16th FChat Photo Contest 2/13 to 3/13 | FerrariChat

16th FChat Photo Contest 2/13 to 3/13

Discussion in 'Creative Arts' started by agup48, Feb 13, 2011.

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  1. agup48

    agup48 Two Time F1 World Champ

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    #1 agup48, Feb 13, 2011
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2011
    Congrats to Gil, F430GB for winning the 15th Photo Contest.

    The topic choice is:

    Black and White


    Rules
    To make it easier, please submit only one photo, if you decide to change your photo, please state which is your final decision.

    The photo must be taken during the time period listed above

    No links to photos, please support Ferrarichat and subscribe if you have reached your attachment limit.​
     
  2. Jedi

    Jedi Moderator
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    #2 Jedi, Feb 13, 2011
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2011
    Sorry... didn't do it right... :(

    Jedi
     
  3. msdesignltd

    msdesignltd F1 World Champ
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    #3 msdesignltd, Feb 14, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  4. Cozmic_Kid

    Cozmic_Kid F1 Veteran

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    So PS is allowed?
     
  5. msdesignltd

    msdesignltd F1 World Champ
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    #5 msdesignltd, Feb 14, 2011
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2011
    If you are reffering to the previous Pics...No Shop was used.

    This is a single exposure...

    Actually a double exposure on a single frame..
     
  6. iamthesimpleone

    iamthesimpleone Formula 3

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    i figured that much, but for clarity in the rules, is fauxtoshop explicity banned?
     
  7. BigP1202

    BigP1202 Formula 3

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    I was under the impression that PS is allowed for simple touch ups and whatnot
     
  8. msdesignltd

    msdesignltd F1 World Champ
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    If The Pics are taken RAW...Then it must process through an editor...
    Is That equiv to shopping?
     
  9. blackwood

    blackwood Formula 3

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    How about no per-pixel manipulation. Color (or lackthereof in this case), curves, etc. are simply a part of taking pictures.
     
  10. iamthesimpleone

    iamthesimpleone Formula 3

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    i would think levels/curves would almost be considered 'cheating' in a photo taking contest. i could understand a channel mixer, just because some people might have a camera that cannot take b/w pics. now hdr is just wrong, as well as ugly looking.....
     
  11. agup48

    agup48 Two Time F1 World Champ

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    I use a point and shoot, and there is no possible way for me to make it b&w without running it through some sort of editor.

    I think Photoshop or some other sort of editing is allowable.

    So, pshop/editing allowed. Yes or No?
     
  12. iamthesimpleone

    iamthesimpleone Formula 3

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    how about using a dark-room doable criterion for edits?

    i.e. if you could do it in a dark room, you could do it in photoshop. That opens to door to

    a. cropping
    b. color 2 b/w
    c. simple brightness/contrasts

    out the door are generous corrections of levels, curves, HDRs, etc..........

    i think this would uphold the spirit of it being a picture taking contest
     
  13. BigP1202

    BigP1202 Formula 3

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    I like this. I usually only do the slightest bit of color corrections but I'll hold back this go around.

    We should maybe try a Photoshop Contest if enough people are using it. Like a separate contest. Just an idea
     
  14. blackwood

    blackwood Formula 3

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    #14 blackwood, Feb 14, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    What's ugly about much of the "HDR" stuff (which I put in quotes since so many of them are single-exposure DR) out there is the ludicrous tonemapping. HDR in and of itself is simply a way to overcome the rather severe limitation of most digital sensors (which suffers in dynamic range relative to film, and by leaps and bounds relative to the human eye). You gotta pay tens of thousands to get 12.5 stops of DR in a digicam, versus a few bucks for 15 on b&w slide film or the human eye which can discern on the order of 24 stops. I personally don't use the technique, but it's due to laziness more than anything else ;)

    By your later suggestion, curve are in. Tools in photoshop such as burning, dodging and masking come from the darkroom. There's very little I can do in photoshop lightroom I can't also do in a darkroom... at the expense of a multitude of photographic paper, of course :).

    Curves and levels are just shortcuts to traditional photographic techniques.




    And if you're much better at me, you can do some very sophisticated stuff in a darkroom. These three are (scans of) film prints from a true master:
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
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  15. blackwood

    blackwood Formula 3

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    Did that 10 contests ago ;)


    http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=266847
     
  16. iamthesimpleone

    iamthesimpleone Formula 3

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    nice pictures. i just thought this was a photo-taking contest first, not a print making one. oh well, i've only entered one of these before not too sure how they work
     
  17. Jedi

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    #17 Jedi, Feb 14, 2011
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2011
    Black and White was a PROCESS long before "digital manipulation". I spent a lot of
    years in the darkroom, using 4x5 PlusX film in D76 developer, using "Zone System"
    techniques.... then carefully printing that image onto a carefully selected type of paper
    with yet another chemical formulation selected for the exact look of the print... made
    ONE AT A TIME, with a lot of effort....

