Anyone track their Pista yet?

In most cases....yeah. Thanks for the driving lesson. Ferrari might give you a job with that kind of talk lol. Or you could take it up with the Germans who I'm sure will completely disagree with you. I think I'll stick with the ones on the steering wheel.

 

It seems that I am taking it up with someone who works for the Germans.

 

Sorry what Ferrari rules cover the use of a privately owned car on a track?

 

I do not think they could have any legal ground to enforce anything - it's just an agreement with the threat of not maintaining a good relationship (which is useful to get access to early cars and opens some doors at the company, so many people will not challenge it).

 

No, just someone who knows what he prefers.
PS. I guess Ferrari puts the shift on the wheel in their F1 cars because it is inferior. Or, do they do that just to handicap the driver? I mean putting the shift on the steering wheel couldn't possibly have anything to do with using the best solution in the worlds most advanced form of performance car.

 

Oh, I was certain that someone would bring F1 up. Firstly, these cars don't even have a steering column. Most importantly though, F1 cars have less than one turn from lock to lock, thus drivers never take their hands off them. In this scenario, moving paddles make perfect sense. In a road car though, where the wheel has multiple turns, there are circumstances where the driver cannot change a gear if the paddles are not in a fixed position. Of course you may prefer one over the other, but these are the facts.

 

This is a long standing rule with Ferrari even going back to when the Ferrari F50 was introduced. Ferrari even forced the USA buyers to lease their F50 initially. You could not 'buy' a new F50 from FNA.

 

I’m not a lawyer ....
A bunch of photographers received legal notices from Porsche and Lamborghini to cease and desist the selling of calendars with pics of those cars . Many of those things were being sold for charities . The owners of those cars had given permission to the photo shoots and the selling of those pics.

The auto companies fiercely protect
their rights when someone is trying to profit off their cars (ie sellimg products , services and in the case of track videos the money made from social media )

 

You could say the results were skewed when each vehicle was designed with it's specific build spec. The tires merely accentuate those inherent differences. Tires have become a very complicated science with each car manufacturer getting a tire built to their particular needs. Mercedes Benz actually stole the Corvette's Michelin tire design for their own use; the tire was that good. Ferrari has stated tire design evolves every 12 months. One of the big improvements in the 599 HGTE option came from the tires specially developed for that model.
There is more involved than just slapping on the stickiest tire you can fit in the wheel well.

 

All that is true, but the standard tyre of the 2 RS is the Cup 2, just like the Pista's (different specs obviously). The Cup 2 R is an option and Ferrari has also sent to tests Pistas with Cup 2 Rs on. It is like comparing lap times in F1 between a car wearing the Yellow Medium compound and the Red Soft compound. Meanwhile, McLaren fits the equally, if not more, sticky Trofeo R.

 

Trofeo R is no where near a Cup R. Cup R is today by far the most extrem semi slick around. Lets wait for the all new trofeo R if he can strike back

 

Last time I've checked Michelin Cup R has only 2 sizes available and they don't fit to Ferraris. I hope they come out with more sizes soon.

 

True, for now only Porsche...actually they were made for the GT2/3 RS.

 

They still all have options but don't exercise those options. Bemoaning one brand for winning just because your brand of choice didn't take the game seriously enough is bad sportsmanship. Every Brand likes to lay claim having something more special than the next in their fight for the lead. Mac with its carbon tub, Dihedral doors and 720 +hp mid mount engine. Ferrari with its famous italian styling, amazing lag free engine with better sound, and mid mount drive. I think its funny to see the winging going on here over Porsche using a tyre compound that they all could have had on their cars if they had thought more carefully about how to guarantee themselves of coming out on top. God forbid if the GT2rs went mid mount with a carbon tub, lost 50Kg and added another 30hp. The crying would be unbearable.

 

Are you comparing tyres or cars? Tyres, unlike the other things you've mentioned are very interchangeable - choose the one for what you need. Winter, sport, semi-slick - they all have different characteristics for different conditions. A cup2 R is almost a slick tyre that's very quick in the dry but almost undriveable in the wet - so much so a golf R would probably be quicker in the wet than a GT2 RS with cup2 R's. Is the golf the faster car? no

A cup2R tyre is the type of tyre that you fit just for the track and you use something else for daily driving.

 

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^ that makes the GT2 RS looking like a bargain reliable track toy

 

That's BS... There is no way that the GT2RS could be more than 3 sec faster than Pista.

 

GT2 RS was on Cup 2 R tires, where as the Pista wasn't.

 

If the times were all on the same day then why would they be wrong?

I think Pista is a very fast car but as a soon to be owner i accept it is not the track weapon the 2rs is. Too many here are underestimating the capability of the 2rs and are overly focusing on undermining it instead of appreciating Pista’s own individual qualities.

We should all look at the bright side - the time differential could be a lot worse if the 2rs had the same power, weight and engine placement of Pista.

 

There can't be a 3 sec difference between Cup2 and Cup2R tires. Only and maybe if the Gt2RS had proper slick racing tires.

But we don't know if they drove all the cars on the same day, do we? Even if they did, it had to be within the same hour or so. If you hot-lap a car in cold temps say in the morning and another one lap in the afternoon heat, there will be such differences. Plus we also don't know if the cars were lapped by the same driver. We also don't know if the cars are at pure factory settings (tire geometry, pressure, suspension, fuel level, etc etc.)

So, if every thing is done at equal and fair conditions, I say again, there can't be such a difference.

 

BTW, I will go up against a Gt2Rs with my Pista at the end of April at our track days. I know that its driver is also experienced so there won't be much of a driver factor. I'm %100 sure that if he will be faster than me it will be for sure less than a sec

 

Agree there will always be certain degrees of variances even on the same day but by now it's clear the Pista is struggling as a track focused car in the company of 2rs....as are a lot of other very fast cars. As fast as it is, naming the car Pista was perhaps not Ferrari's best move.

Regardless of the winner, both are without doubt incredibly exciting "drivers" cars in their own individual ways. This is the main thing!

 

even if I don’t focus just on numbers when I buy a car......this test will be very very interesting
Murat, let me know the exact date and I will try to join you with my poor GT3.....for sure my time will be over 15 sec at least

very excited......can’t wait!!

 

True... but also Pista can be made very fast on track by some very simple mods as other competitors do and be very competitive. Proper track oriented tire geometry alone can easily bring 1-2sec shorter lap times. But IMO, all these test reviews and comparisons are very useless and it really makes me sad to see that sooo many people base their buying decisions on these mostly flawed tests. %99 of buyers of these cars will lap so much quicker if they invest in learning how to drive these cars on track instead of making claims on their keyboards. But sadly, bragging rights are their first concern