Shout out to Rifledriver! | FerrariChat

Shout out to Rifledriver!

Discussion in '360/430' started by Jagbuff, Nov 1, 2015.

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  1. Jagbuff

    Jagbuff Formula 3

    Jan 13, 2004
    2,267
    Site of US F1 Race!
    Full Name:
    Franck
    #1 Jagbuff, Nov 1, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2015
    I would like to take this opportunity to thank an "independent" for getting me back on the road after several months of frustration and never ending part$$ replacement.

    I will not be naming names but my issues were F1 related (not the Bernie type, the wonderful transmission). When I first got the car about 5 years I spent almost $10K to resolve a shifting issue. First gear would drop out when I came to a full stop (a brand new clutch had been installed as part of the PPI), relays, pumps were replaced and actuator rebuilt but the issue was never fully identified or truly addressed - see my several posts about slipping clutch after 20-30 minutes of hard driving. Ultimately the tranny started misbehaving after a trip at COTA…in March. TCU error code indicated a speed sensor problem and clutch wear at 100% (weird since my prior reading was 7% wear barely 18 months before with less than 1500 miles driven).

    Anyway, since I always felt that the F1 and the clutch didn’t quite feel right I decided on a fresh clutch, flywheel, sensors, throw out bearing etc…. Hill Engineering was the primary source and selected a known source for a kevlar clutch and stage 2 pressure plate (PM for the source). After a couple of weeks the parts went in just in time for my next track day so I thought. But I get “the call” on Thursday, speed sensor is not good and needs to be replaced (other sensors were replaced). Fortunately Ferrari of Seattle has one and they overnight. Disappointedly the problem is not resolved :( After further diagnosis the suggestion is made to replace the TCU…not exactly thrilled with that pro$pect, I relented and located a fresh ECU (July by now), TCU is programmed and the car works great….for one day… problem not resolved. I am WTF, I am almost $10K into this experiment and my car still doesn’t run. The guys working on it are not exactly the Jiffy Lube crowd, they have several decades of aggregated knowledge on Ferraris, Lambos, and MB, most have worked at the top indie shops and one has his own shop. After 3 days of troubleshooting they throw the towel and tell me they can't figure out the problem.

    At this time I am about as happy as the time I got the subpoena from the DOJ asking to produce all our records that had the word “whatever” (…not exactly that word but close). The only ray of hope is that there is a new guy in town… Since, I have already spent almost $800 in towing charges since the beginning of the saga moving the car around (no kidding), I decided to make it an even $1k and send him the car to sort out.

    Most of you know him as the sometime sharp-tongued RifleDriver, AKA Brian Crall- or now Hill Country Ferrari Service. BTW, good luck finding that on the web - you need a secret handshake to locate him - Brian isn’t much into marketing, more about fixing cars apparently.

    Anyway I get call from Brian within a couple of hours of the car being dropped off, he sounds somewhat perplexed asking why they haven’t figured out the problem…certainly I am not in the joking mood, but there again Brian is not much of a jokester so he must be serious…One of the sensors is not registering that the clutch is disengaged and we need to take things apart again..YEAH that’s awesome (sarcasm emoji) !!!…After a few days I get another called and asked to come over to see the “patient”. Diagnosis, Hill Engineering flywheel needs to be re-machined because it is out of spec, Kelvar clutch is part of the problem as it lacks progressive take up and the pressure plate “fingers” have different engagement movement than the stock (may work fine for manual transmission but messes with the F1 TCU that is looking for a specific drag vs. rpm drop- based on TO bearing movement)so that POS Kevlar Clutch needs to go and replaced with stock, …to make thing even worst, apparently the original TCU was never set up properly… :(

    Fast forward couple of weeks, the car is ready and I finally get to drive it again, Brian has done a full examination and gives the car a clean bill of health. Cost is similar to clutch replacement…not cheap but at least I know it’s been down by one of the best in the US.

