Best Replacement Tires F12?t | Page 2 | FerrariChat

Best Replacement Tires F12?t

Discussion in 'F12/812' started by x z8, Dec 31, 2019.

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  1. Caeruleus11

    Caeruleus11 F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Jun 11, 2013
    10,860
    Competition between the tire manufacturers is a big win for all of us. Who knows- maybe someone else will surprise us?
     
    MDEL likes this.
  2. Il Co-Pilota

    Il Co-Pilota F1 Veteran

    May 29, 2019
    6,023
    Hopefully some place nice.
    Full Name:
    A.B
    There has been a few F12's in my neck of the woods fitted with 812 tyres, as well as TdF tyres. Nothing but positives. The 812 rubber will also fit the stock F12 9.5x20 front rims. Some also switched to TdF wheels and rubber, so that has been done too.
    I even believe one of our fellow FChat brethren, Lamborrari I think, run the 275 section rubber on the front of his 4lusso. From what I recall, there's quite a bit of room round the tyres on the F12.

    I agree that it will of course change the characteristics of the car to a bit more front end bias, but remember that while the F12 is definitely tail happy on account of the power and throttle, like just about every and all street cars, it is still biased towards understeer. I have not driven an F12 with 275 section rubber, but I can't for the life of me see that a 275 will take it from understeer to oversteer. Additionally, I would also point out that the MPSS K spec F12 255 tyres, have some of, if not the widest tread patch of any 255 section tyres. Tread width of the MPSS 255 K2 is 9.2", and the MPS4S K1 has a tread width of 8.9".

    What I'm trying to illustrate is that it is hard to say how a certain tyre combo will alter the characteristics of a car, because there are so many variables. I suspect that the character of the F12 TdF has more to do with the general setup, than just the slightly wider fronts. An interesting example of how easily we can alter a car, are spacers. Want to add a lot of oversteer, just add a set of spacers in the front. Want to make the car push and understeer like mad, just add spacers in the rear or reduce the offset of the rear wheels. Interestingly enough, few here ever discuss that when we discuss spacers and aftermarket wheels. Personally I'd say an F12 with spacers in the front that changes the roll center, could be more of a liability than a wee bit of extra rubber in the front.

    Are the 275 section TdF PZ4 Corsa rubber part of the TdF's wild nature? Of course, but I still think the statement Ferrari makes that the 275 fronts is the main reason why it has RWS, is pushing it. Ferrari sells an adventure and an experience, and that's why we love Ferrari, and part of that is creating drama, excitement and mystique.

    Just some thoughts:)
     
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  3. Caeruleus11

    Caeruleus11 F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Jun 11, 2013
    10,860
    Good thoughts!
     
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  4. mthompson2376

    mthompson2376 Formula Junior

    Feb 2, 2017
    254
    North East England
    Full Name:
    Mark Thompson
    I have been running the new Pirelli PZ4 all season, last night on an aggressive run got 70c into the tire, no drop off in performance in fact just got stickier, I can be 100% flat in 1st in the F12 with no loss of traction. (you sort of feel sorry for the clutch), night and day between old and new generation PZero. Love the tire, really love the flexibility in the side wall and how it works to communicate the limits of traction through the twistys....Really not much in it but i reckon they are the new front runner:-

    1. For the outright traction, truly incredible

    2. Flexible side wall allows more progressive move from traction to slide conditions, just seems to work really with the F12 fezza systems (which can be switched off with this tire !)

    3. Non-performance drop off on normal roads (have had upto 70C, have not had on a prolonged session on track, where they would of course run higher, in my Speciale my Michelans cup 2s literally gave up at 90c....no grip at this level)

    4 . Switch on and heat up cycle very quick.....which is where the grip is....

    PZ4....Love them....just seem to work so well with the F12

    Think the game has moved on....somewhat....no wonder the 812 using them as standard.



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  5. x z8

    x z8 Formula Junior

    Nov 22, 2009
    667
    Florida
    Full Name:
    Jeffrey
    I haven’t liked a Pirelli tire in a long time. I swear by Michelin’s. When I upgraded to the Michelin PS4 tire in the F12 it was an elation. I now have traction and can actually use the 740HP.
     
