Introducing myself and my Mondial 8 | Page 2 | FerrariChat

Introducing myself and my Mondial 8

Discussion in 'Mondial' started by PolarGlade, Jul 29, 2016.

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  1. dfranzen

    dfranzen Formula 3
    Owner

    Aug 31, 2013
    1,577
    Ponte Vedra Beach , FL
    Full Name:
    Don Franzen
    Does CO perform emission testing?

    If its site only your friendly smog place will most likely overlook the cat, however if it is sniffed you will need a Cat to pass

    Congrats by the way!
     
  2. Cadillacbart

    Cadillacbart Formula Junior

    Nov 26, 2013
    436
    Denver, CO
    Full Name:
    John
    Colorado has notoriously tough emission standards in the populated counties.
    Visual inspection of all smog equipment and then a rolling road test with varying speeds from idle up to 60 mph at some points. Took me 5 times with my 928S4 last month ( turns out the O2 sensor was bad).
     
  3. PolarGlade

    PolarGlade Rookie

    Jul 29, 2016
    22
    Great info. I'm going to take a look. I think its the Non-Cat Euro. I have a feeling I'm going to be retro fitting this one so I can pass. That's going to be $$$$. Where is a good source that I can get a list of the parts I am going to need?

     
  4. dfranzen

    dfranzen Formula 3
    Owner

    Aug 31, 2013
    1,577
    Ponte Vedra Beach , FL
    Full Name:
    Don Franzen
    Maybe Ricambi
    most likely you will have to find used QV muffler system from ferparts but still no guarantee to pass a sniff test

    not to discourage you , Euro to US has been a very expensive endevour if you do a search

    question was the car registered in another State and still valid (no op)? I would look to register as Historic Vehicle and keep it all the same, even the CommiCali has that as an option

    Ok Ill put my dibs in now if you decide to sell instead!
     
  5. srephwed

    srephwed F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 29, 2012
    6,449
    street,md
    Full Name:
    fred brown
    check with your motor vehicle administration before you do anything. In some states as here in Maryland if a car is past a certain age it is exempt. Mine is a 1985 euro with no cats or lambda and does not need to be tested. Looks like a nice car but also make sure service is up to date. I have seen pictures of the results after a timing belt failure. It ain't pretty.
     
  6. TheMac

    TheMac Formula Junior

    Sep 5, 2009
    452
    Alberta
    Full Name:
    Jon Mac
    The location of the red and yellow lights was not necessarily standard from the factory. You see the same thing on 308s. Some have the red inside, some outside. Depended who was installing the taillights on a given day.
     
  7. Alden

    Alden F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 25, 2010
    2,903
    Central Florida
    Really? I thought the lights were usually swapped from Euro configuration to comply with US DOT standards, some are also put back wrong after a repaint.

    Alden
     
  8. 2281GT

    2281GT Formula 3
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Oct 9, 2006
    1,132
    Germany
    Full Name:
    Markus
    Sorry, but that is not correct. The Turnsignals ALWAYS have to be outside, on ANY CAR !
    See the homologation sheet for example.
     
  9. davemqv

    davemqv F1 Rookie

    Aug 28, 2014
    3,097
    USA
    Full Name:
    Dave
    I would suggest that before doing any work or buying any parts, that you talk with a Colorado based shop that works on Ferrari's, ideally old ones, and see how they would advise you to move forward.

    You may still be in for an expensive conversion, but you may also find that there are ways to make your car passable that aren't as painful to your pocketbook.
     
  10. 350HPMondial

    350HPMondial F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 1, 2002
    5,187
    18 mi from the surf,, close to Pismo, CA
    Full Name:
    Edwardo
    #35 350HPMondial, Aug 1, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2016
    Aaaaa yes Denver, CO... very tough to pass emmissions,, even with Cats.
    For my 1985 Cabriolet, The car is put on a rear wheel dynomometer and run under stress.
    I used to live in Jefferson County and I still had to go to the Denver Referee center to try and pass. and FAIL.....!!!!!!!! was their answere.

    Now, on to My 1981 Euro "8...."
    My Euro Ferrari was federalized in 1982,, here in California.
    That makes it a 1982 car subject to 1982 smog limits ..
    ( Do a CarFax,, somebody on this site can do it for Free... I forgot who.)
    My Mods included;
    A Seat belt buzzer on a timer, not attached to seat bottom senser.
    Side door anti-intrusion beams, bumper shocks and,,
    Two, Catalytic Converter Exhausts,,, from two, 4 Cyl FORD Pintos...
    and last,,
    a carbon cannister from a 1981-89 Chevy Pick up..... Mine was missing,, but I got one from a 1988 Chevy in a junk yard,,, $ 15.00,,, ha ha

    Remember, except for that Thermal Reactor muffler,,, Ferrari didn't make smog equipment back in 1981.

