348 Climate Control Unit Repaired | FerrariChat

348 Climate Control Unit Repaired

Discussion in '348/355' started by 348USA, May 10, 2016.

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  1. 348USA

    348USA Rookie

    Jun 12, 2013
    25
    Just wanted to pass along my experience with Automotive Scientific in Rodgersville Tn. My climate control module hasn't worked right since I bought my 1991 348 TS 3 years ago and since then I have monitored all the chat sites on module repair or replacement I could find on the internet without much positive news until I ran across a members comments on this web site recommending Automotive Scientific based on his results. Well I am happy to report that for the first time since buying the car that the climate control module is working 100% and now I know exactly what will happen when I turn on the heat or air-conditioning or engage the foot vents Etc. The repair bill wasn't cheap at $489 + $47 tax but the results are more than worth it as the original design of the control unit is actually very good when it is working correctly. The unit comes back with a one year warranty and since I have only just installed and run the unit I will report back in a month and again at the end of the year with my long term results but for now its just great having this thing doing what I want it do rather than it just running off and doing all kinds of crazy random things in between small bouts of sanity. I had almost given up on this thing based on all the negative chatter out there. Have any other members out there been able to repair or find repair facilities to fix your climate control module? Does anyone out there have a module that's never required repair and is still working as it did when new?
     
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  2. ///Mike

    ///Mike F1 Veteran

    Dec 11, 2003
    6,097
    Bugtussle
    #2 ///Mike, May 10, 2016
    Last edited: May 10, 2016
    That's great news! Thanks for the info. Climate control module failure has been perhaps my biggest fear in owning a 348 so this is welcome news indeed. No problems with mine so far and I agree it's a fine design for its time, although I wish it would scroll through temp settings instead of me having to push a button for each and every degree change. Or is that a flaw in my particular unit?

    Please do follow up and let us know how it holds up over time.

    Thanks again for the post.

    Edit: From the date on the module it appears that the module in my car was replaced at some point. I had mine out to refinish the center console and found a loose screw literally floating around inside of the thing. Disassembled it to replace the screw and found a broken button that I was able to repair with plastic glue. Overall they seem rather fragile and not at all easy to repair. So I think the price you paid is very fair.
     
  3. 348USA

    348USA Rookie

    Jun 12, 2013
    25
    Well that didn't take long to provide an update to my original post on my climate control repair. After a few days of flawless operation the module is doing the exact same crazy things starting with the fan on full speed regardless of what the panel controls indicate so now I am not sure whether or not to send the unit back to Automotive Scientific in Tn or just be glad that they didn't damage the unit further and forget the whole thing? They didn't return the unit with any kind of report so who knows what they did or didn't do while they had it. I hate the idea of taking the console all apart again and sending it to Tn for what may be just another waste of time. Not sure what to do now if anything?
     
  4. ///Mike

    ///Mike F1 Veteran

    Dec 11, 2003
    6,097
    Bugtussle
    I'd certainly send it back. Only takes a few minutes to remove.
     
  5. Wade

    Wade Three Time F1 World Champ
    Owner

    Mar 31, 2006
    32,793
    East Central, FL
    Full Name:
    Wade O.
    #5 Wade, May 16, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Verify that the connector is fully seated. Sometime during the production run Ferrari changed the position of the connector and I wondered why...

    From my observation, with the early cars, the connector's wire bundle (cable) is strained by the console's lower side cover. Not so much with the later cars.

    Not only is the connector repositioned, but its flipped 180 degrees as well. While not perfect, there's a lot less stress on the cable connector.

    White one is from my 1990 while the black unit is from the [later] Spider.
    .
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  6. vvassallo

    vvassallo F1 Veteran
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    Aug 4, 2006
    8,281
    Palos Verdes
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    Vince V
    I think most of the trouble is wiring related. Or grounding. Those connectors are pretty cheap.
     
  7. pnicholasen

    pnicholasen Formula 3

    Jan 14, 2011
    1,357
    South of Philly
    Full Name:
    Paul Nicholasen
    And how! Those connecting pins are hardly larger than a human hair and they are too close together to try to solder wires directly onto the pins to get rid of the finicky plug.
     
  8. agnello11

    agnello11 Karting

    May 27, 2008
    79
    Erratic fan speed is more usually attributed to the fan speed controller located in the heater box under the hood. Don't automatically assume your returned unit has turned faulty again - it may be that it is now working correctly and you are now finding additional faults and problems with other components within the system which were being masked by the faulty controller.
    Working through the errors on these systems is a bit of a pain!
     
