Imponderable Concrete question. | FerrariChat

Imponderable Concrete question.

Discussion in 'Other Off Topic Forum' started by UroTrash, Jan 22, 2009.

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  1. UroTrash

    UroTrash Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Suppose you cut a (10 inch diameter) tree down, cut it level with the ground but do not dig up the stump.

    Can you put 4 inches of concrete over it (for a driveway) or will it eventually rise (or sink) and crack the concrete?
     
  2. smg2

    smg2 F1 World Champ
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    unless you cut out the heart of the tree or band it, it'll grow. concrete uses water as the chemical reaction to setup, extra moisture from the tree will I would suppose effect the cure and most likely cause the pad to crumble. I'd pull out the stump or get an arborist to give you pointers on killing it without taking the stump out.
     
  3. DrStranglove

    DrStranglove FChat Assassin
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    Even if it does not grow or rise up on you, as it decomposes it will create a void under the concrete as deep and as wide and the wood in the stump. Depending on the wood and the worms, this will take about a year or maybe even less in our area. And this void will collapse in time. Maybe as little as a year. Concrete has amazing compaction, but next to know tensile strength. You will almost be able to step through 4 inches if there is a void under it.
     
  4. fred cat

    fred cat Karting
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    Next to what????
     
  5. GrigioGuy

    GrigioGuy Splenda Daddy
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    +1 to JR's comments. The stump isn't just going to sit there forever, and when it rots you'll have a weak spot in the concrete.

    It only costs a few hundred or less to get a stump ground to sawdust, and then you just overpack the hole to ensure a solid base.
     
  6. UroTrash

    UroTrash Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Thanks guys. I'll get a grinder.
     
  7. Oceanic815

    Oceanic815 Formula 3

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    Think of the decomposing tree stump as a living wonderland for insects and creepycrawlies- right under your driveway!
     
  8. DrStranglove

    DrStranglove FChat Assassin
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    Best would be to grind/dig it out at least 2 feet below the lower level of the concrete, then pack with pee gravel and a good sheet of plastic on top of that to help keep moisture away as best as you can. Then lay your pad.
     
  9. PeterS

    PeterS Four Time F1 World Champ
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    How about simply using the tip of a chain saw to take the stump down 10-12 inches and then pour the cement over it?
     
  10. 8 SNAKE

    8 SNAKE F1 Veteran

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    Why destroy a perfectly good chain saw? Cheaper and easier to rent a grinder.
     
  11. David_S

    David_S F1 World Champ
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    You know.. the US Gubbermint used to have an educational film for farmers detailing how to mix up ANFO to remove stumps prior to cultivating fields. Certainly more fun than renting a stump grinder...
     
  12. davem

    davem F1 Veteran
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    You really need to pull it out, grinding it will not remove all of it. Once the rest decomposes you will have a sinkhole underneath your driveway.
     
  13. Red 27

    Red 27 Formula 3
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    10" is not big enough to cause a sink hole. You can put some extra #5 or #6 rebar in the concrete in the area above the stump. Rebar holds up bridges so should be able to span a 10" hole and provide enough strength to support any size vehicle.
    Make sure the tree is dead. Drill some holes "8" in the stump and pour some d***** fuel "easy to find" or Roundup into the holes. Dig a small footing 8" by 12" around the stump to get some extra strength in the area.

    Or

    Rent a stump grinder and do it right. Fill the hole with sand. Do use some extra rebar in the area of the stump.

    Good luck,
    Dave
     
  14. Glassman

    Glassman F1 World Champ
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    Been there done that. Dig at least 3' down. It will be a pain in the ass. Took me two days because I'm a ***** and the tree was 20" accross. Then get the chain saw out and cut out everything you can. Then fill with gravel and compact. When your done you will feel like real man.
     
  15. Etcetera

    Etcetera Two Time F1 World Champ
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    But replacing all the windows in your house and in your neighbors' houses would not be a pleasant prospect.
     
  16. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
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    LMAO!!

    A serious assortment of folktales and urban myths.
     
