2015 FORMULA 1 PETRONAS MALAYSIA GRAND PRIX: RACE *** SPOILERS *** | Page 35 | FerrariChat

2015 FORMULA 1 PETRONAS MALAYSIA GRAND PRIX: RACE *** SPOILERS ***

Discussion in 'F1' started by Remy Zero, Mar 29, 2015.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. PhilNotHill

    PhilNotHill Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner

    Jul 3, 2006
    27,855
    Aspen CO 81611
    Full Name:
    FelipeNotMassa
    Hey, you left out Kimi. Kimi. Get it. ;)
     
  2. tervuren

    tervuren Formula 3

    Apr 30, 2006
    2,469
    I have quietly been enjoying re-reading replies by people who said sacking Alonso would be the end of Ferrari and that anyone who suggested such a thing would be an idiot.

    Congrats to Vettel and team red on doing more than just struggling to be in the top 10.

    Driver this vs driver that, well, IMHO, Vettel will outscore Kimi, but Kimi is integral to Alison and car design. So long as Kimi gets paid, he'll be happy, so long as Vettel wins races, he'll be happy.

    I have not met either Mercedes driver, so I cannot comment on them in a vs match.
     
  3. daytona355

    daytona355 F1 World Champ
    BANNED

    Mar 25, 2009
    12,655
    London
    Full Name:
    Sid Korshak
    I'm absolutely chuffed with the result at the weekend, but I can't help but remain extremely cautious about reading too much into it. Although the the ferrari has improved a massive step, the stars aligned for us in Malaysia, and the tyre deg at the circuit is extreme compared to most, so while our tyre management will help us through the season, I don't see many other circuits where it is likely to have as great an effect, I think the power is still 'almost there' and not fully right.

    China and the next couple will give us a truer picture of where we are, and I suspect disappointingly that we are more likely a firm second and occasional challenger than regular strong threat for this year.

    It has to be said that both drivers are doing a fantastic job, and the team has reacted to last years issues with a fantastic attitude and should all be congratulated. Our strategists, for the first time in years, got it right! Ross must have been on the phone!

    Spare a thought for alonso, I didn't want him to leave, but I understood why, but I bet he's kicking himself wandering about in that tin can he has now. It's a wasted talent, imagine him with this car, he would wring as much, if not more, than even Seb from it. I hope mclaren get their act together quickly for him, although only to third fastest of course, but the way it's looking with their losses of engines, by the time they do there will be a penalty almost races from silverstone on for breaking the engine limits
     
  4. moretti

    moretti Five Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 1, 2003
    58,229
    Australia
    Full Name:
    John
    I watched carefully the pit wall and inner sanctum personnel and this new team manager impresses me much like Jean Todt, he seems to have an INCLUSIVE air about him ..... I may be totally wrong but I see cohesion and great pit stops , committed and organised team members ..... I think the Italians like to prove they can be just as efficient as the German counterparts :)
     
  5. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

    Nov 20, 2002
    17,673
    Tauranga, NZ
    Full Name:
    Pete
    #855 PSk, Mar 31, 2015
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2015
    We must remember the most important team member is not the driver, it is the engineer, in this case James Allison.

    James' work on the 2015 model has to take most of the credit (or maybe it should be the engine team?) AND critically the weather (heat) and track surface as Daytona355 says. We also need to remember that there is no doubt that Alonso would have qualified it just as well as Vettel. In fact I've already proved that Alonso at compariable Aussie GP practice times was closer to the Mercs than Vettel this year.

    Note what Alonso (and Kimi) had to deal with last year:
    Agree.
    I think Kimi brought Allison with him, but I don't think Kimi is integral to the car design, but I could be wrong
    I'm not sure what meeting a driver has to do with a comparison discussion :).
    Pete
     
  6. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

    Nov 20, 2002
    17,673
    Tauranga, NZ
    Full Name:
    Pete
    Amen.
    While I'm trying to be as postive as many on this site, I've been watching F1 for a very long time and the fact that Ferraris did not wear their tyres on such a hot and abrassive surface makes me wonder if we have less downforce than the Mercs. Or have I got that backwards?
    Agree
    Completely agree. Both Alonso and Button deserve a car they can compete in.
    Pete
     
  7. daytona355

    daytona355 F1 World Champ
    BANNED

    Mar 25, 2009
    12,655
    London
    Full Name:
    Sid Korshak
    Im probably way off, but I'm not sure if it's entirely about downforce, it could also be a more linear power delivery in those conditions, the cars definitely looked well planted in the corners. The tyre experts among us will probably be all over this for us, but my guess would be that our aero was well balanced front to rear and side to side, meaning the tyres weren't slipping laterally as much, so wear was managed in the main in the forwards, as opposed to scrubbing. In some situations I guess too much downforce can do damage as much as too little if they are forced to hard into the track?

    The characteristics on tyre wear are definitely 'Allison-esque' from the 2013 Renault. This could prove a key feature of the car, allowing ferrari to be more aggressive on downforce and other areas at the smoother, less harsh tracks, but I don't know if it will be enough to generate a lot of wins.

