Maranellos are disappearing | Page 77 | FerrariChat

Maranellos are disappearing

Discussion in '456/550/575' started by intrepidcva11, Mar 30, 2015.

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  1. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 19, 2008
    37,986
    Clarksville, Tennessee
    Full Name:
    Terry H Phillips
    Eric- Nobody is going to be able to tell that you have Fabio's exhaust except a real expert. As long as you have cats and valves installed, should be no problem getting one to pass in CA. The heat shields on the headers make it difficult to tell she has SS headers.

    Good luck on the purchase.

    I would not have bought the spare tire, factory battery charger (love the Schedoni case and have one for my CTEK), shields, or HiFi stereo. Would take them for free, but would not have ordered them. I am highly ambivalent about shields on any late Ferrari. Maybe the painted ones.
     
  2. ferraridriver

    ferraridriver F1 Rookie

    Aug 8, 2002
    4,134
    Bay Area Calif.
    Full Name:
    Dave
    In California it is illegal to modify any part of the emissions system. There is a visual inspection and while most smog stations won't know a factory system from a modified system there always is a possibility that one will. A modified exhaust system in California has the potential to be massively expensive

    I got called out once for having an after market exhaust gas temperature gauge on my Excursion because the bung for the probe had been welded to the exhaust manifold. They called that a modification.
    It all depends on the individual smog tester, in other words it's a gamble every two years unless the modified system has a CARB approved number.
     
  3. Bluebottle

    Bluebottle F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Oct 15, 2012
    7,699
    Newbury, Berkshire, England
    Full Name:
    John
    I see this went for £77,501, presumably plus buyer's premium? Unlike BAT, they wipe the bidding history / comments when a car is sold, which is not very helpful - did anyone notice who bought it? Trade / private buyer? I would imagine the latter at that price.
     
  4. niftyfivefifty

    niftyfivefifty Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 5, 2007
    366
    PacNW
    Just like Taz said, a good 5 star autoglass specialist will have the right stuff to cure it. I picked up two chips last year and after seeing windshield pricing, I filled the chips and kept driving. Windshields are $3k+ shipped, windshield bezels need to be replaced at the same time (I am told they rarely stay in one piece when pulled), and that is another $2k. And we haven't even started talking labor! Allferrariparts had a $1400 windshield last summer but it disappeared by fall.
     
  5. 21ATS

    21ATS Formula Junior

    Dec 10, 2016
    988
    Kent, UK
    Full Name:
    Alan
    I was watching that up until about 90 mins before it finished. It looked like an Australian was bidding on it and he managed to get a bit confused and outbid himself when he thought he was putting in a "safety" bid. Still, it was so close to what the reserve was (which turned out to be £70k) that a "house bid" was entered to take the reserve off. So I last I saw it was at £70,500.

    So £82,151.06 including premium.

    I'd say that makes your £75K firm ask look about spot on John.
     
    Bluebottle likes this.
  6. Konadog06

    Konadog06 Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 22, 2007
    959
    Daytona Beach, Florida
    Full Name:
    Bill
    My experience with a windshield chip is the same as the other responses, the epoxy repair stops the spread. However, if the chip interferes with your line of sight you will be looking at it for a long time. Personally, especially with a new to me car I would want to start fresh. A nice windshield makes for a more pleasurable driving experience. If you were to be driving in an area where you are at risk for more chips, then it may make less sense to go new.
    Bill
    FL.
     
  7. Themaven

    Themaven F1 Rookie

    Nov 2, 2014
    4,252
    Eastdown
    Full Name:
    Darius
    £82k for a 30k mile no warranty 550 at auction. Firm market.
     
  8. Crocodon

    Crocodon Karting

    May 12, 2020
    143
    London
    Full Name:
    Daniel
    Interestingly the seller was listed as Bell Sport & Classic. Don’t know if that counts for anything or if the purchaser could take any comfort from that?
     
  9. 21ATS

    21ATS Formula Junior

    Dec 10, 2016
    988
    Kent, UK
    Full Name:
    Alan
    It was a "Managed" sale which is my pet hate on this type of platform. Basically a dealer is representing the car on behalf of a customer who doesn't want to deal with the general populous. So it's a private sale, you buy the car from the owner, the owner then gives the "Managing Agent" a wad of cash for sheilding them from the hoi polloi, but there's no dealer facilities or backup.