    Just to say that to take a "digital photo" and Photoshop/Picasa it into "black and white"
    really defies the whole idea of Black and White photography as an art form...

    I only post this after the insane Photoshop efforts above... beautiful to say the least,
    and amazing. But hardly in the spirit of "Black and White photography"....

    I'm not an "old fogie" - I'm 49. But I do realize that modern computer techniques
    really negate the beauty that was true "Black and White Photography"... ask me
    how I know.

    I tried to post a few of my "Real" B&W images and was told they were not allowed!

    I guess I should learn photoshop and see what my Point and Shoot could do, and nevermind
    the view camera with 4x5 film.....

    :)

    Jedi
     
  18. agup48

    agup48 Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Pops, throw them up as example :)
     
  19. iamthesimpleone

    iamthesimpleone Formula 3

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    so far my understanding is.................ps not allowed, but mad tyte darkroom skillz r?

    bust out the developing trays, and safe lights, we got pictures to make!
     
  20. blackwood

    blackwood Formula 3

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    #20 blackwood, Feb 15, 2011
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2011
    Sure, we aren't printing and looking at the prints. On the internet, the jpg file is analogous to the print.

    Either way, for electronic or printed consumption, processing is an inseparable part of photography.

    People like the brag that their pictures are SOOC (straight out of camera). I say: so what? It's been heavily processed, but rather than by the picture taker, it was done by a microprocessor. Curves, levels, color profiles, color balance, contrast adjustments, blah blah blah. That's all been done.

    If "picture taking" were all we were comparing, we'd have to post non-rastered non-processed arrays of brightness values and the color of the filter associated with each pixel.

    256Y, 141B, 113G, 121G, 142Y...

    No. That's not what we're doing. We're making pictures and posting them. That means we point a camera, set it up, expose the sensor and download to a computer. At this point, if you're happy with how the engineers at canon/nikon/sony/whatever programmed the image processor to react to the menu options you've selected, great. Post it. If not, re-process it (for which you'll need the RAW) or post-process it.

    I'll say it again: processing is an inseparable part of photography. Film to darkroom to be processed. Negative (or positive depending on the film) to an enlarger. Paper exposed. Paper put into developer, and stop, and fix.

    How you process the film, how long the paper is exposed, what paper you use, how far the enlarger is from the paper, what filters are in the enlarger, what you do with your hands during the exposure, whether you mask parts of the image, how long you develop it, etc. are all things which affect the final image. It's not like what's recorded on a piece of film magically appears on paper in an unadulterated state. That doesn't make any sense. Nor do digital pixels magically become raster images in an unadulterated state.

    Digital cameras have the ability to process a series of brightness values into an RGB image, but does not imply that manually processing should be disallowed. Hell, if anything, letting the camera do it all for you is cheating.



    Edit: sorry AG. The train has left the tracks. ;)
     
  21. msdesignltd

    msdesignltd F1 World Champ
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    If Darwin had a Theory on Photography...

    He could speak up Now!

    Evolution of the F stop!
     
  22. iamthesimpleone

    iamthesimpleone Formula 3

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    i appologize, if we got the thread off track. i just thought since this was a technical topic, as opposed to one of subject matter, it would be nice to have a little more clarity on the rules....

    -ben
     
  23. blackwood

    blackwood Formula 3

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    I think it was probably I who derailed it the most.

    IMO there shouldn't be too many rules. If you shoot film, great. Share it. If you shoot digital, great, share it. :)
     
  24. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
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    I agree and whether or not it has been post-processed has not been an issue yet. I get Jedi's point about "true B&W" versus digital and post processed. Honestly though unless we're all willing to set up a dark room and shoot on film I don't see how we could mantain that level of integrity.

    I say shoot 'em, post 'em up and let the crowd decide!
     
  25. agup48

    agup48 Two Time F1 World Champ

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    I definitely agree, I haven't really gotten a giant hold on what the rules should be after I took over. I just followed Chris' format and changed a few minor things.

    I think this is the best way to summarize it and IMO, it would be allowable to use pshop or any other editing.

    Let's do a small poll, Yes or No for pshop? I vote Yes.
     

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