    Note; You Only need the 1981 USA 308GTSi Ferrari Thermal Reactor exhaust if you have a USA car. But,,,,,, getting NOS cats from 1981 car,,, and/or getting cats with Colorado Smog numbers on them,, can be tricky. And, a High Dollar muffler shop can't leagily modify your 1981 exhaust. ( Gross polluter Law. )

    Thus, contact Magnaflow here in Cali.
    Get 2, rear, 2012 cats for a Nissan Pathfinder, I have all the numbers in my string...
    ,,, cut and paste by your pick of fly by night welders.
    Presto, done for about $ 1000.00
    Now,,, shut up......
    ,
    ,
    ,

    Nobody,,
    really,
    ,
    ,
    ,
    nobody will care...
    The DMV just wants money.
    The smog guys just want you to pass,, and, are happy to see cats at all.
    but, they can't lie about anything.....
    (so, shut the "F" up.... don't make their job any more difficult,,some Smog guys wont even touch the car.)
    So, shop around... take Free sniffs and adjust your primary fuel pressure regulator until you have 14.7 to 1.0, fuel to air ratio.
    Then,, it should pass..
    That's what I did,,, but my car came with an ARB serial number and an ARB ( now CARB, aka California Air Resources Board) sticker on the drivers door jamb.

    (whew)

    Good Luck,
    Below, Check out my 9 year old string, for my 1981 Mondial 8,, here on FChat.
    Edwardo

    http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/mondial/449120-250-hp-mondial-cheap-ferrari-etc-9.html
     
  11. PolarGlade

    PolarGlade Rookie

    Jul 29, 2016
    22
    I might have a loop hole...

    You guys said the car was a 1981 by the VIN. My title says '82.

    If it can qualify as an '81 I only need the two stage idle test, not the Dyno. I can pass that with some cats.

    How do I prove this is an '81?
     
  12. davemqv

    davemqv F1 Rookie

    Aug 28, 2014
    3,097
    USA
    Full Name:
    Dave
    What does the production plate say on the driver side door jam? Should state a month and a year for date for production. It may have been titled as an '82 because it was sold new in '82. If the actual car says '81 then maybe you could try telling the CO DMV that it was titled incorrectly the last time, and register it as a 1981 car under your name.? I know incorrect info on titles happens from time to time. Not sure how much of a thing it is to correct.
     
  13. 2281GT

    2281GT Formula 3
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Oct 9, 2006
    1,132
    Germany
    Full Name:
    Markus
    #38 2281GT, Aug 3, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    It is an european car, there are no such plates on european cars, only on US cars.

    Brian, You have to ask the factory/classische department for a "Vehicle production data", you only have to tell the VIN and to pay about 400.00 USD for that document. See pdf of my 3.2 Mondial attached.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  14. Russ Gould

    Russ Gould Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 8, 2004
    1,073
    I never had a problem smogging my US 81 (sold in 82) in Portland OR even during the rolling road era. So the "correct" parts must be available but they will cost you plenty. I don't know this for sure but I think the cams might be a little different on the US cars as well as the ignition settings and of course the air pump and cats. I don't think you can do cats without installing an air pump as the exhaust stream needs the extra O2 for the cats to do their thing.

    You may want to go through it, give it a spit and shine, and then sell it to a buyer in a state that is not run by dope-smoking obamabots (Texas for example does not test cars outside of the major metropolitan areas). Then take the money and buy a car with US emissions (or an exempt car).
     
  15. sidtx

    sidtx F1 Rookie
    Owner

    Feb 9, 2014
    4,454
    Frisco, Tx
    Full Name:
    Sid
    Texas does not smog check vehicles older than 25 years. We only get a safety check (brakes, lights, horn, etc.)

    And, if you opt for the "Antique Auto" license plates, then there is no annual check. Nothing. However, "officially" the antique auto plate limits the use of your vehicle to car shows, parades, events, etc.

    Sid
     
  16. skierlawyer

    skierlawyer Formula Junior

    Sep 12, 2010
    383
    Golden, CO
    Full Name:
    Brian
    I recently passed emissions here in CO with my F355, no cats. They don't run the car on the Dyno they just do the sniff test on the tailpipes at idle and at something like 2500 rpm. Passed with flying colors and NO CATS! I would simply try and pass as is, and IF you fail then try something else, but no harm in trying. By the way, I used the testing facility in Golden.
     
  17. PolarGlade

    PolarGlade Rookie

    Jul 29, 2016
    22
    Thanks for all the info everyone! I am going to try to pass this thing once its running nice and smooth on 1/4 tank of E85 and hopefully just a sniff test with no Dyno. then fill it full with regular gas after the test is done.

    The second option is to buy what I need. Where would everyone here suggest I start looking for parts?

    I'm sure like all low production number car owners, there is one place you guys all trust?


     
  18. Meister

    Meister F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 27, 2001
    5,516
    Duluth, MN
    Full Name:
    The Meister
    I saw (online) this car for sale there in ILL. Knew it wouldn't last too long. Hope you got it for less than asking just to give a little extra cushion for your restoration needs. IMO it was a little high to start even in todays market.

    Looking for oddball parts (used)
    ebay
    ferrparts
    specializeditalianrecycling
    hemings
    ricambia (new)
     
  19. PolarGlade

    PolarGlade Rookie

    Jul 29, 2016
    22
    We will just say...about half of his ask. LOL

    Thanks for the list, I'll start looking at these places for other stuff I need too.

