Car Design Advantage ROY | FerrariChat

Car Design Advantage ROY

Discussion in 'F1' started by scowman, Jun 12, 2018.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. scowman

    scowman Formula 3

    Mar 25, 2014
    2,479
    Scottsdale AZ
    Full Name:
    Stu Boogie
    Which team has the design advantage the rest of the year? Seems to me RB has clear advantage at low speeds. On the high speed circuits who is advantaged MB or SF? I think MB with SF not far behind. I think SF has an advantage through low speed sections over MB. RB has no chance but one or two wins ROY.

    So what team does the ROY favor?
     
  2. tifoso2728

    tifoso2728 F1 Veteran
    BANNED

    Apr 30, 2014
    8,215
    IL
    Full Name:
    DRM
    Ferrari
     
    crinoid and jgonzalesm6 like this.
  3. scowman

    scowman Formula 3

    Mar 25, 2014
    2,479
    Scottsdale AZ
    Full Name:
    Stu Boogie
    Spoken like a true tifosi
     
  4. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 31, 2016
    20,528
    Corpus Christi, Tx.
    Full Name:
    Joe R Gonzales
    Yep, it's Ferrari. This years car is an evolution of last yrs....just 5 inch longer. Last yrs SH70--H chassis and aero was up to par with MB...so we had some reliability issues towards the end but it did'nt eat tyres either. This yrs SF71-H is up in hp (not by much) but it is dialed in to compete with the W09...thanks to Mattia and Rory.

    By the way, up to this Montreal GP, GIO put in some 8 hrs SIM time in Maranello to get Vettels car set-up for the race.
     
    375+ likes this.
  5. scowman

    scowman Formula 3

    Mar 25, 2014
    2,479
    Scottsdale AZ
    Full Name:
    Stu Boogie
    Then why MB in Spain?
     
  6. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 31, 2016
    20,528
    Corpus Christi, Tx.
    Full Name:
    Joe R Gonzales
    we were trying a new suspension (rear).....:(
     
  7. Gatorrari

    Gatorrari F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 27, 2004
    15,924
    Georgia
    Full Name:
    Jim Pernikoff
    I believe Mercedes has an engine update coming this time, so we'll see. Right now, the top three cars all seem very close, with the advantage shifting at each race based on the circuit characteristics. It's clear that there is a huge gulf to the rest of the field, with Renault and Force India currently being "the best of the rest".
     
  8. scowman

    scowman Formula 3

    Mar 25, 2014
    2,479
    Scottsdale AZ
    Full Name:
    Stu Boogie
    I disagree with you there. RB has no sporting chance of beating the other two on anything but a slow speed circuit. They could get lucky of course but no chance without it.

    I think MB still has advantage on the fastest courses.
     
  9. crinoid

    crinoid F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 2, 2005
    9,414
    Full Name:
    LaCrinoid
    MB’s team message from Canada seems to be trying to lure the Scuderia into complacency and over confidence. Hopefully the Scuderia press on harder than ever. The MB engine upgrade may be quite formidable.
     
  10. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
    41,300
    ESP
    Full Name:
    Bas
    Next weeks' race is on the Spain Spec tyres (or should I say Mercedes spec?). So that'll be a walk over.
     
  11. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
    41,300
    ESP
    Full Name:
    Bas
    Red Bull has the best chassis and great aero. Just coming short on the engine, especially in the qualifying. Stick a Mercedes engine in there and the rest can pack up and try again next year.
     
  12. crinoid

    crinoid F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 2, 2005
    9,414
    Full Name:
    LaCrinoid
    ¡¡¡Forza Ferrari!!!
     
  13. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 3, 2006
    25,447
    I think you are quite right there !!!
    That's why Toto Wolff refused to supply RB with engines a couple of years back, when Marko approached Lauda on the subject.
    The 2 Austrians almost stroke a deal, and the MB management seemed to agree with it too.
    That was until Toto got wind of it and went spare, almost getting Lauda relieved of his position of Chairman!!
    I read that contracts with customer teams aren't part of Toto Wolff's job (racing team CEO), but he has a veto on the MB board's decision on the matter.
    Toto can handle Force India and Williams getting MB engines, but Red Bull would certainly become a threat.
    He probably doesn't trust his technical team to do a better job than Adrian Newey.
     
