Best options for 812 exhaust (rear boxes)? | Page 3 | FerrariChat

Best options for 812 exhaust (rear boxes)?

Discussion in 'F12/812' started by KarlA69, Nov 16, 2019.

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  1. gzachary

    gzachary Formula Junior
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    Wow that is great to hear!

    Pun intended :)

    I wonder if this would work in California emissions. I am seeking the right system for me. Not decat loud at all. I don’t know whether 100 cell is closer to decat or 200 cell. What kind of noise scale gets created ?

    Congratulations! How do you characterize your sound now?
     
  2. KarlA69

    KarlA69 Formula Junior

    Oct 9, 2017
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    I hear California has strict emissions, I suspect stricter than UK. Not sure how a modified 812 would fare...?

    In terms of the right set up, I can’t comment on the difference between 100 and 200 cell in terms of sound. Not sure how much difference it makes in practice.

    But the lower the cell count, the more flow and noise (so 100 cell is closer to decat than 200). Having heard it, I think a full decat on an 812 is excessive (and illegal)

    How do I characterise mine? Perfect! Because you have the remote, you can open the valves. This means as rpm rise the car gets louder and more intense sounding progressively (rather than the sudden increase in volume when valves open, which i dislike).

    Secondly it is significantly louder and more high pitched than stock. Above 7k rpm it really screams!

    All in all, I’m very happy. Sound is of course subjective in terms of what’s better or too loud... do you know anyone locally that has done mods you can listen to??

    all the best on your quest for aural pleasure :)
     
  3. ScuderiaCarParts

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    Karl,

    I'm jumping in to show off your car for you ;)

    Video here:
    Blog post here: https://www.scuderiacarparts.com/blog/ferrari-812-decats-or-sport-cats/

    Honestly, this is the best sounding 812 I've ever heard and I think I've heard pretty much every exhaust configuration under the sun - really happy for you!!!
    The video does a really good job of showing off how much of a difference the cats make, and as you will be able to attest it does not make the car an obnoxious volume!!

    Dylan
     
  4. j34

    j34 Karting
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    Finally reporting back here. Just got the 812 back with Klein 200 cell and capristo back box (will be swapping for Klein in a couple of weeks). It sounds much louder and more aggressive and heightens basically everything about the sound of the car. At low RPM it isn’t too much louder that I’m worried about pissing off my neighbors more than they already are! I am very happy with this setup as I feel it’s what the car is supposed to sound like with less restriction and H pipe so air and exhaust gas flows right through and out of the car. I really dont understand adding an X pipe, but it’s certainly a subjective concept. For me this produces a more raw and natural sound, but may be too aggressive for some tastes. I don’t notice any drone either that people had warned about.
     
  5. j34

    j34 Karting
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    One more note: maybe it’s just the new cats but has anyone had a metallic rattle sort of sound from 200 cell cats addition?
     
  6. Il Co-Pilota

    Il Co-Pilota F1 Veteran

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    Why would you switch to Klein boxes in a couple of weeks if you like the sound?
     
  7. j34

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    I had ordered the 200 cells and the back box from Klein and I’m still waiting on the back box so we went again and installed the cats first.
     
  8. Il Co-Pilota

    Il Co-Pilota F1 Veteran

    May 29, 2019
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    But what's wrong with the Capristo box? What are your goals by changing? As far as quality goes, it does not get much better than Capristo, that's for sure.

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  9. j34

    j34 Karting
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    Good question. Our mechanic fabricates exhausts and other components and compared the quality of Kline and Capristo and felt Kline’s welding and general construction was better by a fair margin. He also recommended to go with Inconel all the way through rather than mixing and matching like I have now. My current problem is somewhat of an imperfect sound in the 4500-6500 rev range and I’m having trouble putting my finger on the issue. It sounds like almost a slight rattle/tin sound but I’ve read nothing online that gives me any clue. It’s not a terrible sound it’s just not as perfect I was hoping for. Any ideas are greatly appreciated
     
  10. Il Co-Pilota

    Il Co-Pilota F1 Veteran

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    He felt the welds were better by a fair margin? I'm not sure what to say. I'm not a professional welder, but I can lay down a respectable row of dimes and run a clean bead. Capristo has some of the best exhaust welding I've seen to date.
    I have to ask you this. Will that guy benefit financially by doing the swap? Also, exactly what does he think you will gain by using inconel?

