Once again, paging Mr. Magnusson | FerrariChat

Once again, paging Mr. Magnusson

Discussion in 'Boxers/TR/M' started by qwazipsycho, Nov 5, 2018.

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  1. qwazipsycho

    qwazipsycho Formula 3

    Oct 30, 2004
    1,176
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Scott
    Hi Steve! You're my go to guy when it comes to all things 'lectric on my TR. Anyone else who wishes to chime in feel free. I've just been on this site long enough to know who to talk to about what.

    To refresh your memory, my TR with about 39k miles on it that spent 9 years in the tropics is now located in the high desert of Utah. It ran fine when I pulled it off the trailer in May. The last time I started it was around the end of June. It has been sitting in my garage since then. The temps have dropped and I have been trying to get it started again for about a week. What I've found is, I have fuel pressure and the distributors are turning but if I have any spark it's only on maybe 1 cylinder. It seems to hit on that cylinder only. Other than that it just spins the motor. So, it seems obvious I'm not getting spark.

    I assume you already have a flow chart for this kind of problem. Lay it on me bro!
     
  2. rpissm

    rpissm Formula 3

    Aug 11, 2013
    1,620
    Salt Lake City, UT
    Full Name:
    Joe
    Utah??? Whereabouts? I'm South of SLC!

    Sent from my Moto Z2 Play using Tapatalk
     
  3. qwazipsycho

    qwazipsycho Formula 3

    Oct 30, 2004
    1,176
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Scott
    Hooper. West of Ogden.
     
  4. Schulz308

    Schulz308 Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    May 21, 2014
    1,450
    STL USA
    Steve is going to have ta start getting free membership + perks for great service to Fchat some day. ;)
     
  5. qwazipsycho

    qwazipsycho Formula 3

    Oct 30, 2004
    1,176
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Scott
    I paid a 1 year membership for another member who helped me a long time ago. I'd pay Steve too but he's probably too humble.
     
    Shamile likes this.
  6. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    25,035
    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
    Full Name:
    Steve Magnusson
    #6 Steve Magnusson, Nov 6, 2018
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2018
    Hey! I have a PayPal account you can use! ;)

    If you have no spark on both banks during starter motor cranking, begin with the flywheel sensors (if either one has a problem, neither bank will fire):

    1. Unplug/reseat/check the small round 4-pin connector under the coolant expansion tank (this connects the flywheel sensors to the MicroPlex ignition ECU and is perhaps the worst engine bay connector ever selected/designed). You can also unplug/reseat the 2-pin connector for each flywheel sensor (one is black and the other white) on the LH side of the clutch housing.

    2. If no change, then go on to the (unplugged) resistance and (plugged in while cranking) AC voltage (or oscilloscope) measurements of the flywheel sensors as described in these threads:

    http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=190856

    http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=260371

    If those are OK, but you still have no spark on both banks during starter motor cranking, well, we don't want to go there ;). Good Hunting!
     
  7. Veedub00

    Veedub00 F1 Rookie
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Jun 30, 2006
    4,886
    Troy, Michigan
    Full Name:
    James
    put a timing light on each spark plug wire one at a time. if it lights up when you crank, youre getting spark. put the same light on the wire from the coils to the spark plug distributor. if that lights up you are getting power from the coils.
     
  8. qwazipsycho

    qwazipsycho Formula 3

    Oct 30, 2004
    1,176
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Scott

    You are the best Steve! I'll let you know what I find.
     
  9. vincenzo

    vincenzo F1 Rookie

    Nov 2, 2003
    3,373
    As a joke, Steve said;
    “Hey! I have a PayPal account you can use!”

    I suggest we all take him up on that offer and drop just $10 or $20 bucks into his account as a VERY small token of our appreciation. Just enough to send him and a guest out for a nice appreciation dinner. He has been a huge help and great tutor for all of us.

    If somebody out there could cobble up some simple instructions of ‘how’, count me in. I’m no Paypal guru.

    Join me guys, we all really appreciate his time, effort and knowledge.

    Maybe a bottle of wine as well.

    Cheers,
    Vincenzo
     
    qwazipsycho, ago car nut and flash32 like this.
  10. xplodee

    xplodee Formula 3

    Jan 3, 2017
    1,101
    Allentown, PA
    Full Name:
    Tim
    I sincerely agree. Post that paypal address!
     
    ago car nut likes this.
  11. vincenzo

    vincenzo F1 Rookie

    Nov 2, 2003
    3,373
    #11 vincenzo, Nov 8, 2018
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2018
    I think it works like this:
    https://m.wikihow.com/Send-Money-via-PayPal

    Likely Steve would not want to publically list his info (email and/or telephone). For those that wish to fund an appreciation dinner, I suggest that you add your name here and then we could ask Steve to PM those specific persons.

    If this paypal process is not as I have surmised from the above info, please chime in.
     