    What may happen, if we continue for the next race or two to prove competitive, is force mercedes to go aggressive on set-up and possibly engines, and this might cause them reliability issues they have been able to avoid so far by being so far in front and being able to run at 95% and many times less. We shouldn't forget that Hamilton on the whole is much harder on tyres than many due to his aggressive driving style, so if tyres are on the edge anywhere, this is where Seb and kimi will be able to try to steal a race or a place
     
  8. DeSoto

    DeSoto F1 Veteran

    Nov 26, 2003
    7,482
    I think that generally speaking more downforce = less sliding = less wearing.

    Anyway, probably the Mercedes has more downfoce than the Ferrari but the tyre degradation was caused by a suspension "issue". Issue is between quotation marks because it´s not really an issue, that probably means that they won´t have problems to heat the tyres in the colder European races like the Ferrari will have. Also, the distance between Mercedes and the rest was similar than in Australia so it´s not that Mercedes struggled in Malaysia, they were as good as always, but the Ferraris were better in those specific circumstances. I think that in China we will be SNAFU again.

    That doens´t mean that we can´t celebrate: I thought that this season Ferrari only could win a race with lots of fluke and Hamilton´s brain fade.

    I don´t give a dang about the drivers. Alonso made his choice and Button had not other options so they´ll have to stick to it. But the problem is more serious than that: McLaren needs sponsors and Honda needs to deliver; if they don´t get it right soon, they´ll be the next "post-BMW" Williams for years. With the current Mercedes tiranny and the audiences dropping everywhere, Formula 1 can´t afford to loose a top team like this.
     
  9. TexasF355F1

    TexasF355F1 Six Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 2, 2004
    68,831
    Cloud-9
    Full Name:
    Jason
    Okay, Kimi too. Well mention Nico's dad, Kiki while we're at it just because it's pretty much the same as Kimi.:D
     
  10. PhilNotHill

    PhilNotHill Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner

    Jul 3, 2006
    27,855
    Aspen CO 81611
    Full Name:
    FelipeNotMassa
    I totally agree with your analysis. Thanks for posting.
     
  11. NJB13

    NJB13 Formula 3

    Jan 5, 2013
    1,317
    Pampanga,Philippines
    Full Name:
    Norm
    Both of these are good observations IMO. More DF will assist (reduce) tire deg in most circumstances. But DF, isn't the only factor, there are lots. Suspension and mechanical grip factors are in many ways more important than DF. One thing you can see different on this years Ferrari (and I suspect this is from JA) is the lower pickup points on our front suspension which lowers the roll centre. A big help with tire deg and front rear balance options.
     
  12. gsjohnson

    gsjohnson Formula 3

    Feb 25, 2008
    2,291
    Woodland Hills, CA
    Full Name:
    GS Johnson
    Despite Fred's tramendous talent, he has consistently made poor career choices.
     
  13. maulaf

    maulaf Formula 3

    Feb 24, 2011
    1,422
    Cape Town
    last time I checked he held two WDC. Not too shabby a choice he must have made back then.
     
  14. gsjohnson

    gsjohnson Formula 3

    Feb 25, 2008
    2,291
    Woodland Hills, CA
    Full Name:
    GS Johnson
    #864 gsjohnson, Mar 31, 2015
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2015
    Both McLaren choices were not the best moves... and back to Renault...and bad timing in the Red cars...Consistently bad moves...It's been almost 10 years since his last WDC. How many more could he have had?
     
  15. furoni

    furoni F1 World Champ

    Jun 6, 2011
    13,609
    Vila Verde
    Full Name:
    Pedro Braga Soares
    ..or less?
     
  16. ricksb

    ricksb F1 Veteran

    Apr 12, 2005
    9,973
    Montclair Village
    Full Name:
    B. Ricks
    Initially, these were my thoughts also. After reading some of Toto's comments about being concerned about how quickly Ferrari's stepped forward to challenge, I don't know that they will only be an occasional challenger under optimal conditions.

    I still think that the Merc is the car/team to beat, but I think things will be closer this season than anyone anticipated (except, maybe, Arrivabene and Allison)
     
  17. DF1

    DF1 Two Time F1 World Champ

    If temperature decides tire wear and strategy then warm races could see Mercedes under threat. Hungary, Bahrain, Italy, Mexico, Austin and Singapore. That is alot of potential points for Ferrari and others to gain on Mercedes. I believe your assessment is correct. By no means is this season a throw away due to Mercedes just yet.
     
  18. DF1

    DF1 Two Time F1 World Champ

    Interesting commentary and analysis here-

    Valtteri Bottas backs Williams F1 team's stance on team orders
    By Lawrence Barretto and Matt Beer Tuesday, March 31st 2015, 13:38 GMT


    Valtteri Bottas believes he and Williams Formula 1 team-mate Felipe Massa have proved they can be trusted to race without team orders after their Malaysian Grand Prix battle.

