Zandvoort corner banking to be twice as steep as Indianapolis | Page 5 | FerrariChat

Zandvoort corner banking to be twice as steep as Indianapolis

Discussion in 'F1' started by mcimino, Nov 24, 2019.

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  1. Mitch Alsup

    Mitch Alsup F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    9,252
    An F1 car with the transmission setup to do 240-250 MPH at Charlotte would destroy a NASCAR without restrictor plate.
    An F1 ar with the "use at every race" transmission would get walked on the straights by NASCAR without restrictor plates, but NASCAR would still get eaten alive in the turns by a car with real downforce. Advantage F1.

    On the other hand, take NASCAR to MONZA and no mater what you did to it, it would still get walked by F1 car (even Williams.)
    Take NASCAR to Monaco and its deader than a door nail. Advantage F1.

    But under almost any set of rules one devises, a 1600 pound 1000 HP vehicle with a $300M budget is simply going to be faster than a 3600 pound vehicles with a 4-speed manual transmission even if it does have equivalent HP.
     
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  2. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 World Champ
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  3. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
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    F1 Circuit Zandvoort renovation January 24th 2020

     
  4. #104 lorenzobandini, Jan 26, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2020
    Ladies/Gentlemen using the term "NASCAR"; it is not a racing car.

    NASCAR are the initials of the organization National Association of Stock Car Auto Racing; and as such can't race an F1 car. A NASCAR stock car (Cup car for short) could.
    That would be the same as an unrestricted stock car racing an F1. A stock car also can not race a series (in this case F1). It could, however, race an F1 car. ;)
     
  5. amerikalei

    amerikalei Karting

    May 23, 2011
    196
    Has anyone seen a comparison overlay of the old and new Zandvoort layouts? Just trying to orient myself.
     
  6. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
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    Layout is the same just reprofiled corners really.
     
  7. amerikalei

    amerikalei Karting

    May 23, 2011
    196
    I was under the impression that the old circuit had been shortened due to part of the land being sold and developed? I'm thinking about the original layout v the current.
     
  8. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Yes, the circuit was heavily modified in the late 90s.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circuit_Zandvoort
     
  9. amerikalei

    amerikalei Karting

    May 23, 2011
    196
    Thanks. Reminds me of what they did to Laguna Seca in the late 80's or early 90's when they added the fiddly inner loop to increase the lap distance but lost the challenging high speed 1-2-3 section leading into turn 4 (the one under the bridge that leads to the hill climb up to the corkscrew, not sure what number it is on the current layout). Not too many long fast flowing circuits left anymore. Hopefully it will be racy.
     
  10. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Thanks for all these photos, Joe Gonzales. Really appreciated !!
     
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  11. amerikalei

    amerikalei Karting

    May 23, 2011
    196
    Looks like ideal conditions for an exciting Dutch GP...
     
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  12. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    I foresee a new Scalextrix Zandvoort set with that banked turn
     
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  13. Igor Ound

    Igor Ound F1 Veteran

    Sep 30, 2012
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    For how narrow the real track is, might end up being the more exciting race
     
  14. mcimino

    mcimino Formula 3

    Oct 5, 2007
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    Looks like Pirelli had concerns...

    “This prototype has been designed with a slightly different construction as we are still analysing data coming from Zandvoort,” said Pirelli’s Head of F1 and Car Racing, Mario Isola.

    “We made some analysis on the banking and the plan is to use these tyres with a slightly higher pressure. In preparation for that, and as we are not fully aware of everything – we don’t have final data on the circuit, on Tarmac roughness and so on – the idea is also to test a slightly different construction here [in Barcelona].

    https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.pirelli-explain-zandvoort-special-tyre-tests-in-barcelona.7l3hXIScig3wVqIxVuydDG.html
     
  15. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
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  16. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Come on Pirelli !!! It's only a few hundred yards of banking each lap, and your tyres wouldn't be able to stand that ?
     
  17. #120 lorenzobandini, Mar 1, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2020
    Ohn Mssr. william.....I see you're not only the perfect runoff designer for said banking, but also a tire engineer, eh? Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Have you any clue what the different forces exist on that 18 degree banking as opposed to the rest of the seasons circuits? Do you not remember that dismal Indy weekend (also only a 1/4 mile.....and....only 9 degrees)? For maximum performance (did you know these are not street tires) the whole season, there really needs to be one tire designed to withstand the bank's stresses for that one race as the sidewalls have a different job to do.....
    Pirelli's doing exactly what it needs to do to provide a safe tire so there isn't a replay of Indy. ;)
     
  18. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #121 william, Mar 1, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2020

    Hahaha

    Yes, I do have some clues about tyres. Pirelli has been given enough notice about Zandvoort
    I don't think making tyres for a banking is a black art, and any tyre manufacturer should be able to do that without any sweat, given some data.
    Maybe Pirelli needs a special batch for Zandvoort. If they can't, they are in the wrong business.o_O

    Coming back to my previous post about runoff areas for the banking, which provoked some hilarity and for which I received a lot of flack, look at the photos posted by our friend jgonzales6 on post #111.
    Are my eyes deceiving me, because I can't see any wall adjacent to the banking on some of the photos, but a green coloured (sand or tarmac?) zone?
    I don't know if a wall will be built later alongside the track, or outside what could be like the runoff zone I proposed, but my idea don't seem stupid at all.
    One point is that the public won't be allowed near that banking at Zandvoort (unlike US ovals) and therefore a runoff zone can be "offered" to those unfortunate enough to leave the track, without endangering spectators.
    But watch this space, as they say ... :)

    The good thing about you lorenzobandini is that you always keep me entertained, but in a nice way. I like that. ;)
     
  19. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Here ya go.....


    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  20. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Thanks for that !

    That settles the matter then, but what happened to the portions of the track I saw on your photos, with the green zone outside?
    Did they receive wall and fencing too?
     
  21. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Yw

    I have'nt seen pics of the rest of the track where's there's banking so I really don't know.

    If more pics come up I will surely post.
     
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  22. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Jun 3, 2006
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    OK, many thanks !!!

    Cheers !
     
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