430 - Lost my FCar virginity, CEL P0011 | FerrariChat

430 Lost my FCar virginity, CEL P0011

Discussion in '360/430' started by PCarRI, Jul 8, 2020.

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  1. PCarRI

    PCarRI Karting

    Feb 23, 2020
    221
    Rhode island, USA
    So after owning my 06 F430 Spider for 6 months now, it finally happened. I was anticipating it, yet also knew there would some mental uncomfortableness associated. In the end, we all knew it had to happen, and best to get it over with.

    Even though I'm talking about the CEL going on for the first time, you could easily have swapped out a certain night at my friend Adam's party when I was 15... LOL

    Anyways, kidding aside, CEL did stay on for the first time. Quick read with my el-cheapo OBD scanner shows P0011. With a quick search on FChat I see that's "A" Camshaft Position - Timing Over - Advanced or System Performance Bank 1". Called my Indy and he said best to bring it up ASAP to diagnose, which sucks as it's an hour drive one way that I have to get my wife to come with me for a ride back. Plus it's supposed to be kinda nice the next coupe weeks.

    Now another thing that seemed to happen is that when I pulled into my garage after I noticed it stayed on is that the convertible top seemed to struggle to go up. The hatch lifted, sounded like it wanted to move but the mechanism basically stopped. Put the top back down, then back up and the cycle completed.

    Does this sound like anything to you guys? Again, only code is P0011. Is it too hopeful to maybe just be a battery swap?
     
  2. Marcoboxer

    Marcoboxer Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Oct 5, 2019
    292
    Alpharetta, GA
    Full Name:
    Mark Roberts
    For the battery question, do you have it running on a tender or can you fully recharge it? If CEL goes away, you've probably answered that question quickly and easily.

    On the P0011 code (and my experience is with other cars not an F430) there are normally other symptoms too such as rough running or difficulty starting. Those symptoms show if the camshaft is genuinely advanced beyond where the ECU wants it to be. Also, a clean batch of quality oil is never a bad thing when getting these errors. If I recall correctly, a visual inspection fixed my issue when this came up. Check the connectors and make sure something hasn't worked its way loose before taking an hour drive. Better yet, disconnect, clean and reconnect.
     
  3. PCarRI

    PCarRI Karting

    Feb 23, 2020
    221
    Rhode island, USA
    Quick update, ended up dropping the car off at my Indy (Autohaus Boston, Braintree MA, HIGHLY recommended) after a quick visible inspection. He confirmed wiring looks good, nothing burned, cleared the code and drove it 10 miles and it came right back. So solenoids it seems to be. Ugh.
    Only good news is that I needed the valve gaskets changed anyways so killing two birds with one stone, but assuming this ain't gonna be pretty so putting the Fabspeed headers on hold until next month. SIGH...
     
  4. Marcoboxer

    Marcoboxer Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Oct 5, 2019
    292
    Alpharetta, GA
    Full Name:
    Mark Roberts
    That’s sucks, but at least you’ve got a handle on what it is. Could you come back with what was actually replaced, rough costs etc? Helps us DIY’ers justify weekends spent crawling around under a car to the wife.
     
    SpencerMarks likes this.
  5. PCarRI

    PCarRI Karting

    Feb 23, 2020
    221
    Rhode island, USA
    Will def let you guys know. Had I not already had a 3 day this weekend I prob would've attempted it myself.

    Actually prob not, for what the Indy charges per hour it'll be worth recapturing my weekend. :cool::D
     
  6. PCarRI

    PCarRI Karting

    Feb 23, 2020
    221
    Rhode island, USA
    So after talking with my guy, decided that since one of the cam covers will be off and it's only a couple more hours to do the other side we're gonna do all 4 solenoids as well as the gasket that needed to be replaced anyways. @ $900 ea, it's not cheap but at least it's one less thing to worry about, and I feel like we're killing two birds with one stone in that the gasket needed to be done. Parts + 15 hours of labor... ugh.
     
  7. mwstewart

    mwstewart F1 Rookie

    Feb 5, 2014
    2,625
    England
    Full Name:
    Mark
    Check my project thread for a much cheaper alternative and how to install them..
     
  8. carguy007

    carguy007 Formula Junior

    Apr 24, 2013
    839
    Curious did this solve the issue
     
  9. carguy007

    carguy007 Formula Junior

    Apr 24, 2013
    839
    Did this fix it?
     
  10. PCarRI

    PCarRI Karting

    Feb 23, 2020
    221
    Rhode island, USA
    Yes it did. Certainly wasn't an inexpensive fix.

    Sent from my SM-F916U using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
  11. carguy007

    carguy007 Formula Junior

    Apr 24, 2013
    839
    Great to hear - the maserati part is a little cheaper if it happens again.
     
  12. PCarRI

    PCarRI Karting

    Feb 23, 2020
    221
    Rhode island, USA
    Thanks for that. It wasn't the parts so much as it was the labor...