  9. SoCal1

    SoCal1 F1 Veteran
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    Jun 14, 2011
    8,562
    SoCal LA/OC/New Mexico
    Full Name:
    Tim Dee
    You ever get this sorted out?
     
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  10. Rpin

    Rpin Karting

    Aug 24, 2016
    76
    SoCal
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    Rpin
    Did you ever send the unit back or get further with this issue?
     
  11. John Glen

    John Glen Formula Junior

    Dec 30, 2009
    476
    Victoria, B.C, Can.
    Full Name:
    John Glen Wesanko
    My 1990 348 ts has the same issues. I've had the unit out and cleaned and Stabilant 22 on all the pins and inspected the boards....etc etc. I have also replaced the "hidden fuse" with an aircraft circuit breaker. Now that I finally have all the service manuals I realize that I never followed the comprehensive hvac diagnosis procedures laid out. I still suspect a wiring/ground issue ? Sometimes the fan will just come on full speed and if I "slap" the carpeted side of the console I can get the fan to stop. This would seem to indicate an intermittent or faulty connection either at the main harness on the back of the unit or some "major" system ground that is loose or faulty. I also replaced my fan speed controller unit that lives in the left side of plenum with no improvement....Also it seems that after fooling with everything , often it powers up and almost seems to work for a short while ? Not for long though
     
  12. Wade

    Wade Three Time F1 World Champ
    Owner

    Mar 31, 2006
    32,793
    East Central, FL
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    Wade O.
    Yes, it's important to isolate the down to the HVAC ECU before replacing it, or attempting a repair. From my experience and research, various outside issues are the root of the problem instead.
     
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  13. POLO35

    POLO35 Formula Junior

    Feb 21, 2005
    712
    Treasure Coast Florida
    Full Name:
    MATT
    I believe most problems are related to the multi pin connector plug. I have unplugged mine several times cleaned with contact cleaner it works pretty good for a while and then starts acting up. Now when I get in the car I just turn the air on and take my hand and give it a slap on the side of the console....the clock will get brighter and the air conditioning works flawlessly therefore I know it is a connection problem without a doubt.
     
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  14. m.stojanovic

    m.stojanovic F1 Rookie
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    Dec 22, 2011
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    Miroljub Stojanovic
    There are also multi pin connectors inside between the PC boards, corrosion of which is probably more the cause of erratic operation. The pic below (posted by one of the members here, I think) shows the internals of the early type AC ECU (black back cover); the later type (same external shape and sizes), white back cover, has gold plated internal pins/sockets so it should suffer much less due to poor internal connector contacts.

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  15. john a barnes

    john a barnes Karting
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    Dec 19, 2018
    242
    muskego wi
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    John a Barnes
    Alright folks, I have the answer. It's the Marrone wire on Pin #1 power feed at the connector. But It's not the wire, it's female pin. The wire is good multi-strand stuff. Not GM or FCA latter day crap. I extended the Fuse wire under the Frunk and I also installed a circuit breaker. I did Stabilant at the HVAC head and it still seemed like power or ground problem. The clock and characters would go goofy once in awhile or after requesting heat or A/C. Circuit loading. So I R and R'd the Head again. I took the yellow cover off of the connecter. Underneath is a Black connector with little windows right at the base giving access to the female pins. I used a meter and a test light. Test light puts a quarter amp stress on the circuit. I had power at the wire on top but only intermittantly at the window. I went to the Salvage yard looking for similar conns., but settled on bringing home some FCA TIPM conns. I cut off of a minivan. They are tiny but TOO big! Damn!. I had a HELL of a time getting that Marrone conn out of the black box conn. I squared off a T-belt tensioner grenade pin. I held the Black conn with a visegrip. I held my pin with a visegrip and heated it with a propane torch and carefully made the hole bigger while gently pulling sideways out to the corner of the black block. I did not want to melt thru the insulation wall of course. Got my female conn to lock solid with good depth and I tried it and double checked what I had. I reassembled and now have no trouble for 3 weeks and 300 miles. I thought now is the time to post this.
     