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  11. j34

    j34 Karting
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    I will ask him if he can provide some more details as to what he felt the differences were. I had already ordered the back box months ago so he has pretty limited financial incentive here. Inconel bit is that I already am using Inconel with the 200 cell cats and his/Kline recommendation is to use same type of materials to get a more consistent sound.
     
  12. Lagunae92

    Lagunae92 Formula 3
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    So what is the consensus on just replacing the back box? Is it making any difference in sound? Raising the decibels in the cabin? Would a Novitec sound much different without cat delete and x pipe? I like a higher F1 pitch but don’t want to attract the wrong kind of attention.
     
  13. ScuderiaCarParts

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    Stage 1 Novitec (i.e just rear silencers) gives a fairly decent result - but honestly you need to pair it with an X pipe (Stage 2) to start getting the F1 sound. The volume increase is maybe 10-15% louder than standard so it's not of great concern.

    I've had a few customers who have been worried about volume increases with Stage 2 and not one of them has complained
     
  14. j34

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    I started with capristo back box and pulling vacuum lines. That added a bit of volume compared to stock. Then I added X pipe and it reduced the sound (to me, ruined it). Then I removed the X pipe and added 200 cell cats, which made a huge difference and really opened up the sound.
     
  15. j34

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    Has anyone done a full setup from Novitec or Kline but used their H pipe instead of X pipe? Seems like it’s a no from poking around here and makes me wonder if the X pipe really is necessary to reduce resonance.
     
  16. Cnoordz

    Cnoordz Karting

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    As one of the 'gpf victims' I'm checking my options to get out a bit more sound, solely as a way to be prepared as I don't have the car as of yet.

    The way I understand, novitec backboxes and xpipe hardly makes a difference, unless it is combined with 100/200 cell cats.
    Has anyone ever done ONLY 100/200 cell cats or is that a bad idea with stock mufflers etc?
     
  17. Il Co-Pilota

    Il Co-Pilota F1 Veteran

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    Personally I think Capristo boxes alone has a greater impact than Novi boxes alone
    Several here has done full Novi systems, and trust me when I say they are properly anti-social.
    It is true that from the inside only doing boxes and mid pipe doesn't change much. But outside it actually does, and that is worth considering. Never heard an H pipe fitted to an 812 or F12. Sounds like an interestin idea. Should make for a sound that is a bit more high pitched than OE, but not quite as thin as the X pipe sound. Sounds like a really good idea actually, and the H pipe should also retain a bit more low end torque and response. The X is great for making top end power, but you do move the peak numbers up a bit.

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  18. KarlA69

    KarlA69 Formula Junior

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    Sorry to hear about your GPF. Please let us know your impressions of the stock car (with GPF) when you collect it.

    I've never heard of anyone doing just 100/200 cell cats. I'm sure it's technically possible, but I would have thought not advisable. The main the thing the sports cats do is increase volume (by reducing the obstruction in the exhaust flow). With the stock mufflers, you'd be amplifying a sub-optimal sound. I think there is a reason why hardly anyone does this....

    To your question of novitec back boxes and x pipe only... I had that exact set up but then drove for 30 mins and went straight back to the shop and asked them to also fit the 100 cell cats! Due to the good level of sound proofing in an 812 (it is a GT after all...) I found it wasn't loud enough from inside the cabin. However, having driven the car now for about six months with the sports cats fitted, I would say that it is very loud from the outside (especially cold starts - brutal). Whether or not that bothers you is a personal preference, but you will get people turning around 100 - 150m in the street AHEAD of you, wonder what the **** is coming down the road....
     