  12. ago car nut

    ago car nut F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 29, 2008
    5,246
    Madison Ohio
    Full Name:
    David A.
    You can add my name!
     
  13. kartboy1234

    kartboy1234 Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2014
    694
    Palos Verdes, CA
    Full Name:
    Michael L
    I'm in, helped me a ton.

    Sent from my ONEPLUS A3000 using Tapatalk
     
  14. qwazipsycho

    qwazipsycho Formula 3

    Oct 30, 2004
    1,176
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Scott
    I have taken both crank sensors out and tested resistance. I can get them both to change about the same amount when passing a screw driver passed the sensor. Very scientific, I know. I noticed that while both sensors are unplugged, the engine will simply crank with no attempts to start. But with at least one sensor plugged in, either one, it will fire about once every 2 revs of the crank. Does that mean anything Steve?

    I have yet to test the AC voltage.
     
  15. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    25,035
    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
    Full Name:
    Steve Magnusson
    No information on that, but it's really the functional AC voltage measurements that are important to confirm/deny. Is the 4-pin connector under the coolant tank OK/plugged in ;) ?
     
  16. qwazipsycho

    qwazipsycho Formula 3

    Oct 30, 2004
    1,176
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Scott
    I eliminated that crappy connector a couple years ago.
     
  17. qwazipsycho

    qwazipsycho Formula 3

    Oct 30, 2004
    1,176
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Scott
    The 2 flywheel sensors weren't that expensive so I just ordered them both. However, it didn't fix my problem. I still get a slight spark every couple revs but that's it. What can I check now Steve? Electrical not not my strong point.
     
  18. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    25,035
    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
    Full Name:
    Steve Magnusson
    #18 Steve Magnusson, Nov 18, 2018
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2018
    Would still prefer a functional AC voltage measurement of the flywheel sensors during starter motor cranking (rather than just "new = must be OK"). If you've dug in enough to replace the 4-pin round C10 connector under the coolant expansion tank, you could also make the AC voltage measurement there.

    One other initial basic diagnostic thing to do is confirm/deny if the ignition system is getting +12V power. In the y white horizontal connector at the bottom of the fuse-relay panel there are three wires that should always be +12V (relative to ground) whenever the key is "on" (Pos II) or the starter motor is cranking (Pos III):

    One large GN (yellow-black) wire at one end of the y connector (this supplies +12V to run the MicroPlex ignition ECU)

    One large G (yellow) wire next to that one (this supplies +12V to the LH coil)

    One large G (yellow) wire about in the middle of the y connector (this supplies +12V to the RH coil)

    Image Unavailable, Please Login

    I'd unplug the y connector to give those terminals a visual inspection for any obvious frazzling, and then, with the y connector plugged in, you should be able to touch the back end of the metal female terminals to make the DC voltage measurement with the key in Pos II and III.
     
    Grease Donkey and turbo-joe like this.
  19. qwazipsycho

    qwazipsycho Formula 3

    Oct 30, 2004
    1,176
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Scott
    You're awesome as always Steve. I'm running again. It was simply a bad connection at my "new" now "old" 4 wire plug under the expansion tank. Visually it was perfect but there was 1 wire corroded. This time I replaced it with a really nice weatherproof connector. Shouldn't happen again for another 20 years.

    Ohhhhh she doesn't like the cold. Today was the first time I've driven her out on the road since I moved back here in May. I can tell she's getting old. Like me she doesn't move well in the cold till she gets warm. But once warm she's all happy again.

    You saved me a bunch of time. I don't have a lot of time right now, hence the jump to buy the crank sensors as an assumed solution. By just asking you a few questions, you refresh my memory enough to figure it out. I wish I didn't have to always turn to you but my brain can't retain all that info without using it. So PM me that paypal acct Steve. I owe you! :D
     
    Shamile likes this.
  20. qwazipsycho

    qwazipsycho Formula 3

    Oct 30, 2004
    1,176
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Scott
    I want people to know that I am sending Steve money because he's helped me so many times. The guy answers every post within 2 days max. Usually it's within hours. And he's always right. People like Steve and Romano are invaluable to this site. They are kind, honest, willing, and smart. I can't say enough about people like this. They deserve a whole lot more than I am able to give. If I consider my other sources for this info, either very time consuming research, or talking to someone I don't know or trust. Not to mention that they really don't want to talk to you and most are complete snobs. It just goes hand in hand with Ferrari. I really don't care for most other exotic owners who are this way. There are some who are more down to earth but knowledge isn't always their strong point. I'd like to clone these two gentlemen and put them in my toolbox! Thanks as always for the generosity of your knowledge and wisdom.
     
  21. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

    Apr 6, 2008
    8,866
    southwest germany and thailand
    Full Name:
    romano schwabel
    I appreciate your compliment scott :) :)
    I try to help mostly as best as I can because I also need help sometimes and be glad that I get here
     
    Grease Donkey likes this.

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