Lewis Hamilton discussion thread | Page 74 | FerrariChat

Lewis Hamilton discussion thread

Discussion in 'F1' started by Flavio_C, Aug 16, 2020.

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  1. furoni

    furoni F1 World Champ

    Jun 6, 2011
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    Pedro Braga Soares
    err, Jean only got in the car 2 seasons later....sorry
     
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  2. furoni

    furoni F1 World Champ

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    Pedro Braga Soares
    Nope, if there's a season i recall vividly ot's 89, mclarens were out of reach most of the races, only on a vert twisty Hungaroring and at the end of the year, Portugal and Spain were the Ferraris a real match for Mclaren. Ferrari had huge reliability problems (Gerhard had a record 12 retirements), and even when working proprtly, they could only fight the Mclarens on specific circuits, like, Hungaroring, estoril and spain.....
     
  3. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
    11,968
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    Sorry, but no, Pedro: I checked yesterday, it was only the massive power deficit that hindered the Ferrari, but their chassis was at least equal to the McLaren, probably slighlty better, already at the beginning of the season; but they had a big power deficit to the Honda until the end of the season; they started the season with officially 610 bhp, but many suspect the V-12 was barely on par with the Cosworth V8. They had at least 40 bhp less than the Honda at the season beginning, probably more, and were still 25/30 bhp behind at the end. But their chassis was better, no doubt.

    Rgds
     
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  4. DeSoto

    DeSoto F1 Veteran

    Nov 26, 2003
    7,481
    Look, you can say that it was the engine, it was the reliability, whatever. In the end McLaren had 3x wins and almost 3x points. Reliability and engine power are part of the game, and the car has to work all the season.

    Maybe you can say that the Ferrari or the Williams (they were 2nd ahead of Ferrari) were closer to the McLaren than what the stats say, but you can´t say that they were equal. No ****ing way you end with 3x points if you don´t have the all around best car.
     
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  5. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

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    #1830 nerofer, Feb 23, 2021
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2021
    But of course. My point is simply that the car was not the main factor in Ayrton's second and third title, it was the engine and the driver, not the "car" (understand: not the chassis). See the quote I have made of Gordon Kimball on the preceeding page about the 1990 McLaren, that says it better.
    In that matter, and to stay focused on the thread, I don't think that in these days Senna enjoyed the level of superiority that Lewis had at Mercedes, to say it in other words. Senna had to work harder.

    Rgds
     
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  6. DeSoto

    DeSoto F1 Veteran

    Nov 26, 2003
    7,481

    Oh, for me a car is a chassis and an engine that stays together without breaking for all the race.

    Anyway, the Honda engine had to be a miracle to win with that colossal margin if the chassis was not at least on par with the others. I guess it was better. The others could put a fight here and there, but not for all the season.
     
  7. furoni

    furoni F1 World Champ

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    Ok, if by car you mean chassis i would agree with you, but as DeSoto pointed out, the "car" is a whole, chassis, engine, gearbox, reliability, everything included.
     
  8. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

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    Honda had indeed a superiority margin; again, to repeat myself, see Kimball's quote on the preceeding page. Some people think that Honda actually started to suffer from a superiority complex, when they decided to build a V-12 that they didn't really need, and was a kind of an engineer fantasy. Senna was against the development of the V-12 and thought they should have pushed the development of the V-10.

    Rgds
     
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  9. Natkingcolebasket69

    Natkingcolebasket69 F1 World Champ

    Sorry for? I wasn’t saying Jean drove in 89w I was saying it loved him driving his v12 that was always breaking...so not sorry ;)


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  10. DeSoto

    DeSoto F1 Veteran

    Nov 26, 2003
    7,481
    Still you can't compare '89 to '90. In 1990 a better engine could make the difference. But the engine alone can't make a car score double points than the 2nd like in '89.
     
  11. furoni

    furoni F1 World Champ

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    So did i, Jean is my second favourite driver ever! It was so unfair he got such ****ty cars, him against Michael in the fast Ferraris would have been epic!
     
  12. Hey.....Hey.....Hey!!!

    You've some nerve leaving out Jim's shot given by Chapman.... :p
     
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  13. How can the sport "remains" what it never was? It's always been about teams that employ (not neccesarily for pay) drivers for their built/chosen weapons (cars)?
    They wouldn't have been/be competing without somebody's money forming the teams which provided those cars for them to drive.. ;)
     
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  14. jpalmito

    jpalmito F1 Veteran

    Jun 5, 2009
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    mathieu Jeantet
    No need to say it again!
    I get your point perfectly.
    Obviously our point of view is simply different, no drama .
     
  15. jpalmito

    jpalmito F1 Veteran

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    mathieu Jeantet
    OT
    Ferrari is back to compete top class hypercar in Le Mans (2023)
    So delighted !!:):)
     
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  16. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Along with Porsche too. Very interesting to see these 2 race each other.

    Although IMO, Porsche looks to be tough to beat.
     
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  17. furoni

    furoni F1 World Champ

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    Thats some ****ing great news!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  18. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

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    Not so sure...they will have to split their ressources, and running two different hares is the best way to catch none. I certainly would not like to see them loose in both disciplines. I think they should try to get back to the front in Formula One first, something they have not been able to do for the last ten years.
    Bad idea, if you ask me.

    Rgds
     
  19. No, no need for you.....but, as often as you do, I shall for newbies that don't know the history of the sport.
    And I, yours.
    Indeed; and absolutely no drama on this end. I post for the pleasure. :)
     
  20. #1845 lorenzobandini, Feb 24, 2021
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2021
    I'd love to see Scuderia Ferrari back in sports car racing, but I have to agree.

    I'm searching now but any links to the news?

    Edit: Disregard I see it's everywhere..... :)
     
  21. furoni

    furoni F1 World Champ

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    Stop being french :)...be optimistic!
     
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  22. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Well Pedro, Porsche, Audi and Toyota Gazoo Racing will join the class.....those are some.heavy hitters.

    I'm pessimistic as well.
     
  23. jpalmito

    jpalmito F1 Veteran

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    mathieu Jeantet
    Back to the sixties !
    Both Formula one and sportscars championships.
     
  24. jpalmito

    jpalmito F1 Veteran

    Jun 5, 2009
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    The enthusiasm for the endurance championship is perhaps also the result of the overwhelming domination of Mercedes in F1. Come on! Another year of the Hamilton-Bottas duo to terminate the patient!
     
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  25. Beau365

    Beau365 Formula 3

    Feb 27, 2005
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    +1

    Mercedes domination with Russell and Bottas would be dull enough.
     
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