Why I hate McLaren | Page 4 | FerrariChat

Why I hate McLaren

Discussion in 'British' started by Igor Ound, May 14, 2019.

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  1. BJK

    BJK F1 Rookie

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    375+ and Boomhauer like this.
  2. BJK

    BJK F1 Rookie

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    #77 BJK, Aug 12, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2020
  3. BJK

    BJK F1 Rookie

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    #78 BJK, Aug 12, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2020
  4. BJK

    BJK F1 Rookie

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  5. BJK

    BJK F1 Rookie

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    Vid description says only 149 being built??? (Not sure if that's true, but they are a dealer, so they should know) Production number started at 399, then 249, then .....
    Well maybe McLaren finally heard all the owners screams about massive depreciation on their new cars from over-production.
    McLaren has learned it has to preserve some exclusivity and value to it's brand like Ferrari does. You can't just walk into a Ferrari dealer and pick from 10 brand new cars. Each is specced and ordered by a customer.
    McLaren will produce far fewer cars in the future. Great cars, just too bad their reputation for massive depreciation (and check engine lights) is already set.


    .
     
  6. Igor Ound

    Igor Ound F1 Veteran

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    Or maybe nobody wanted this other massive POS? Do they still have eyes at mclaren?
     
  7. BJK

    BJK F1 Rookie

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    statements like that make you sound like a clown.
    .
     
  8. Igor Ound

    Igor Ound F1 Veteran

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    #83 Igor Ound, Aug 15, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2020
    So you think mclaren decided to reduce production numbers to maintain exclusivity just now that they’re about to collapse and I’m the clown, or they couldn’t find buyers? Just look at that thing and all the other “special editions” on these pages with a straight face. I’ll be the clown but they’re a joke.
    No matter how much they pay Chris Harris...
     
  9. BMW.SauberF1Team

    BMW.SauberF1Team F1 World Champ

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    BJK likes this.
  10. BMW.SauberF1Team

    BMW.SauberF1Team F1 World Champ

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    I still can't believe this hasn't sold. $15mm was the price when first listed...not sure if it's changed since the dollar has weakened since. Only 10 ever made and it's the first one.
     
  11. MarkNC

    MarkNC Formula Junior
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    #86 MarkNC, Aug 15, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2020
    Not a surprise. The race cars, even when road converted, never achieved the same high dollar sales figures as the road cars. $15M is way overpriced for a race car. I was offered one of the F1 race cars McLaren had in their bonded warehouse for an asking price of $8M a few years ago. It sold and I saw it at an event soon after. I certainly couldn't have afforded an $8M car but I'm pretty sure it sold for less than that. They also had a road car in the warehouse and it was a LOT more money than that. I couldn't afford that either but I did get a chance to sit in the car which was pretty awesome in an of itself!

    Fun fact: all the "road converted" McLaren F1 race cars I've seen are two seaters because there's a whole bunch of controls that go where the right hand seat goes in the race cars and there's no easy place to move them to.
     
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  12. MarkNC

    MarkNC Formula Junior
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    Look I know you hate McLaren but calling Elva a "massive POS" is just insane. Think about this. It weighs 1,100 lbs (500kg) less than the Ferrari Monza SP2 that costs more money. Being so much lighter, and having more horsepower to boot, the Elva will be a way more exciting car to drive. So are you calling the Monza a POS as well?
     
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  13. tomc

    tomc Two Time F1 World Champ

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    +1
    Assuming I heard it right, on the Miller Motorcars video, they said that there is an optional windscreen for the US market. That alone is a plus IMO versus the Monza...T
     
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  14. BMW.SauberF1Team

    BMW.SauberF1Team F1 World Champ

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    Thanks for the info. How many years ago was that? I've heard 19R sold for $12 million to the current owner some years ago, but it was a private sale so not entirely sure how accurate the sum is. I personally don't get the price premium the road cars get over the race version as THJ said in that video as it's not like the road cars are driven regularly. He claims the race cars have commanded more than the road cars recently but then he is asking $15 million for this which is below $20 million for a road car. Maybe he means the short tail GTRs go for more....
     
