I have friends with Mahle. They'd love to see that.
Agree with Mike. That's not acceptable, especially if the pitting is near the top it will allow jets of hot gas past the rings and burn the holes bigger over time (like a burnt valve.)
I've condemned a Hemi block that had less pitting than that. Granted, I don't deal in bespoke high performance... But that liner doesn't look like it should meet anyone's level of acceptance.
I agree 100%. The reply was that the new set may have the same pits as well as during the casting process it is impossible to know what lies beneath the surface, followed by repetition of their guarantee of the liner and Nikasil. My point is taken that THIS is the garbage we're collectively stuck with, and no major or small companies do anything about it.
Seems odd. I mean the liners would be machined from some stock material and any surface imperfections should be found by inspection before the Nikasil plating was applied. They should never make it through QC.
I agree - you can see the hone pattern on the liner bore and I would have thought that after the honing process, some PERSON would examine each item and would have tossed the pitted ones to be melted/re-cast. But maybe nowadays the entire process is automated whereby nobody actually looks at the liner before it's shipped. It might be processed/machined/boxed up robotically whereby only a random sample (if that) is actually checked. As noted, those pits create a point where the combustion gases can eat away/enlarge those pits to...who knows what end? Honestly, I cannot imagine any company claiming that pitting is 'acceptable.' They shouldn't have left the factory that way and my initial reaction is I would not buy Mahle products. However, if they accept a return/replace them with correctly-made liners, I'd be willing to say...well, things happen occasionally and let it go at that. If they continue to say, "they're fine," that's a whole different deal; they are NOT!
Mike, I'm doubtful that Ferrari (or the official Ferrari supplier) could have done such a bad aluminum casting. They had a very nice foundry in the seventies, I saw it in person during those years. In my opinion that's not an original one that has been rebuilt: I think it's a low cost actual spare part with low quality. Ciao
It probably wouldn't leak with a gasket and maybe some sealer. But as others have noted, the fact that it was shipped out that way puts the rest of the construction/quality into question...at least for me. Personally, I'm a fan of rebuilding the original rather than replacing it but hey, we all do what we are personally comfortable with.
Contracted out. Ferrari doesn't make them. Based on how they are built and the look of the castings I am reasonably sure they are not done in Italy anymore. Also they are old enough Ferrari has nothing to do with them. Vintage parts supply and manufacturing used to handled by Maranello Concessionaires but not sure if it even them anymore. It looks to me to be either Indian or a fledgling Eastern European Democracy. Should let the Chechs make them. They are doing some really good auto parts.
I have been buying cores to rebuild rather than buy new pumps. They have been garbage since the last new contractor has been in the picture. Prior to the current contractor the pumps were quite good and I am sure Italian made. But like everything else they found a cheaper source. The pump bodies and impellers are very 3rd World.
Yes, Brian: Ferrari sold the spare part service for old cars to anyone many years ago so "Ferrari official spare parts" for old models are (almost all) out of Ferrari control as they gave them the right to use Ferrari badges and name. That horrible water pump cast body is a shame and son of all what happened: once they were much better quality, of course, as Enzo Ferrari didn't produce low price chinese lawn mover! Ciao
That company was Maranello Concessionaires for many years. They handled contracting out manufacture of the parts. That has changed dramatically in the years since it was bought by Roger Penske and strict bean counters have been put in control.
Some people at Mahle are constantly bragging to me how great their **** is. I sent them this picture. I tell you their response. Its engineers, not customer service pukes.
I put mine on in Sept 97. It is the "upgraded" option Ted offered then. Was this during the better built days or have I just been lucky? I am assuming you would advise to rebuild mine when the day comes vs buy new, because if you do, I'm rebuilding.
Big difference between the liner wear surface and the water pump gasket surface. The liner is poor QV, the water pump is a nothing burger.
Talking about the cast quality of the waterpump housings. The 'new' waterpumps are simple sand cast. To avoid shrinkholes there's a lot of effort necessary and sometimes still a matter of luck. Especially with aluminium alloys. We regularly have problems with big heavy machinery sand cast parts with integrated hydraulic lines when the cast is not liquid-tight. Sometimes the parts get impregnated with a special procedure developed and performed by Loctite, or to be on the safe side, we insert steel tubing. The old waterpumps were die cast. This method is much safer regarding shrinkholes, but require an expensive die. I'm curious where the old moulds remained, if at all. Best from Germany Martin
I am sure they are the property of the old supplier. The quality of the non machined surfaces of the modern parts are not of a standard I have ever seen from an Italian sand cast part. The entire piece looks very 3rd world to me.
It they still exist and not scrapped by modern company management, what regularly tends to such acts. Many years ago Alfa Romeo Germany sent out their outdoor staff to visit their official dealers and to look, what amount of NOS parts for our 105/115/116 cars still exist and forced them the to scrap most of the inventory. So we lost many valuable sources for NOS quality parts. They even scrapped complete engines, gearboxes, rear axles, etc. I believe, their intention was, that if we classic car owners get no more parts, we would purchase their modern junk. My main Alfa parts supplier got wind of the plans early enough and released most of the old parts early enough to a facilty some miles distant, which they weren't aware of He still can often help with the rarest parts. But not cheap of course. Best from Germany Martin
Ferrari rounded up all the old parts and service books they had and hired a document shredding company to destroy them.
The first Ferrari dealer I worked at was Alfa Ferrari. Spent years working on 750's 101's and 105's. Last school I attended was GTV6 intro school. Most of the mechanics there were Alfa guys. One of the very few convertibles I like are 105 Spiders.
I like them too, though I am more into cars with a roof. But regarding the 105 spiders I like the fastback versions the most. I never got used to the rear design of the early ones and never liked the series 3 "rubber boats". When it comes to contemporary market competitors I like the Fiat 124 Spider a tad more. Very late cars were called 'Pinifarina Spidereuropa Volumex'. An interesting car. Were these officially imported into the US? Anyway; I still love my 2000 GTV from 1972. Allow myself to post a media hi-res image in this thread. It's my current favourite pic. I believe it has something of US southern swamps in front of my housedoor Best from Germany Martin