     
  20. Meister

    Meister F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 27, 2001
    5,516
    Duluth, MN
    Full Name:
    The Meister
    #45 Meister, Aug 3, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2016
    Nice ($)! Thats about what I was going to offer. I'm only 7 hrs away and dont have the room or time, but if he would have bit around that number it would have been worth the trip as a long term project. For that ($) and if you are resourceful you can get the car back to life and have plenty of room to avoid getting upside down. Great find! Enjoy the process and the car.

    As one word of advice, a Mondial (8) found in this condition will nickle and dime you to twice the price if you choose to source very piece and part via a dealer or only OEM parts. There are plenty of aftermarket and cross reference parts that you can use to get the car back to life without paying the ferrari tax and in the end will have a fun ride. One example would be plug wires. I made a set of 8MM plug wires for my ex 308 from accell 40/40R for less than $100 vs a Ferrari parts supplier getting $650 for a set. A handful of items like that can stretch the budget pretty far. Again, enjoy Fchat is an incredible resource. Another is tires... REPOP XWX's are $500 a piece. For that kind of $ just for tires you can find a nice set of 360 or 348 wheels AND tires to install on the car which will transform both the look and hadling
     
  21. Ricambi America

    Ricambi America F1 World Champ
    Sponsor Owner

    PolarGlade, Congratulations on the Mondial!

    I suspect with such low mileage, you'll be primarily facing issues of benign neglect, instead of outright exhaustion of parts. Feel free to ring us at Ricambi America for any of the mechanical bits you might require during the restoration. Welcome to the insanity (family?) of Ferrari!

    Kind Regards,
    Daniel
     
  22. Rapalyea

    Rapalyea Formula 3

    Jun 18, 2013
    1,511
    Georgia Mountains US
    Full Name:
    David Rapalyea alias
    #47 Rapalyea, Aug 5, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2016
    I removed the cats from my 1984 Z-28 and passed an idle test by simply installing a pvc plumbing valve in the PCV circuit. I simply bled in enough air to the circuit to lean it out. Worked every time. I suspect your Bosch fuel injection system is like mine. If you remove the little insert (and yours may be unsealed being an EU) with the engine off you can both lean and enrich the mixture. It is a small hex head that is a bit touchy to find deep down inside but becomes obvious once seated.

    I enriched mine just a bit for valve heat safety. About 1/8 turn clockwise I believe. Counter clockwise to lean it out? I did this after de-carbonizing the system. When I got the car it had a bit of sulfur smell but after lots of carbon cleaner and high rev runs the smell went away and the car got WAY faster. Thats when I enriched it. I still get no sulfur smell but the check engine light stays on more then it used to.

    I have a 3.2 and the engine is much less subject to carbon build up then the two valve versions. I have seen examples of the two valves that look like my old mans 1951 side valve flat head six. This is no joke. Your car is low mileage so might be ok. However, the most serious downside is if it is carboned up the exhaust valves will not have adequate cooling and the valve head could separate. I believe that would only happen under extreme and continuous high rev full throttle running - such as I do all the time.

    A lesser problem is something even I seemed to have experienced. Specifically, these carbon deposits, if they are heavy enough, will absorb, especially during warm up, some of the fuel injector sprits then release same when they reach some sort of temperature or saturation level. It manifests itself as slight surging. Actual IS a lean surge.

    Another problem with lean surging is caused by hardened fuel injector grommets. Under high vacuum these hard grommets can leak a bit of air into the intake manifold because their hardness prevents them from a continuous flexible seal. Most people would simply replace them. You can test for it by spraying some starter fluid on each injector grommet at idle and observe whether the idle changes or not. I used WD-40 and several of mine showed signs of it. And I had noticeable lean surging at highway speeds using light throttle at 3,000 rpms especially. In my case I simply dripped a few drops of power steering stop leak on all of them and the problem ceased in a month or so. That was about 15,000 miles ago.

    I have other unorthodox things I have done that have served the test of time in my particular case. For instance, I use 60/40 glycol water mix and depressurized the very complex plumbing system. Have not added an ounce in three years and 15,000 miles despite the fact I run hard at 2,000 ft elevation. The fans only activate on extended idle. I also add 8 oz of either 2 cycl engine oil or Marvel Mystery oil every time I fill up with fuel. I want every last exposed surface in my fuel system to have some sort of buffer between it and oxygen and or ethanol corrosion. As an old fashioned "top lube' it can't hurt!

    PS: In the first year I got an oil leak either from the front main or one of the four cam seals that dripped down onto the front outside passenger side exhaust header. So much smoke out of the engine vents I was concerned for actual fire. Suspecting it could do little extra harm I added one of each and every stop leak available at the local autozone. In addition I researched and bought AT- something or other that seemed to have a good reputation on Amazon. The serious smoke was abated almost immediately, and smoke is still entirely absent after two years. These 'repolimerization' agents themselves need a continuous renewal and so I add on bottle of whatever that AT- stuff was at each oil change. Since I bought from Amazon I do not need to remember what it is. I simply look up what I bought previously and order the same thing. I really really like Amazon......
     

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