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  6. Frank_C

    Frank_C F1 Rookie
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    May 29, 2004
    2,612
    Whistling through the wheat field in Texas
    Full Name:
    Frank Cavallo
    My 812 is in the shop getting Novatec springs, lowered, track alignment, corner balanced and the P Zero Corsa (PZC4) tires. The original PZ4 ain’t worth a lick on the track. They heat up too quickly and balloon- no grip and u can feel the asphalt just shredding the center of the tires as you slide all around. The Cup 2s (on my GT3 RS) also got a bit hot and greasy but they didn’t balloon up and did not feel like you were running a cheese grater over them.

    I too would like to put Cup 2s on it (my son’s coach phoned a buddy who races Ferraris who said the same thing about the heat up & to ditch the Pirellis and put on Cup 2s). Fortunately they do make a set with the correct load rating. You gain 1 cm all around but that would necessitate going to 21 in the rear to maintain diameter: 285/35/20 and 325/30/21 (and buying my wife another horse to “offset” new wheels).

    But in the meanwhile I’ll run the Corsa tires. Hopefully they’ll last more than 845 mi and 3 days on the track.



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  7. Bundy

    Bundy Formula 3

    May 18, 2011
    2,374
    Arizona & Kentucky
    Full Name:
    Anir
    Pirelli has fallen so far behind Michelin in real world usability and performance. Everytime I’ve had a Ferrari drive or handle poorly, even in a straight line, it was due to Pirelli tires.
     
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  8. Bobby_P

    Bobby_P Karting

    Feb 25, 2004
    135
    Reviving this thread from the dead...

    Looking to replace the OEM PZero tires on an F12 with the Michelin Pilot Super Sports...as a couple earlier posters to this thread suggested, but not having much success after viewing the available sizes on the TireRack website.

    The rears do not seem to be an issue, however for the front it appears I would have to go from the OEM 255X35 to...255X40...265X35...265X30.

    Any input from those that made the switch to MPSS tires would be appreciated.

    Michelin Pilot Super Sport (tirerack.com)
     
  9. Il Co-Pilota

    Il Co-Pilota F1 Veteran

    May 29, 2019
    6,023
    Hopefully some place nice.
    Full Name:
    A.B
    The OE MPSS for the F12 has been discontinued.

    Get the MPS4S instead. Better overall tyre, and the K1 spec rear for the 812 is virtually identical to the K2 MPSS in terms of tread width and character.
    This for the front.
    https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=Pilot+Sport+4S&partnum=635YR0PS4SXL&vehicleSearch=false&fromCompare1=yes
    This for the rear.
    https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=Pilot+Sport+4S&partnum=135YR0PS4SXL&vehicleSearch=false&fromCompare1=yes

    The reason for the 265 section front, is that the OE MPSS K2 255/35R20 Ferrari had developed for the F12 had an unusually wide tread for a 255. So to get the same tread patch with MPS4S the 265 is the shoe to use. Don't worry about the diameter or added width. the added radius is only 2.5 mm and the overall section width shoulder-to-shoulder will only increase by 3.5 mm on each side. Unless you park an F12 with OE MPSS next to it, you won't be able to tell the difference. Just remember to drop the front pressure about 0.5-1.0 PSI as you increase tyre volume.
     
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  10. Bobby_P

    Bobby_P Karting

    Feb 25, 2004
    135

    Thank you very much for your detailed response!

    Cheers!
     
    Il Co-Pilota likes this.
  11. rumen1

    rumen1 Formula 3
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Jun 23, 2012
    1,682
    Bulgaria
    I was to at my tyre dealer today to see what I can get for the F12 and I noticed something very interesting. I am only considering Michelin PS 4S at this point, nevertheless they offered me the new PS5 and I noticed, that the same tyre, same size has different braking distance index if homologated for Porsche or Ferrari. I am reffering to the 255 front ones, but I suspect it will be the same with the 265 ones. The Porsche one has A index and the Ferrari one has a B index. Since they told me I should wait at least 4 weeks to get the Ferrari-homologated one (no matter which size I will choose), I am seriously considering the Posche-homologated ones, which are available immediately. Not sure if there will be a noticeable difference at all...
     

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