anecdotes about 308? 208-308-328 production was over 20 k units: if only the owners would buy a copy, you would sell 20 k copies...
Too bad, if some well-established experts would apply the brakes even before the project started running. Best from Germany Martin
I'm not sure about brakes or no brakes but it is sensible to be realistic when setting out on any sort of project like that proposed. The market for any such book is quite small and a lot of time and effort required to do a good job. The existing books mentioned above are relevant in that some people will say that they already have one or more of the existing books so won't buy another on the same subject. Particularly one that would necessarily not be cheap if it was done to a high standard. It is also worth noting that people are often enthusiastic when such a project is proposed and offer all kinds of assistance and promises to buy etc. but, for various reasons, they won't all be honoured.
I agree, but this happens for every car model. There are tons of books about F40, but I know of (at least) two new ones that will come out in the future. The same with the aircooled Porsche 911. The problem is only to do a better one or at least that can add something new, unwritten before: with the media we have today, it's not too much difficult to correct former errors and add the new info collected through the forums, Facebook and so on. Facebook is and incredible opportunity and you can find pictures and (often private) documents never seen before: you can try to collect them and share on a book. This said, I prefer writing books about something it wasn't written about widely yet: the book about four turbo cars is the first ever (or very close to be) of the kind and the one I'm writing now will be the first ever too. Ciao