    Sent from my SM-F916U using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
  13. johnso21

    johnso21 Rookie

    May 21, 2019
    16
    Austin, TX
    Full Name:
    Johnny J
    I'm trying to see your project thread but your use profile is set to private? I have the same P0011 code but the car runs perfect and all 4 Variators were replaced by the previous owner less than a year ago yet the CEL persists along with
    U0029
    P1059
    P0464
    P0011
     
  14. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    Feb 20, 2015
    11,484
    Sydney
    Full Name:
    Ian Riddell
  15. johnso21

    johnso21 Rookie

    May 21, 2019
    16
    Austin, TX
    Full Name:
    Johnny J
    I read that thread tried his solution, CEL went away then drove the next day and it came back :(
     
  16. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    Feb 20, 2015
    11,484
    Sydney
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    Ian Riddell
    So you did a rescan to see if the messages were the same?
     
  17. johnso21

    johnso21 Rookie

    May 21, 2019
    16
    Austin, TX
    Full Name:
    Johnny J
    My neighbor has several laptop scanner is the one who scanned it originally. I tried scanning yesterday with mine but it is only reading generic codes but it did show 1 of the same, i'm assuming theyre the same but I will take the car back to my neighbors place and have it rescanned. I'll keep you posted!
     
    Qavion likes this.
  18. johnso21

    johnso21 Rookie

    May 21, 2019
    16
    Austin, TX
    Full Name:
    Johnny J
    Scanned the car again today:
    U0029 Vehicle Communication Bus A performance malfunction (Plaus)
    P1059 Vehical Speed Signal (Can)
    P0464 Fuel Level Sensor 'A' Circuit Intermittent
    P0011 Intake Timing Variator:Max Out Of Range
    P1602 Permanent Power Supply

    Battery is 7 months old and kept on a tender at all times, variator solenoids were replaced (all 4) within the past 9 months, fuel pumps (both) were replaced within the past 9 months.
     
  19. johnso21

    johnso21 Rookie

    May 21, 2019
    16
    Austin, TX
    Full Name:
    Johnny J
    @Qavion

    Sorry just added a tag for you. Working with flash32 for some help as well. Checked voltage at the battery at rest, at the ready, at start up and while running, it was 12.6 at rest, 12.24 at ready, 11.37 at startup and 14.07 while running.
     
  20. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    Feb 20, 2015
    11,484
    Sydney
    Full Name:
    Ian Riddell
    Johnny, unfortunately, I don't have any practical experience on the 430. All of my information comes from the WSM and wiring diagrams.

    U0029 Vehicle Communication Bus A performance malfunction (Plaus)

    I don't know what this is. It's not on the Ferrari code list. For info, the F430 busses are B (normal OBD2) and C (C CAN Bus). "Plaus" sounds like something is too high, but what this means in relation to communication busses, I don't know.

    P1059: Vehicle Speed Signal (Can)
    P0464 Fuel Level Sensor 'A' Circuit Intermittent


    I don't know if the Fuel Level Sensor reports fuel level to anything other than the instrument panel (the wiring only goes to the instrument panel). On earlier cars, say the F355, the fuel level is reported to the Engine ECU to inhibit certain engine errors when fuel is low. If the fuel is low and the engine is coughing and spluttering, the ECU assumes there is a fuel shortage, not an engine malfunction. The only way the F430 could generate a fault is if the instrument panel reported an issue with the fuel level. Of course, with everything linked by CAN busses on the F430, the instrument panel may be reporting fuel level to other "nodes" (ECUs). Similarly, Vehicle Speed is floating around on the CAN Busses. Vehicle Speed is provided by the ABS/ASR ECU (which computes vehicle speed from speed sensors on the wheels).

    P0011 Intake Timing Variator:Max Out Of Range

    I was going to suggest checking the resistances of the cam variator solenoids (from the Engine ECU pins) to see if there are any anomalies. Unfortunately, I don't have a typical resistance value for these, so all you can really do is compare them.

    According to the ECU pinout, the RH variator is connected to RH ECU pins 115 & 120 (smaller plug).

    Image Unavailable, Please Login

    The LH variator is connected to LH ECU pins 115 and 120.

    Image Unavailable, Please Login

    If you check the resistances from the ECUs, then that checks both the variator solenoids and the wiring.


    To me, these seem fairly normal. There may be a slightly high resistance in the wiring from the battery to the engine ECUs causing the P1602 Permanent Power Supply message. I assume the message relates to power coming from the battery to pin 64 on each Engine ECU (via fuse PDF21 and PSF21). The message doesn't seem to specify which ECU though so I've given you the fuse numbers for both (just as a reference).

    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Of course, the fuses themselves will be ok as everything is working normally. Sometimes resetting plugs and fuses (battery off) can refresh the mating surfaces of plug and fuse contacts. I imagine Texas weather to be hot and humid and this eventually takes its toll on car electronics.

    As I said, I have no practical experience with the 430 (and its glitches). These are just general recommendations.. and food for thought.
     
    flash32 and johnso21 like this.
  21. flash32

    flash32 F1 Veteran

    Aug 22, 2008
    5,562
    Central NJ
    Full Name:
    Dominick
    Great info Ian

    Sent from my moto g power using Tapatalk
     
    johnso21 likes this.

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