is the bubble due to burst?

Well, the two FML cars are very much "drivers"; nothing wrong with that, but obviously not representative of all examples.

As a former "shopping for a driver" guy, I can comfortably say that 1-2 years ago, pretty much everyone thought their "driver" car was worth $650k, but they would take $600k. To dip under $600k their had to be some obvious issues with the car.

Back then, the Gullwing car in FML was available at the same listed price, but if you look at the pics and details, you will see that the car is not "issue free".

It was the classic "stand-off"; I would not come-up in price (frankly, I just did not have the funds to), but no one would budge down either.

I finally could not afford all the time it was taking to shop for a car, so I grabbed an "issues car" that I thought checked enough boxes, and got on with my life.

(and BTW, plenty of folks thought they knew of a cheaper car that was perfect for me, but on investigation, there was always something a little off)

Today, I would think that drivers have probably shifted down $100k; i.e., everyone thinks their driver is worth $550k, but would take $500k.

Mind you, however, at least part of this is due to the Covid issue; I was shocked that the RM Arizona Daytona went for as much as it did, so before Covid hit, the "floor" on Daytona prices would seem to have been higher than my estimations.

Anyway, I'm almost certainly underwater on my car, but oh well, I saved myself an additional year of shopping/haggling, and I have little doubt that values will come back long before I ever intend to sell it.

Oh, and I'm pretty sure most other assets on my ledger have lost a similar amount of value in the last couple of months, so I'm not sure what all the fuss is about...

 

An interesting side note, checking google trends for the word "ferrari" shows some particular information where most of the peaks (for the USA) are during spring time (but not all the peaks):

https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=ferrari

 

The BaT 365 GT 2+2 flopped--bid to $128,000 Reserve Not Met.

 

Whoops, saw above post already

Nailed the RNM value bid per my prior post, unfortunately.

 

I've noticed that Ferrari butterfly 275GTBSaran hasn't been around in quite a while, perhaps that should tell us something?

 

Interesting... no real bidders, I guess. Looked like a nice car, too. In my experience, it's the marginal cars which take the biggest value hits in tough times, and are the slowest to come back-- 2+2s, PF Coupes, Lussos (well, once upon a time-- Lussos seem to have moved beyond being low end Ferraris).

 

It’s the wrong venue for a Vintage Ferrari.

It’s near impossible to see the car in person and outright impossible to get a PPI.

That’s called a pig in a poke.

Matt

 

What people also forget...good/great cars are not easily coming to the internet. Chances are very high they sell before they get to an auction and/or internet site...

 

My last sentence of post #3523
every day

 

Could be, but when I was shopping, I was approached (and sought out) more than a few "insiders", and never got anything interesting brought to me.

Admittedly, I was looking for a "driver" so maybe that is sub-good/great, and thus, my experiences are not applicable.

Alternately, if a given marketplace is too exclusive to be found/accessed, then it might not be germane to a lot of folks.

 

I don't know, I've seen some vintage Ferraris do pretty well there. The 400i that is only there now is doing pretty well! It's a beautiful, superbly documented car (C&D article and everything), but it's also high miles.

 

got an answer today:
as you already mentioned, yours are listed under 365 and I was looking for daytona. that is why we get different results

 

400i sold for $77.5k, and 5-speed or not, that's a good result for a 400i!

 

In 1996 I bought my first Ferrari - a 1983 5-speed 400i, for 200,000 FRF. That's about 40,000 today's Euros, or $43,000.

 

200.000 FRF are today about 30.500 € ( without inflation )

 

Stunned


Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat

 

That's why I said "today's Euros", since the real values to be compared need to take inflation into account - I used conversion data from INSEE (french statistics institute), converting 1996 FRF to 2019 EUR (data not available for 2020).

 

at that time it has been less than those 30.500 € because it was 1996. the exchange rate I counted when the euro arrived in 2002

 

Euro did not exist in 1996 of course - the effect of inflation is always that the older currency had more value, an FRF of 1996 had more value than an FRF of 2002 and an EUR of 2019 as less value than an EUR of 2002 - so you need more 2019 EUR than computed by the 2002 FRF/EUR conversion to have in 2019 the "buying power" of the 1996 FRF.

 

Another 365GT on BaT... I wonder if any real buyers will show up for this one?

 

Anyone have an idea what is the going rate for a decent 365 GTC/4. I think a nice Jarama just sold, for around 70 or 80K euros.

 

C/4 asking prices seem to be mostly stuck in 2019, but I think if you made some cash offers, you could get an okay one for $150-175. That is purely conjecture, but I have been keeping an eye on the C/4 market for a while. They don't seem to be moving at all.

 

Thanks Don, During 2005 - the 512 Boxer and 250 PF were priced the same. I picked the fast car !

The Jarama is a good buy.

 

Funny, I did the same thing! Shortly before that I passed on a C/4 asking $44k because I thought it was overpriced.

 

At the time I was standing in front, of the X Bill Harrah 365 GTC/4. I think the asking price was in or around 65K, or a little less.

I still remember the restored maroon and tan 250PF available, for 75K.