I don't think many will disagree with you regards to the change over cost. BUT The point you made is there is basically no difference to a 488 GTB. That is ridiculous. So don't be a politician and diverge the reason why there a several that have responded to your comment. On the books there is a difference full stop. Is it worth the change over yes/no and people can respond to that
Why are you asking him his opinion on cars he has never owned, hardly driven if at all, and has no intention to buy??
I know , but boy he can be annoying . He is like a seagull, flies in, has a crap and flies out again.
We have been through the same conversation with Noone1 endless times in the past. He has confessed that he does not drive exotics, he does not own any nor does he like driving. Thankfully he vanished last year but unfortunately he has resurfaced with no shortage of opinions.
Have driven both 458 coupe and 488 coupe on normal roads. Have not owned them. Have never driven an F8 or Pista, probably never will. If you're looking for a deep dive on my impression, you're going to be disappointed because I feel like the performance and automation has made most modern exotics very similar in day to day usage. I'd note that the difference between a 458 and 488 performance is very noticeable on normal roads and the 488 was less interactive due to the rate at which it accelerates. Less interaction with the throttle. Suspension, comfort, handling... who knows because they were driven over different roads. For all I know one road was just bumpier and worse condition. Tires also have improved immensely over the years and I really don't know which were on it or what condition they were in. It's a personal taste of mine that if I can't tell I'm driving a completely new car when I'm just cruising, then it's not worth the change. If you don't care about a tiny change in real world performance and want something new, then just switch brands. For me the point of buying a new car is because I'd want a new experience. I'll never buy a facelifted model. While I don't think the 458 to 488 design change is nearly as much as I'd want in a change, I'd say the speed was, but it was also now on the fringe of unnecessary and less fun. The problem with the 488, P11, 720S, probably the F8, and everything soon to come is that you can't actually be on the throttle long enough. It's been a very long time since you could actually feel like you had your foot down hard for any meaningful amount of time. If I had a 458 and wanted an upgrade in performance, I'd say just invest on having good condition Cup2 R tires on it more often than not. If I had a 488 and wanted to upgrade performance, I'd just keep Cup2 R tires on it more often. It's a shame 911s look so ******** boring and similar. A 500 hp manual in a modern 918-like design would be a dream come true.
I don't recall saying there is no difference. At least I don't think I did. I said it was a facelift and parts-bin 488/Pista. I said the differences were very modest given its position as a replacement model. 355 -> 360 -> 430 -> 458 -> 488 -> F8 Yeah, I just don't see the F8 as a meaningful upgrade compared to the norm.
After reading Noone1's latest confession I'm going to bed. I'm beginning to wonder when was the last time he even drove any sort of car. I suspect he needs a new pair of shoes and a bus pass recharge.
Professional/ press reviews have been out for ages, do you mean owner reviews Sent from my CLT-L09 using FerrariChat.com mobile app
For those who were enamoured with the 488, the F8 represents a salient improvement on every objective metric and more importantly on the driving engagement and emotional enhancement engendered. Those, like I, who felt the 488 lacked the requisite excitement and driver - car connection, will be pleased with their restoration in the F8. Cannot compare to the Pista, but the F8 is exceptionally satisfying on all parameters of performance. Those who prioritize engine sound will be somewhat disappointed, but if the 488 was deemed satisfactory, so will the F8. The F8 is a special car.