    I ended up have a couple of conversations with Ed Lovett about this and he agreed to add the following text I suggested to make it a bit more Transparent:-

    SELLER TYPE
    Managed
    This is a private sale, with viewings and enquiries being handled by a third party on behalf of the owner.


    This all came about as I was bidding on a 550 which had this classification and I wasn't comfortable who I was actually buying the car from. Plus I was bidding against people who thought they were buying from a dealer and were prepared to pay more as they thought they had some sort of security.

    It was at this point I discivered the sheer volume of "Dealers" operating in this manner as essentially "brokers" and circumventing all the legal requirements of being a motor trader.

    In fact this is the MO of Ed Lovetts own business. https://www.internationalcollectables.com/

    One look at that website and you'd assume you're buying from a dealer. You're not. He's a "broker".
     
  10. Ferrari55whoa

    Ferrari55whoa F1 Rookie
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 21, 2005
    2,593
    Los Gatos, CA
    Full Name:
    Eric
    We could extend this discussion to Bring A Trailer in the US. It just floors me how people will buy a "high value" car from an individual without a PPI (on anything other than maybe a super low mileage investment garage queen).

    Photos are great but lets get a flashlight and take off the belly pan and actually dig into these cars. Lot of guys are buying cars without a strong understanding of what a cars true needs might be. We have to assume that those people are so wealthy that dealing with five digit maintenance/repairs is not a big deal.

    One interesting exclusion to the "normal" was a recent F-chatter that sold his 550 on BaT (I'd have to check I think it had maybe 40k miles. He provided a HUGE amount of documentation and had it consistently serviced at Ferrari of Atlanta and had paid more in documented maintenance over the 11-ish years he owned it than he paid initially for the car. That was one that you would hope a "no-PPI" could feel good about.
     
    brogenville likes this.
  11. niftyfivefifty

    niftyfivefifty Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 5, 2007
    366
    PacNW
    Well that is disconcerting. I have my dealer's license here in the USA for the state of Washington, and based on my continuing education I am pretty sure this is considered a form a fraud here.
     
  12. 21ATS

    21ATS Formula Junior

    Dec 10, 2016
    988
    Kent, UK
    Full Name:
    Alan
    I agree. At best it's misleading, at worst I believe it's misrepresentation.

    As ever it will take a high profile event that requires very public legal intervention before it's addressed. Such is the way in the UK with things of this nature.
     
    niftyfivefifty likes this.
  13. JayCee500

    JayCee500 Rookie

    Jul 24, 2020
    25
    South East
    Full Name:
    Jonty
    Hi, ATS
    I too have sampled Collecting Cars.
    I found it a thoroughly frustrating experience which in reality is a glorified “Top Marques” with an intro fee.
    Of the cars I was interested in three were at best mis represented and two were being sold as private when they were actually trade sales.
    I traced one back to a previous BAT sale, literally a box of bits, being sold as highly original but freshly resprayed. They didn’t mention new doors, floor, bonnet, bumpers, lights, wheels etc and that the seller had rebuilt it in his garage.
    Another was an import with no history prior to importing to the Uk and then full history with one owner.
    It took me two calls to ascertain that it did indeed have a service history on the Ferrari database but the mileage when it was exported was higher than the current, three years later.
    The second call enlightened me to the fact that the seller wasn’t the owner and he couldn’t confirm any details about the car. A third call to a friend who had seen the car at another dealer confirmed that the car had three other owners (not on the v5) two of which were amateur racing drivers.
    The third, described as totally original, had appeared six months earlier at a dealer who advertised that the car had some accident damage and had a full respray.
    On all occasions CC were not particularly interested when I brought this to their attention.
    I fully accept that one takes a chance at auction but as you have previously remarked CC is not a traditional auction house.
    Interestingly the car I did buy was from a dealer who presented me with a trade sale invoice.
    They didn’t seem to understand that this was legally incorrect.

    I would say that there are many traders buying and selling on CC and a few are masquerading as private sellers.
    I suggested that transparency and due diligence / inspection would enhance CC’s reputation in the long term and provide a unique offering rather than the short term gain they appear to prefer.
    It has exit strategy written all over it.



    Sent from my iPad using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
    21ATS likes this.
  14. niftyfivefifty

    niftyfivefifty Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 5, 2007
    366
    PacNW
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  15. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    26,294
    socal
    My maranello does not fit into my life but I like it so I keep it. I had a rare long drive in it today and man these cars drive great! If you don't have one of these you gotta get one. It is a perfect street car sporty GT. I'm lucky to have one of the few maranellos with MSW cruise control. Thanks Dave! It is flawless and the way Ferrari should have delivered the maranello.
     