    Bas likes this.
  14. scowman

    scowman Formula 3

    Mar 25, 2014
    2,479
    Scottsdale AZ
    Full Name:
    Stu Boogie
    I think the RB has more downforce than the others. On a fast track they would still lag. Of course if they had a better motor they would probably back off the downforce and try to compete on more than the low speed circuits.

    I think Hamilton said it best at Monaco. Engineers design a car for the whole season, not just one race.

    Unless you are RB with a slow motor. Then you just design for one race and one win.
     
  15. tervuren

    tervuren Formula 3

    Apr 30, 2006
    2,469
    It would appear that MB and Ferrari are very close across a broad range of tracks, with one having an advantage or disadvantage here or there.

    It also seems that the ideal performance of the car from the tires is not the same between the two, should one really struggle compared to the other it may just be who brought the car better suited to the weather.
     
  16. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 31, 2016
    20,528
    Corpus Christi, Tx.
    Full Name:
    Joe R Gonzales
    MB ate their tyres during testing (Barcelona-->2 weeks prior to the Aussie GP). Reports out there say MB lobbied Pirelli for the tyres to be changed...Pirelli obliged....so they did for 3 GP's during the season.
     
    classic308 likes this.
  17. BMWairhead

    BMWairhead Formula 3

    Sep 11, 2009
    1,033
    Portland, OR
    Full Name:
    Ted
    And the rest of the story...

    ...is that similar changes had been made in previous seasons for similar reasons and Pirelli said they were already planning to alter the tires with or without MB’s suggestion. From there it has blown up into a conspiracy theory that has become the most parroted excuse when someone’s favorite team finishes behind MB.
     
    tifoso2728 likes this.
  18. Gatorrari

    Gatorrari F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 27, 2004
    15,924
    Georgia
    Full Name:
    Jim Pernikoff
    That's really been the case ever since Adrian Newey has been there. And I don't think they have as big a power disadvantage as some people think. In past years, they were among the slowest cars in the speed traps. This year that has not always been the case.
     
  19. tifoso2728

    tifoso2728 F1 Veteran
    BANNED

    Apr 30, 2014
    8,215
    IL
    Full Name:
    DRM
    Right. Those dudes should contact Oliver Stone. Maybe he'd buy the script.
     
    BMWairhead likes this.
  20. tifoso2728

    tifoso2728 F1 Veteran
    BANNED

    Apr 30, 2014
    8,215
    IL
    Full Name:
    DRM
    What is intriguing to me is, will another team manage to catch-up to the top three of Ferrari, Mercedes and Red Bull? I would love to have a situation where teams like Haas and Renault could fight for the win. Mind you, I'm a Ferrari home boy all the way, but it would be nice if other teams could be more competitive for the top spot on the podium.
     
  21. Gatorrari

    Gatorrari F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 27, 2004
    15,924
    Georgia
    Full Name:
    Jim Pernikoff
    Unfortunately, that seems as far from likely as it ever has. In Canada, the full-lap gap between the top 6 (from those three teams) and everyone else was about as large a gap as I've ever seen at a Grand Prix. If nothing befalls the three top teams, the most any of them seem capable of right now is 7th place!
     
    william likes this.
  22. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
    41,300
    ESP
    Full Name:
    Bas
    At Canada they ran a tiny rear wing compared to say Ferrari and Mercedes. So their top speed doesn't suffer when you look at it...In qualifying they lost a chunk of time in the final sector (which consists of one hairpin, an enormous straight and a chicane). Verstappen lost more than 3 tenths in this very short sector alone. Ricciardo 4. This is with the small wing.

    Even with the small wing (a compromise), the Red Bull was fastest in the all corners S1.
     
  23. tervuren

    tervuren Formula 3

    Apr 30, 2006
    2,469
    The first step that would help with this would be re-distribution of the prize money, eliminating historic prize money and focusing on what you are up to this season.

    A step like this would see Ferrari threaten to exit.
     
    william likes this.
  24. Igor Ound

    Igor Ound F1 Veteran

    Sep 30, 2012
    8,102
    The Horn
    Full Name:
    Igor Ound
    Mercedes, they have the least chances of getting penalties due to bad reliability
     
  25. Mitch Alsup

    Mitch Alsup F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    9,252
    Baku is a slow speed circuit !?!
     

Share This Page