  16. John Glen

    John Glen Formula Junior

    Dec 30, 2009
    476
    Victoria, B.C, Can.
    Full Name:
    John Glen Wesanko
    Excellent post John Barnes ! I believe this is the common issue with most of these hvac problems. I can make my 90 348 system wonky by just manipulating the main harness black and yellow plug on the back of the control unit. Is it possible the main power (maroon) wire supplying the unit was manufactured with an oversize female pin ID to fit a heavier guage wire ? It sounds like you went to considerable ends to get the correct pin fit. I was thinking if "tinning" with solder the applicable male pin would increase the pin dia just enough to tighten the fit ? Thanks again for your post ! Cheers, J Glen Wesanko
     
  17. john a barnes

    john a barnes Karting
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    Dec 19, 2018
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    There is no room to tin or re-solder anything!! It's so tiny. Besides, I believe the connector was actually cracked in 2 pieces. I finally got it out in 2 pieces. The wires are really great stock. Fine, multi-stranded like aircraft stuff. If I wiggled the test light thru the little window, I think it was actually doing a make-or-break inside the housing with firm pressure on the test light. BTW, the plastic gage face plate must be handled like a Faberge egg. The screw hole towers fall apart and I built them up with Loctite Plastic Weld. It's a FAST 5 minute epoxy. Then re-drill the holes. Do the sticky right away if you haven't. And grind the back of the ashtray door right away so it closes nice. Fit everything then paint it with Rust-Oleum 2x Acrylic satin black and then clear coat the black with 2x Matte clear. It turned out great.!! Sorry I don't have any pictures because I fix the stuff and don't even think about it. (I fix cars and trucks for a living) I put the control head back on with Some Goop II on the screws and the corners with a small blade screwdriver for insurance. GL
     
  18. John Glen

    John Glen Formula Junior

    Dec 30, 2009
    476
    Victoria, B.C, Can.
    Full Name:
    John Glen Wesanko
    My suggestion is to apply solder (tinning) the male pin #1 protruding from the unit. This should slightly increase the diameter of the pin and improve the fit and conductivity with the main harness plug ?
     
  19. john a barnes

    john a barnes Karting
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    Dec 19, 2018
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    Try it. In all my years of fixing things, I'd rather fix a wire than mess with an abortion of a computer box. I've been inside doing transistors and capacitors but not mess with the Male pins like that. Besides, I believe I had a cracked and severed connector. Maybe weakened when the rapid machine assembled it. If I took a movie of what I found when I tested, it would be revealed to you folks. It was very interesting. To me anyway!!! haha
     
  20. john a barnes

    john a barnes Karting
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    1500 miles. Still working perfectly. We get Houston or New Orleans humidity up here. Gotta have A/C.
     
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  21. Fmuto42

    Fmuto42 Karting

    Jul 19, 2015
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    Downingtown, PA
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    Frank
    That’s awesome - I may want to do this. Today it worked great, other days, not so great…
     
  22. David Baldwin

    David Baldwin Rookie

    May 5, 2019
    9
    Kent, United Kingdom
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    David Baldwin
    I thought I would re light this subject as I have encountered a few intermittent problems with my heater control. For some reason a previous owner or repair shop had put my fuel gauge in the wrong location on the centre console. Today I removed the console and changed the clocks back over no problem, While I was in there I thought I would look at the heater control connections and the circuit boards, I found a burn mark on the PCB which looks to be a capacitor that has got a bit hot. I am fortunate to have some one that is a repair specialist for AV equipment and he is always repairing circuit boards so on Monday he has an urgent job which is to de solder and replace the capacitor and just check the rest of the boards over.

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  23. john a barnes

    john a barnes Karting
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    Dec 19, 2018
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    Thanx David. I remember taking a look inside but didn't see that. BTW. that same 12v circuit is feeding the control head and the Compressor clutch. That frunk fuse can't handle it as some of us know. I installed an electronic 40A fuse with a new holder and a new Compressor. I could not find a new clutch coil for that one.
     
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  24. m.stojanovic

    m.stojanovic F1 Rookie
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    Dec 22, 2011
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    The green component is actualy a resistor, 0.82 Ohm (marked R82) if I remember well. It looks pretty good (still green and not blackened) so I don't think it needs to be replaced. This resistor limits the current to the heater pump motor and can run fairly hot (in normal operation) causing some blackening of the PC board over time. This does not necessarily mean that the resistor is overheating. It will overheat and burn if the water pump motor gets seized and starts drawing excessive current. In such a case, the resistor would look like this:

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  25. David Baldwin

    David Baldwin Rookie

    May 5, 2019
    9
    Kent, United Kingdom
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    David Baldwin
    Thanks for that info, I will just get the board checked over and cleaned and also get the plug connections cleaned too, As its our service workshop it will only cost me a few packets of cookies!
     
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