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  16. niftyfivefifty

    niftyfivefifty Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 5, 2007
    366
    PacNW
    #1916 niftyfivefifty, Feb 13, 2021
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2021
    I believe it to be one of the top 10 most every-day useable "supercars" ever made. And a rare case where more miles=less problems. I am also finding how incredibly rare it is when I do take it out, and many people tell me they've never seen one in person before. It intrigues non-car people because they recognize how different it is compared to the well known mid engine Ferraris. But every now and then, someone says, "That's the car from Bad Boys 2!" and those are usually really fun conversations.

    I was so excited to post the result of today's BaT sale that I missed this post. It would be very interesting if VINs next to links to these cars were to be posted for search engine crawls to pick it up in this thread. Possibly a way to help innocent buyers, especially any first-timers. I can't even imagine the heartache it would be to discover a newly acquired 550 had major issues like odometer rollback or well-hidden structural damage. But it could lead to good off-market deals on driver's level cars...
     
  17. Ferrari55whoa

    Ferrari55whoa F1 Rookie
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 21, 2005
    2,593
    Los Gatos, CA
    Full Name:
    Eric
    @niftyfivefifty ive been doing that over on that other thread I’ve been maintaining on BaT sales.
     
  18. niftyfivefifty

    niftyfivefifty Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 5, 2007
    366
    PacNW
    Cool, I will check it out.
     
  19. Themaven

    Themaven F1 Rookie

    Nov 2, 2014
    4,252
    Eastdown
    Full Name:
    Darius
    Agree with everything you and Alan have said. CC looks good, but dig a bit and it shows its cracks. You start to see the codes for dealers selling “privately”, if they haven’t taken care to disguise their location. Hendon Way Motors, a [adjective redacted] Porsche “specialist”, was what alerted me to this initially.

    Having said that, you can inspect if the vendor responds to your request to do so. UK is easier to get around to inspect cars than the US and BAT.
     
  20. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 19, 2008
    37,986
    Clarksville, Tennessee
    Full Name:
    Terry H Phillips
    Darius- Yup, always amazed me how small the UK is and how quickly you could get anywhere on a motorway. We would tell our neighbors we were driving up to Scotland for the weekend, though, and you would have thought we said we were driving to Rome.
     
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  21. Themaven

    Themaven F1 Rookie

    Nov 2, 2014
    4,252
    Eastdown
    Full Name:
    Darius
    I know and likewise I am always amazed at the distances Americans drive without batting an eyelid. But our roads are generally more crowded and stressful than yours (except in the last 11 months). 100 miles in Britain often feels like 300 miles in, say, France.
     
  22. Crocodon

    Crocodon Karting

    May 12, 2020
    143
    London
    Full Name:
    Daniel
    2 miles from Notting Hill to Fulham on a busy day feels as stressful as 300 miles on the highway.
     
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  23. JayCee500

    JayCee500 Rookie

    Jul 24, 2020
    25
    South East
    Full Name:
    Jonty
    Hi,
    I just wanted to clarify my comments about BAT.
    When I have viewed, including the car I mentioned, I was taken by the level of scrutiny and knowledge on display by the various comments and posts. The sellers being subjected to light hearted banter and due diligence.
    If there is nothing to hide what is the problem with this?
    I wish we had the same Europe.



    Sent from my iPad using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
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  24. niftyfivefifty

    niftyfivefifty Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 5, 2007
    366
    PacNW
    Yeah it seems like Europe would benefit from a BaT solution. Probably a big opportunity.
     
  25. 21ATS

    21ATS Formula Junior

    Dec 10, 2016
    988
    Kent, UK
    Full Name:
    Alan
    Collecting Cars set out to be just that, but somewhere along the road they took a wrong turn and rather than be open and transparent, chose the opposite.

    Non selling cars are removed from the site, sales to traders are often removed to hide the price paid. There are plenty of traders "selling their own cars" as a private sales. There are traders posing outright as private sellers.

    All of a sudden, selling cars on the internet in the UK has become the wild west. There are a number of established and high profile dealers pretty irritated about it, just waiting for a litigation event that shines a light on the entire industry.

    It's a shame, they really could have been Europes BAT.
     
    niftyfivefifty likes this.

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