  17. PeterS

    PeterS Four Time F1 World Champ
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    #17 PeterS, Jan 22, 2009
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2009
    MY WAY:

    1) Chain saw the stump
    2) Take chain off
    3) Replace with sharpened chain in saw case
    4) Take chain to shop for sharpening
    5) Have a beer!


    YOUR WAY:

    1) Make a bunch of calls to find all grinders are rented out
    2) Call a shop 60 miles away that has one
    3) Put $40 gas in car to pick up grinder
    4) Get to shop and stand in line for 30 minutes
    5) Get pissy because the new clerk can't figure out how to ring up transaction
    6) Drive back home
    7) Get stump grinder out of car and drop on foot
    8) After an hour of pain, start grinding
    9) Grinder dies
    10) Call shop
    11) Go back to grinder to adjust the red do-hickey next to the black thing-a-ma-bob
    12) Grind stump until you are out of gas
    13) Find spare gas can, half full....Can't remember if you already poured 2-stroke oil in it
    14) Drive to gas station for a fresh gallon of gas
    15) Finish grinding 90% of stump. Grinder dies and will not re-start
    16) Get axe and finish off stump....Get bad blister on right thumb
    17) Have a few beers
    18) Take grinder back to store......they closed a half an hour ago
    19) Drive home..............pissed
    20) Pull into driveway and take front-end of car out on the hole you left
    21) Get out of car, kick hole, break big toe
    22) Go to Prompt-care
    23) With toe in splint, drive to pharmacy for pain meds.......Wait 55 minutes
    24) Drive back home, pop a couple beers while forgetting you just took two 10/325 Vicodins!
    25) Punch wife in face when she says "That was'nt such a dad job, hu honey"?


    I like my way MUCH better:D
     
  18. Etcetera

    Etcetera Two Time F1 World Champ
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    LOL!
     
  19. ski_bum

    ski_bum Formula 3

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    Friends way:

    I receive call from friend, him & brother in law are cutting down front trees. Go over to 'help'
    When I got there friend & BIL are examining dead chainsaw. BIL goes back to HD (6 miles away) and gets exchange.
    BIL returns, chainsaw works maybe 5 minutes. Back to HD.
    Returns, another 5 minutes. This time they find out gas tank is empty.
    BIL goes to gas station, & back to HD for 2 stoke oil. Talks to rental guy, finds out 2nd chainsaw was also out of gas. Also told by rental guy that chainsaw rental is free because of return trips.....
    Friend & BIL starts a chop'n away. Blade gets duller and smok'n. Eventually too dull to cut and thick billowing clouds of smoke.
    Returns back to HD and rental guy said he had to pay for a new chain since they didn't put in chain oil. BIL goes 'what oil???', they never told him about that. Eventually manager excuses payment.

    Me: HAHAHA..cough cough...HAHAHA..cough...HAHAHA!!!! My laughing was silent though, if I did it out loud they probably would have chainsawed me!!!! :D
     
  20. parkerfe

    parkerfe F1 World Champ

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    One certainty in life is that concrete will crack...
     
  21. 8 SNAKE

    8 SNAKE F1 Veteran

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    You've never removed a stump, have you Pete?
     
  22. mwr4440

    mwr4440 Five Time F1 World Champ
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    Absolutely not.

    Back in the old days (Colorado, Tx), used to go find a road work crew and ask for a stick or two of dynamite to remove stumps. They'd often just give it to us ............

    If they did not have any we'd just mix up the ANFO and .....


    .... out would come the stump!!!!!! :D
     
  23. David_S

    David_S F1 World Champ
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    Not only that, but the detonation heavily compacts the earth beneath the stump. Shame it has gotten to the point a man can't use a perfectly good tool/method these days...
     
  24. UroTrash

    UroTrash Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Stump is 2 feet from existing driveway so no kenipac!
     
  25. bonedoc

    bonedoc Karting

    Jul 31, 2004
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    You need to remove the stump and fill/compact it. I am building a pad right now and removed 100 trees. The stumps have to be removed because as they cause they dirt to shift as the rot and cause problems with the structure on it. In fact, before you can have proper compaction, you must remove GRASS. As small as it may seem, grass can cause enough shift in a structure when it decomposes to make it dangerous.
     

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