  15. MarkNC

    MarkNC Formula Junior
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    I don’t recall exactly when it was but at least 2 years ago. I don’t think anything has changed regarding the relative values of the road cars vs. race cars. I know a road car sold privately recently for over US$25M and one went for US$19.8M at auction last year as well. They tend to sell for more privately than at auction because discretion and privacy are valuable to people buying cars like these.
     
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  16. Igor Ound

    Igor Ound F1 Veteran

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    #91 Igor Ound, Aug 15, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2020
    I don’t think it should even be in the same sentence as the Monza and seems demand proves me right. And this weight thing is so overrated. Otherwise just buy a go-kart. It’s so goofy it’s unreal
     
  17. MarkNC

    MarkNC Formula Junior
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    You’re right. The Elva is a serious lightweight sports car.

    BMW makes a 4 seater, 4WD SUV that weighs less than than the Monza!! The Monza is based on the 812 which is a giant beast of a car. I have an 812. With a full tank of gas it weighs 4,011 pounds and Ferrari states the Monza SP2 weighs only 11 pounds lighter than the 812SF. I love my 812 but that Monza is not going to drive as nicely on twisty roads as an Elva that weighs 1,100 pounds less!

    1,100 pounds! That’s the weight of FIVE 220 pound (100kg) people!
     
  18. Igor Ound

    Igor Ound F1 Veteran

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    Who cares about weight when it looks like that? There’s loads of lighter sports/track cars for a 20th of the price. Not the biggest fan of Stephenson but they should kidnap him and get him back to work asap
     
  19. MarkNC

    MarkNC Formula Junior
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    #94 MarkNC, Aug 16, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2020
    I’ll give you that the Monza looks to be a very pretty car but I’ve not seen one in person. I’ve spent considerable time around (and inside) the Elva model and I thought it was beautiful and interesting enough to want to buy one because I know how much enjoyment I get out of my Senna and I love the idea of an open top car that marries the lightness and driving thrill of the Senna to an open cockpit without all the crazy aero ugliness needed to make the Senna a weapon on the track.

    Which I suppose would be true of the Monza as well but that isn’t the point. We’re talking about topless high performance road cars here. Isn’t the point supposed to be about how well it drives? I love my 812 but my Senna accelerates, turns and brakes better because it’s 964 pounds lighter. The Monza is essentially an 11-pound lighter 812 while the Elva is a 100 pound lighter Senna with 14 more HP. The Elva will be well over a THOUSAND POUNDS lighter than the Monza SP2!
     
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  20. BJK

    BJK F1 Rookie

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    statements like that make you sound like a clown.
    .
     
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  21. Igor Ound

    Igor Ound F1 Veteran

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    #96 Igor Ound, Aug 16, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2020
    Not sure what the Monza has to do with this other than they’re both cars. Congratulations on your cars but this is a sad abomination to my eye, way overpriced, same old mclaren tech as all their other cars since the mp4, produced by a company on the brink of collapse which couldn’t find even a third of the buyers initially planned. Also lightness is by far not the one and only characteristic of a well driving car. Open diff anyone?
     
  22. Igor Ound

    Igor Ound F1 Veteran

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    #97 Igor Ound, Aug 16, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2020
    Why exactly? Care to elaborate instead of just becoming personal and nasty? You make such good points anyway I’ll take it as a compliment. “Can’t sell the number of cars pre-announced as usual -> looking for exclusivity now with the liquidators at the door.” They need to change a lot. Only a clown can’t see that.
     
  23. MarkNC

    MarkNC Formula Junior
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    The McLaren F1 "couldn't even find a third of buyers initially planned" either. They planned to build 300 road cars but they only managed to sell 64.
     
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  24. Igor Ound

    Igor Ound F1 Veteran

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    Frankly I quite dislike that one too and shows how mclaren can’t help themselves but charge too much, but that’s not the point.
    At the time the F1 was very innovative and a fresh design. The company was in good health too. Now it’s a race to building an ever uglier bodykit on the same platform and charge absurd money to keep the gates open. Smells of desperation and the Elva has gone too. Then trying to spin disinterest for a new exclusivity quest is the BS cherry on the cake...
     
  25. MarkNC

    MarkNC Formula Junior
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    That's a silly argument considering that Ferrari's F140 series V12 has been used in more models than McLaren's twin turbo V8. But we're hopefully both smart enough to understand that these engines have gone through multiple, and often significant, revisions as they've been reimplemented in different models.
     
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