    So what’s the take away? The most obvious for me - I should have converted that POS F1 to manual when I first got the car, I would be about $20K richer and far more happy (F1 is good on the track, but it’s fragile, frustrating, and slow….) and I would have a unique car – manual 360CS who else has one?? (Trev360?). More importantly, rely on trusted experts when you are dealing with electromechanical systems (especial if you don’t have the SD2/3 or don't know how to use it). This coming from a guy that has done several engines out (348 and TR), rebuilt several engines including a 308/288 Norwood twin turbo, has several restoration projects (a couple of SMs with Maserati engines - speak of complexity) and mechanical engineering degree to boot.

    In sum, if you are local to greater Austin, take advantage in having one of the most knowledgeable individual in the US in your backyard!

    Thanks Brian for getting me back on track (no pun intended)
     
  2. greg328

    greg328 F1 Rookie

    Nov 17, 2003
    4,178
    Austin, TX USA
    Full Name:
    Greg
    Awesome to hear, glad you got it sorted out

    Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk
     
  3. Kevin Rev'n

    Kevin Rev'n Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Nov 29, 2009
    23,050
    Honolulu
    Full Name:
    Kevin
    I am a bit jealous that you have a great indy. Makes a world of difference.
     
  4. vrsurgeon

    vrsurgeon F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 13, 2009
    15,917
    Charleston, SC
    Full Name:
    Curt
    Not surprised. :) You have one of the best with hands on your car.
     
  5. Bob in Texas

    Bob in Texas F1 Rookie

    Apr 23, 2012
    2,667
    Just East of Weird
    Full Name:
    Bob
    Yep, we are VERY fortunate to have a resident rifledriver.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
     
  6. gandalfthegray.

    gandalfthegray. Formula Junior

    Jul 18, 2006
    692
    Pinewood, MN
    Full Name:
    Steve
    Threads like this scare the hell out of me. I've got an F1 430 and live in northern Minnesota. 12 hours from the closest dealer and I don't know of an independent.
     
  7. hessank

    hessank Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 8, 2005
    1,742
    Canada, Florida
    Full Name:
    Fred
    Sounds like we need to clone him
     
  8. 88Testarossa

    88Testarossa Formula 3

    Sep 25, 2012
    2,450
    Annapolis and Daytona Beach
    Full Name:
    Al
    Great kudos for Rifle guy. Personally, I'm glad I own a manual 360. F1 scares me $enseless


    Sent via itty bitty electrons
     
  9. Byebye911

    Byebye911 Karting

    May 8, 2014
    70
    Norway
    Full Name:
    J.G
    My F1 car dont scare me, but a bad mechanic does. A good mechanic is important.
     
  10. Skidkid

    Skidkid F1 Veteran
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Aug 25, 2005
    8,757
    Campbell, CA
    Full Name:
    John Zornes
    #10 Skidkid, Nov 2, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2015
    So to summarize your story: Bought car, had problem, threw parts at the car without proper diagnosis, tried other mechanics with more parts and no diagnosis, got frustrated, FINALLY took car to someone knowledgeable, diagnosed car, fixed problem and all works correctly. NOW you are unhappy that it cost so much and somehow that is the systems problem not the process or lack of diagnosis. Did I get that about right?

    Glad your car is fixed but I have to say that the cost and frustration was largely self imposed.
     
  11. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    34,031
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    Thanks for the comments Frenchie. Glad the car is working well.
     
  12. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    34,031
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    In fairness to his situation John I was not available when this saga started and he was using the locally available services at the time. As you know not everyone is up to speed on proper diagnosis, repair and servicing of the F1 systems. I don't think he faults the car.
     
  13. Skidkid

    Skidkid F1 Veteran
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Aug 25, 2005
    8,757
    Campbell, CA
    Full Name:
    John Zornes
    True. And I am missing you in my neck of the woods.
     
  14. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    34,031
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    I miss many of you guys too but I don't miss California.
     
