1984 400i Timing Chain Tensioner | Page 2 | FerrariChat

1984 400i Timing Chain Tensioner

Discussion in '365 GT4 2+2/400/412' started by marolda, Mar 9, 2006.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. dstacy

    dstacy F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Jan 23, 2006
    11,770
    GMT -5 & GMT +1
    Full Name:
    Dave
    Post the pages that tell you how to replace the chain. :D
     
  2. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    33,736
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    What pages? Ferrari manuals have little to do with telling us how to fix the cars. They are far more about telling us how they work and the rest is up to us. That is far more valuable than the new manuals that tell us how to change tires and oil filters and nearly nothing about how it all works.

    I have been winding new chains into overhead cam motors since I was an apprentice, no book ever told us how to do it.
     
  3. Ak Jim

    Ak Jim F1 Veteran
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 23, 2007
    8,451
    North Pole AK
    In my opinion, and I will emphasize I'm no expert if you follow the instructions and tighten it the amount it says to the chain and guides will wear much quicker. Rifledriver what's your take on the tighten tell noisy then loosen procedure? Does it really need to be that tight? When I first got my car it always made a noise that I thought was the alternator belt. I drove it that way for a couple of years then after doing some reading decided to tighten the chain. The noise went away and the engine ran better. I'm not sure if any damage was done with it being so loose but things seem to be ok now. I have been turning the screw about 3/4 of a turn once a year and things seem to be ok. No noise and the engine runs very nicely.
     
  4. Jasonberkeley

    Jasonberkeley Formula 3

    Apr 23, 2017
    1,321
    NW Corner, CT
    Full Name:
    Jason Berkeley
    Rifledriver- this may sound silly, but can you please describe the noise the chain makes as opposed to all of the belts and other things rotating?
     
  5. dstacy

    dstacy F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Jan 23, 2006
    11,770
    GMT -5 & GMT +1
    Full Name:
    Dave
    Well if you wouldn't mind would you start a thread on how to change the chain and guides on a 400 motor with the engine in the car? We'd all REALLY appreciate that since none of us has been able to do it and I'm certain we'd all really like to save the huge repair bill of pulling the motor. That post would save us a ton and would be a real help to the community.
     
  6. Newman

    Newman F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 26, 2001
    14,097
    Canada
    Full Name:
    Newman
    Guides would be a different story! A stretched chain with good guides wouldn't be hard because they have a master link.
     
  7. dstacy

    dstacy F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Jan 23, 2006
    11,770
    GMT -5 & GMT +1
    Full Name:
    Dave
    The guides are the weak part of the system. The chains are great; the material on the guides suck.
     
  8. Newman

    Newman F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 26, 2001
    14,097
    Canada
    Full Name:
    Newman
    Chain stretch is a problem though. Bet mine could use one although its quiet at the moment. Im just waiting for a sodium exhaust valve to take the plunge then it could get the 550 engine it really needs.
     
  9. dstacy

    dstacy F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Jan 23, 2006
    11,770
    GMT -5 & GMT +1
    Full Name:
    Dave
    Hope that doesn't happen to either of us.
     
  10. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    33,736
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    #35 Rifledriver, May 14, 2017
    Last edited: May 14, 2017
    Not in my experience. I have replaced many worn out chains but never once a worn out guide but then the cars I service have not been run with worn out and loose chains. That is what wears out the guides. It is the insistence on the part of some that the chains do not wear out that kills the guides.
    As far as any of the rubber coated guides, how long should rubber immersed in motor oil last? Most of the cars we are speaking of are 40 or so years old. In the case of those it is not a wear issue, it is age. The tires should not be run at 40 years old either.
     
  11. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    33,736
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    #36 Rifledriver, May 14, 2017
    Last edited: May 14, 2017
    Ferrari offered to pay me to do that and I turned them down too.

    Its just not that hard and I don't teach auto repair on the internet or anywhere else. .
     
  12. wrxmike

    wrxmike Moderator
    Moderator Owner

    Mar 20, 2004
    7,573
    Full Name:
    Mike
    It's not possible to replace the guides without removing the front timing cover, and it's not possible to remove the front timing cover with the engine in situ.

    It is possible to wind a new chain into the engine, but with all due respect if you can't figure out how to do it then you probably shouldn't be attempting it in the first place - ie lots of potential for an expensive mistake.

    M
     
  13. Newman

    Newman F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 26, 2001
    14,097
    Canada
    Full Name:
    Newman
    It may just be curiosity not the desire to take on the job themselves.
     
  14. dstacy

    dstacy F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Jan 23, 2006
    11,770
    GMT -5 & GMT +1
    Full Name:
    Dave
    #39 dstacy, May 15, 2017
    Last edited: May 15, 2017
    We've seen pictures of guides posted here in this section where the guides were terribly worn on cars with less than 60k miles. Since the chains aren't required to be replaced until 60k and we know the guides won't last I can't imagine not replacing them both.
     
  15. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    33,736
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    No. It is clearly indicated in the manual that the chain be retensioned every 5000km (3000 miles) and replaced every 50,000km (30,000 miles) just like I said in post #2. When properly serviced I have seen many go past 60,000 miles without chain guide issues but as I have already stated it is unrealistic to expect and rubber immersed in oil to last 40+ years.

    Loose, out of adjustment or worn out chains wear out chain guides. How many are adjusting them at 3000 mile intervals as indicated?
     
  16. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    33,736
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    So I can go to all that trouble to be ignored in the same way I was over post 2? You bet. I'll get right on it.
     
  17. dstacy

    dstacy F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Jan 23, 2006
    11,770
    GMT -5 & GMT +1
    Full Name:
    Dave
    None
     
  18. dstacy

    dstacy F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Jan 23, 2006
    11,770
    GMT -5 & GMT +1
    Full Name:
    Dave
    Geeze Brian, nobody's bashing you here but people are busy and actually have a life outside of Fchat so they might skim rather than memorize. You have a rep for knowing how to work on these. Take it easy man. Go get a cup of coffee and take a deep breath.
     
  19. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    33,736
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    Absolutely and I have better things to do that teach you how to do a job you will never do so why ask?
     
  20. Jasonberkeley

    Jasonberkeley Formula 3

    Apr 23, 2017
    1,321
    NW Corner, CT
    Full Name:
    Jason Berkeley
    Sorry to ask again, but what does the chain noise sound like so I can make sure I am distinguishing between belts and other whirring parts!

    Thanks!
     
  21. dstacy

    dstacy F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Jan 23, 2006
    11,770
    GMT -5 & GMT +1
    Full Name:
    Dave
    Ok man, you're the dude, you're right, its all about you. I'm sorry I wasted your time by communicating in any way to you or asking you a question. On behalf of all of us here we're sorry we asked anything, we're sorry we questioned anything, we're sorry.
    Happy now pumpkin?
     
  22. Newman

    Newman F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 26, 2001
    14,097
    Canada
    Full Name:
    Newman
    Couldn't agree more.
     
  23. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    33,736
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    You already told me I was full of it a year and a half ago. This seems a little redundant.
     
  24. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    33,736
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    Especially for someone who has already made it clear he doesn't believe me.


    If he has such experts at his disposal I'd suggest continuing using them. Why change horses?
     
  25. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    33,736
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall

    Sorry to say but I am a loss to describe the sound in writing.

    How do I describe that over the internet? It sounds like a timing chain rattle and considering the adjustment requires hearing it, even a subtle degree of it and that this is something that can do a lot of harm if not correct I suggest getting some help.
     

Share This Page