Clutch issue (again) | FerrariChat

Clutch issue (again)

Discussion in 'Boxers/TR/M' started by c4b4the04, Mar 4, 2021.

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  1. c4b4the04

    c4b4the04 Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 9, 2017
    383
    Northern Virginia
    Full Name:
    Cassidy
    Bought my car in ‘19. Clutch was slipping. When I pulled the drop gear off, you could see visible wear on the pressure plate fingers where the throwout bearing never disengaged fully.

    Rebuilt the throwout assembly with new Hill Engineering seals, new throwout bearing, new pilot bearing. I had the flywheel resurfaced, bought a Eurospares clutch kit and installed spacers that were included. Reassembled and car would not go in gear. Took back apart, did math as per the book and shimmed it. Reassembled. Clutch slipped.

    Third try got shins machined down, now it didn’t slip but is still stiff to get into first, all other gears are easy when warmed up. Clutch had a vibration from 2300-2700 rpm so I decided to take it apart to have it balanced.

    Took drop gear off yesterday and see IDENTICAL wear after 1300 miles on the clutch fingers. But I also see that the throwout isn’t traveling full distance on the sleeve?

    Somehow my clutch is traveling too short a distance AND isn’t disengaging? I’m stumped. Clearly something else is wrong.

    Checked with Superformance and Hill and the single clutch disc update kit is on order, so I’d be apart for several month waiting for parts. Clearly my throwout bearing will be toasted, but why is this happening? Where would you start? This clutch is brand new but looks like it’s been on for 20,000 miles.

    Thanks in advance for some guidance. This is a lot of messing around. I’m hesitant to go OSGaiken or some other brand of it won’t fix the throwout issue (which it won’t). Should I be looking at linkage under the dash? But what could make the throwout stay engaged? That sleeve it fits on is smooth but
    Maybe it’s binding? Does that go bad? Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login


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  2. Veedub00

    Veedub00 F1 Rookie
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Jun 30, 2006
    4,887
    Troy, Michigan
    Full Name:
    James
    Your clutch looks different than my clutch.
     
  3. Veedub00

    Veedub00 F1 Rookie
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Jun 30, 2006
    4,887
    Troy, Michigan
    Full Name:
    James
  4. vincenzo

    vincenzo F1 Rookie

    Nov 2, 2003
    3,373
    Some thoughts you might consider...

    Any sign of stiction in your splines?

    Any chance the seals are sticking?

    Return springs?

    What is the shaving from? Is it causing something to bind? What is causing the paint to wear off just behind the shaving?

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  5. dradambbb

    dradambbb Karting

    Apr 24, 2016
    124
    London
    Full Name:
    Adam
    My 87 TR (ex-Japan) came with the OS Giken flywheel and clutch. The clutch was exceedingly binary and I thought worn. I bought a replacement OS Giken clutch and fitted it. Definitely an improvement but still fairly binary. I need to give proper revs otherwise I get judder that vibrates the engine on its mounts. In summary, really good for sporty aggressive driving but not great for normal city use.
     
  6. c4b4the04

    c4b4the04 Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 9, 2017
    383
    Northern Virginia
    Full Name:
    Cassidy

    So that very thin thing that looks like a sliver of metal came off of Leia.....my Ridgeback auto mechanic helper! I didn't realize when I took the pic she was 'helping' with dog hair!

    I'm thinking the bearing support flange HAS to be damaged in some way. It isn't even allowing the bearing support bushing to go to full extension while it is sitting there. I am going to measure run out on a lathe tomorrow and look at how to machine it. If that isn't possible, has anyone successfully used the Hill Engineering replacements with the two disc setup? I messaged them and they are saying that parts 123359 and 123360 are only for single disc clutches but that doesn't sound right to me....those are the same on the F40 and 288 from what I see and they are the same on our cars too...so confused

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    vincenzo and mexicruiser like this.
  7. c4b4the04

    c4b4the04 Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 9, 2017
    383
    Northern Virginia
    Full Name:
    Cassidy

    Thank you, that is just the kind of info I needed. That is an expensive on/off switch. This car doesn't see much hard driving, just cruising. I have a track toy, and this will NEVER be that.... couldn't afford to keep it up!
     
  8. Gary Sandberg

    Gary Sandberg Formula Junior

    Hi Cassidy - sorry for your problems

    Also, sorry I forgot the year of your TR.

    I did my clutch last year and a couple of quick questions and thoughts:

    Did the vibration go away with the new clutch set-up?

    I recall turbo-joe recommended the use of a copper grease to coat the splines (used sparingly of course).

    Bleeding the clutch - I had to do it a couple of times to get it right - prior to that, 1st was hard to shift into.......free pedal travel is 2 - 3 mm from the service manual, and they mean it!
    When I bled and checked, no problems with shifting, just an additional thought. I'm at over 1500 miles after the clutch change.

    From the factory manual, here are the spring specs for the thrust bearing....
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  9. tbakowsky

    tbakowsky F1 World Champ
    Consultant Professional Ferrari Technician

    Sep 18, 2002
    19,349
    The Cold North
    Full Name:
    Tom
    Put the AP clutch set in it and drive. They are expensive but worth it because they work properly the first time. And if know how to really drive a manual well, it will out last you and perhaps the car.
     
  10. JohnMH

    JohnMH Formula 3

    Jan 28, 2004
    1,625
    Dubai / Bologna
    Who sells the AP kit?
     
  11. tbakowsky

    tbakowsky F1 World Champ
    Consultant Professional Ferrari Technician

    Sep 18, 2002
    19,349
    The Cold North
    Full Name:
    Tom
    Eurospares, superformance, etc. All the major Ferrari parts carriers can get you one. Again not cheap..but definatly worth the investment.
     

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