  15. 285ferrari

    285ferrari Two Time F1 World Champ
    Sponsor

    Sep 11, 2004
    20,845
    Southern Md
    Full Name:
    Robbie
    Brian is top notch!!!
     
  16. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    34,031
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    Subcontractors like you make our life easier. Wish it was as easy to get all the other stuff I need done, done.
     
  17. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
    Consultant

    Nov 29, 2001
    12,662
    San Carlos, CA
    Full Name:
    Mitchell Le
    Amen.
     
  18. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    34,031
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    F1's are treated unfairly. The vast majority of problems with them come from ignoring warning signs and acts of human intervention as in this case. Lots of people working on them that shouldn't be. Too many shops just can't say no.
     
  19. mathewr

    mathewr F1 Rookie
    Sponsor Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 7, 2011
    2,802
    Deep in the Heart of Texas
    Full Name:
    Ferrari Wheel Guru

    Looking forward to stopping off and meeting Brian on the way to the ranch in Fredericksburg.

    Now, just have to figure out where he is...
     
  20. Jagbuff

    Jagbuff Formula 3

    Jan 13, 2004
    2,267
    Site of US F1 Race!
    Full Name:
    Franck
    Brian summed it up correctly. First I did not personally throw parts at it, I relied on the best shop and their expertise available at the time, and in their defense (sort of) the F1 platform at the time was still relatively new. When another F1 problem emerged Brian wasn't in Austin yet and opted to seek out other experts and had a rather unpleasant result.

    As I have posted on several occasion I have enjoyed the F1 for the track and have driven it far harder than the majority of F1 owners with probably 60-70% of my miles on track so any weaknesses or incorrect setting will become accentuated. If I just putzed around to C & C and really never pushed the ca,r probably would not have noticed it.

    That said, the CS F1 is somewhat antiquated by today's standards, and I long for a 6 speed manual for it's simplicity and engagement; my comment was mostly tongue and cheek and now I realize that doesn't always translate over the net especially when someone is looking to make a pointed remark. So to that point... yes spending money and going through the frustration to keep my car running was very much self imposed as staring at it in my garage and waxing it isn't really my thing :)
     
  21. PAP 348

    PAP 348 Nine Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Dec 10, 2005
    99,358
    Mount Isa, Australia
    Full Name:
    Pap
    Good to hear BC sorted it! He is the man! :)
     
  22. since-15

    since-15 Formula 3

    Nov 26, 2008
    1,142
    What are the most common warning signs that are ignored and acts of human intervention when it comes to problems with the F1 system that you have noticed?
     
  23. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    34,031
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    #23 Rifledriver, Nov 3, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2015
    Ignoring warning lights and intermittent problems or failures until it strands you. No different than ignoring the occasional chest pain until you drop over dead from a heart attack. Warning lights and intermittent problems are not OK.
    Like check engine lights, turning off the battery does nothing and is poor advice to the extreme in both cases.

    Acts of human intervention would include incorrect service and repair procedures much like what happened in this case. Fix it Ferrari's way with Ferrari's equipment and it will work properly. That requires a real understanding of how it works and what the equipment is trying to tell you.
     
  24. Skidkid

    Skidkid F1 Veteran
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Aug 25, 2005
    8,757
    Campbell, CA
    Full Name:
    John Zornes
    I would add that just because it is a Ferrari dealer it doesn't mean that they have any idea how to fix the system properly. I haven't had any good experiences with the local dealer. Once they even returned my car to me with a CEL and told me that it was all fixed and would go away. As you can guess, I didn't take the car and it wasn't all fixed.
     
  25. GaryR

    GaryR Formula 3

    Dec 11, 2006
    1,006
    Valencia, Spain
    Full Name:
    Gary R.
    Funny coincidence, but Brian has an Tech response in the latest Forza talking about F1 transmissions! Always enjoy reading his stuff, I think he is mellowing out since getting out of Cali! :D
     

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