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  19. j34

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    I’ve inadvertently done 200 cell cats with capristo back box, without an X pipe or H pipe (I was waiting on the parts and eager to see what change the cats made). It’s produces a truly terrible resonance to the point I don’t even want to drive the car. Partly this could be due to the fact that I have Inconel cats and stainless steel H pipe and back box. Due to these engines being so high compression and powerful I’ve been told that you really need all the same material and can’t mix and match, so, it may be possible to do just the cats as long as you stick with stainless steel. I’ve bought Inconel back box, H pipe and X pipe and will be trying out H pipe and X pipe to see which I prefer. Manufacturer is saying that both will reduce the terrible resonance I’m having and it’ll be a personal preference which one to stick with. If this is true I’ll very likely be choosing the H pipe. I’m supposed to be receiving parts end of this week or sometime next week and will post an update here. Hope this helps, as I’ve almost tried every combination possible at this point.
     
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  20. Cnoordz

    Cnoordz Karting

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    Thanks for the replies guys


    I remember reading your story somewhere, including the video. It did sound absolutely brutal with the cats, probably too much for me. Was it also ridiculously loud on the outside with valves closed? Did you ever have problems after fitting the 100 cell cats, any CEL? I drive fairly fast and a lot of high speed as well, not looking forward to any problems that may arise.
    I've been sent a picture of the 2020 812 exhausts and it looks like the GPF is AFTER the cats so we could be solving 2 problems in one fix.

    OK so I'm gonna go with the fact that only doing cats is stupid. Never read about it either so guessing that must indeed be for a reason.
    Curious to read your update, good to see you are doing a comparison!
     
  21. Cnoordz

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    @KarlA69 Did you have the capristo OBD wizard installed as well to avoid the CEL ?
     
  22. gliazzurri

    gliazzurri Formula Junior

    Jun 11, 2016
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    Would love to know some people's impressions of these options. Did anyone consider getting the Novitec back boxes without the flap regulation? Every dealer of the exhausts I have talked to in the past always says that people tend to get the flap regulation ones but as some others have noted (whether by plugging valves or always opening the valves when turning the car on) what it the typical situation people are doing when driving your cars with this on it? I know people will mention noise around neighbors but frankly at idle with flaps closed isn't the setup decently loud as is? How does that compare to the stock? If one doesn't have concerns about driving in and out of the area without irritating people, when do you ever tend to leave the valves closed for any stretch of time? I know by me any time I start up the cars it doesn’t matter but people will hear. Having a regulated valve isn't going to hide that so I’m curious about the logic people use when selecting these. Has anyone just got the non-flap exhaust boxes? Love to hear from all owners of any make, not just Novitec. Thanks in advance.
     
  23. Cnoordz

    Cnoordz Karting

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    The problem is cold-start. You definitely don't want the flaps to be open on cold-start if you have sportscats + ....
    Even without sportscats with flaps open it is quite loud.
     
  24. gliazzurri

    gliazzurri Formula Junior

    Jun 11, 2016
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    Thanks for getting back. How "bad" is it (perhaps is actually a good thing though to some)? Is it really obnoxious or unpleasant? Realistically what is the difference between that and having the valves open and flooring it down the street? I suspect the latter is even more of a visible/audible situation. Thanks for the info--just curious what is the real impediment of having it open all the time. Is it really worth it to get the flap regulation effectively then for just the start as you might suggest? I guess that's what my curiosity is.
     
  25. j34

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    I have valves closed at cold start and it’s loud as hell. I can’t really imagine much difference if they were open. I think valve controller is a good idea for when you’re out driving it and you want things to quiet down on the highway or when you’re trying to be quiet in the neighborhood. Cold start doesn’t matter to me because no matter what it’s super loud. I put in ODB plug and it stopped engine light for now (have 200 cell cats). Will also be doing O2 spacers for good measures
     

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