    Massa lost fifth to Bottas in their late dice at Sepang, which included near-contact at the first corner and ended when the Finn pulled off an outside-line move on the Brazilian through the long, fast Turn 5 on the penultimate lap.

    Williams was involved in a team orders controversy at the same event last year when Massa declined to follow a request to let Bottas past to attack Jenson Button's McLaren for sixth.

    But this year it allowed them to resolve their battle between themselves.

    "It was really good to get the green light from the team to allow us to race," said Bottas.

    "It was hard and fair. In the end there was no contact.

    "In any situation, I think they can trust us that we can race hard but fair. That is nice."

    Williams's performance chief Rob Smedley said it would be wrong to put limits on intra-team racing.

    "We are not going to stop them racing," he said.

    "It has to be clean, they have to not jeopardise any points for the team, but they are two great drivers, two professional drivers.

    "They give each other a lot of respect and just enough room to race.

    "It was good wheel to wheel racing, it's good for Formula 1 and we're not going to stop them doing it."
    Felipe Massa and Valtteri Bottas, Williams, Malaysian GP 2015, Sepang

    Massa said he had raced Bottas more carefully as they were team-mates, but he felt he had little chance of retaining his position anyway.

    "I tried to fight but I had two laps older tyres than him," he said.

    "I was fighting to keep my position but I had no tyres to fight.

    "We race but you have to take care because if you have two cars out on the last lap of the race it would be not nice."

    COMMENT: Ex-F1 designer GARY ANDERSON on the Williams battle: "The team allowed Valtteri Bottas to challenge and overtake Felipe Massa on the last lap of the race.

    "That is criminal because they had everything to lose and nothing to gain, as fifth and sixth were assured.

    "I am a Bottas fan but it was only Massa's experience that ensured they didn't both end up in the gravel trap."

    Valtteri Bottas backs Williams F1 team's stance on team orders - F1 news - AUTOSPORT.com
     
  19. Remy Zero

    Remy Zero Two Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 26, 2005
    23,319
    KL, Malaysia
    Full Name:
    MC Cool Breeze
    Gary's just a whiner. It still provided a show for the fans.

    BTW, i really can't imagine what Fred is going through right now.
     
  20. NJB13

    NJB13 Formula 3

    Jan 5, 2013
    1,317
    Pampanga,Philippines
    Full Name:
    Norm
    This is the same Gary Anderson who, after the Australian GP this year proclaimed Ferrari had "lost" .7 of a second to Mercedes since last year - ROFL.

    Source:- Gary Anderson: F1 2015's real winners and losers
     
  21. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

    Nov 20, 2002
    17,673
    Tauranga, NZ
    Full Name:
    Pete
    He's correct.

    Lets see how we go through the european season.
    Pete
     
  22. NJB13

    NJB13 Formula 3

    Jan 5, 2013
    1,317
    Pampanga,Philippines
    Full Name:
    Norm
    So Ferrari were 1.5 to 2 seconds behind Mercedes in 2014 and according to you they are now 2 to 2.5 seconds behind Mercedes.

    You're funny
     
  23. trumpet77

    trumpet77 Formula 3

    Jun 13, 2011
    2,181
    Great Neck, NY
    Full Name:
    Robert Nixon
    Hopefully the rest of the season plays out that Ferrari are very close to Mercedes, and that Seb didn't win in Malaysia "only" because Mercedes made a bad strategy call on tires.
     
  24. PhilNotHill

    PhilNotHill Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner

    Jul 3, 2006
    27,855
    Aspen CO 81611
    Full Name:
    FelipeNotMassa
    #874 PhilNotHill, Apr 1, 2015
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2015
    Alonshole doubts Ferrari can beat Mercedes regularly. GPGuide.com

    PhilNotHill doubts Alonshole can beat Ferrari or Mercedes this year and it may be several races before Mcl can finish a race.

    Perhaps Alonshole should be concentrating on Mcl rather than Ferrari which finished the Malay GP in P1 and P4. :D

    TRULLI: Ferrari not missing Fred. Better off with Seb. GPGuide.com
     
  25. itschris

    itschris Formula 3

    Sep 15, 2011
    1,465
    Florida
    Full Name:
    Chris
    Think about last season... no one really challenged Merc on an even playing field. I'm a Ricciardo fan, but he only won those three due to Mercs loss. Wins nonetheless, but not on the same par or for the same reason as Seb's win. Strategy error or not, it wouldn't have mattered last year. This year it does so that's one more thing that Merc has to do right each race or suffer... a far cry from total dominance last year. I don't think Ferrari is at the same pace as Merc yet... but close enough where Merc certainly cannot afford any mistakes. It seems there was a lot of panic and confusion from Hammy, Nico, and the wall when things started getting competitive. Preparedness as we all know is an important piece of any F1 win.

    One race doesn't make a trend... so I'll reserve most of my arm chair quarterbacking after China and the next couple. Those are different enough venues to see what's what.
     

Share This Page