As I mentioned before, the concerns and opinion about the Lexan are simply just mine. However, by talking with several dealers, sales people, and other Ferrari fans, the concern is not just mine. Only future will tell how this Lexan will perform and what issues it might bring with it. Besides the look I don't like, the bluish discoloration distortion from the heat, it definitely also distorts the view out of the cabin. I have already found a solution and will be replacing my Lexan with the Pista like engine cover immediately. I think the car will look better overall and it will fix my two big dislikes, the distortion of the view of the beautiful engine and the view out of the cabin. It will also fix the discoloration issues that are simply ugly. I originally posted this for one simple reason. I wanted to see what other people experienced and if there would be any constructive suggestions. I didn't post it to argue with someone about their opinions. I appreciate all the feedback and information.
none. He owns none. He has never owned a Ferrari. He has no intention of ever owning a Ferrari. Yet he pontificates about the nuances of the cars as if he has a collection of them. it’s the same crap he has been spewing for years. There hasn’t been a single car where he like it. Every car is overpriced, it’s not engaging or fun yet he types post after post as if he is an expert. He will also tell you that it’s a waste of time to click through the paddles and just drive the cars in auto mode. just an utter waste of bandwidth for this guy to be posing himself as an expert or anything elated to ferrari or any other car.
That's what I figured. I'm trying to reconcile in my mind, why someone would make nearly 4,500 posts over 12 years, on a car forum...about a brand they've never owned?! This is not normal human behavior. It occurs to me as he speaks about value, that he must not value time very much. He asks why anyone would roll out of a 488 and into an F8...and to me the bigger question is why does he care? If asked why I chose to order an F8, the answer is simply because I can and I wanted to. I can only surmise that he remains so intrigued and covetous of the Ferrari buyer/owner that engaging them in superfluous banter, brings some sort of joy. Being new here, I now realize that he should be ignored.
I don't think somebody that bought a 488 new (or in case above 2) and then an F8 new is too concerned about residuals; BUT say they are.... Mike, As I said, Ferrari has a long history of releasing a 'triad' of models. Think: 365/400/412i 365BB/512/512i 308/308QV/328 (I'll leave out the 308gtsi ) Mondial QV/3.2/t TR/512TR/512M I won't even go into the Enzo era as it can get quite esoteric. One thing to notice though, is with some small exceptions of limited sub-releases, (i.e., say Fiberglass 308 or special) - the 'latest/final' release has the highest value. Representing the 'pinnacle' of a model line's production in terms of refinement and performance. Now combine this with the paradigm shift of the F8 successor having a hybrid V-6 - which some people will eschew, akin to some folks prefer the 'earlier' models being carborated. The F8, however, represents no paradigm change and offers a double bookend on the same side. My argument actually is it's smart to upgrade to an F8 if one prefers this line's V8 Turbo framework. Why are values lower for a 308GTsi over a 308QV? A 400 over a 412? A Mondial QV vs. the 't' or 512TR vs. a 512M? The 458/Especiale representing folks that prefer NA, the F8/Pista serving probably the last ICE only proposition for the mid-engine line, hence the title "Tributo." So even coming from an academic point of view only, your 'value' nor 'performance' proposition still doesn't stand, with 70 years of history as my proof.
Hi Glenn, I've had the same thoughts. I won't lie though, I do have an insecure immature side that sadly looks forward to Mike's posts. He's had a long history here, and he's done probably the best job of skating right to the line of a troll. He's probably used to being the 'car' authority in under haunts. That said, I really do enjoy even from admittedly sad, but pure guilty pleasure of seeing somebody with so much self-assuredness be challenged.
Ive lost many brain cells in the past trying to figure out the same thing. Every single car thread on every single model where he posts its essentially the same copy and paste - 1- the cars are not engaging 2- the cars are over priced 3- the cars are boring to drive 4- the cars are .....fill in the blank with something negative. But read his posts- lots of stuff that he has gotten from car and driver and road and track. But actual ownership experience? None. zero. zilch. nada. Not gonna happen.
Yeah, I know. It's cool, all fun banter, makes the forum fun. A lot of Mike's comments are actually well thought out and reasonable, then he pulls one of these which he knows is simply to stir the pot. Thanks @noone1 - it's nice to have the metal engine foundry stirred once in a while.
The only car I have ever owned that hasn't lost money (so far) is my Dodge Challenger Demon. It is worth more today 2 years after I bought it then what I paid brand new. This will probably change, bu who knows. Buy what you like and don't worry about the rest.