David Piper restores the Talacrest P4

Well if people did not want to buy them, then they would soon close up shop.

Supply and demand. If there is more demand for these than there is for the donor then thats life, just suck it up there is nothing you can do about it so stop losing sleep and get on with life.

If only 20 250 GTEs exist as a result then they will probably become collectable and people will start stripping the replica's to build GTEs instead. but dont hold your breath.

 

Well, I am a vintage Ferrari enthusiast, so I do lose sleep over it. It's a shame that real Ferraris are being butchered, especially in such an assembly-line manner. I've done my small part by restoring a 60's Ferrari 2+2 to near perfect condition, so it is less likely to fall into the hands of these champions of the free market. Maybe I'll save another one some day, even though it makes little economic sense, but that's what an enthusiast does.

 

I understand why they were butchered in the 80's and 90's, back then they were basically thought of as donor cars and were valued as such.

But times have changed and these cars are becoming appreciated for what they are and values show that.

So is it still worthwhile money wise to chop up a GTE so you can take the kids to mini golf in the Cali Spyder?

Is it still more expensive to build one from the various sources that make various parts and make a recreation a recreation and leave the Ferrari parts for Ferraris?

 

Agreed. Very disturbing.

 

There will no doubt be a tipping point when the value of the donor does not make it worthwhile, but thats a long way away yet, and the problem is the genuine versions of the replicas are getting more valuable, so the replicas become more of an option and rise accordingly as well. This in turn though will increase the value of the donors and the better ones will escape the spanners as a result.

People will then moan that a 250 GTE is no longer an affordable ferrari instead then!

 

Perfectly said, and exactly how I feel about my own efforts to make one old car correct. Not sure how many people understand this or agree.

 

Not "it" should be ready; what the promoter writes is "Restoration nearly finished - and should be ready at the end of November."

 

'it' is the right word, as Talacrest do not have a P4.

Best,

Jack.

 

well maybe Talacrest could take my 412GT 5-speed and convert it into a comp Daytona 365GTB4 for a lot more money than the market values it today, though it would then be a 412GTB4 unless they sleeved the bores.

I kid, I kid!

 

Don't give them ideas!

 

lol rof!

David, take a look at Talacrest's website. they are offering an [apparently] genuine comp Daytona with its racing record in detail, and it is finished in our colour - BLU !!! LMAO!

 

Maybe a "Singer 412?"

Singer Vehicle Design

A reimagination!

 

Well if yours started life as a 365GTB4 then why not!

 

I dont know if old cars are losing their lives in this pic, I suspect not. Today there is no need to butcher an old car, everything is available new build, from transmission cases to engine blocks to everything.

Ironicaly its the attitude oif sanctioning bodies that still may get old cars butchered. Its all about the data plate. If you butcher an old ferrari you can put ferrari badges on it and attend club events. As a new build recreation does not have a maranello supplied data plate, snobs and many sanctioning bodes dont accept them. This creates an incentive to butcher.

Same as historics, People could be racing nut and bolt recreations of p/3's but instead old can am cars need to ge butchered to gain aceptance to hsitoric events, and other old cars get crashed and loose historic identity.

The exception seems to be the 4GT40 people. At the last good wood close on half the GT40s there were rumored to be new build glescoe cars, indistinguishable but for a data plate, and apparently perfectly accptable as the spec is so exact..

 

Using the old ID also establishes the car's date and avoids emission and safety issues.

 

Boxerman do you have any thoughts on what I wrote in post #2353?

Does it have to be from a Ferrari? Can't the I.D. plate come from a 60's VW bug or whatnot?

 

Good point

 

Actualy if the car comes into the USA sans motor it does not need an old Data plate for the feds. Many states will then register a recreation as being of the year the car most closely resembles.

For example if you buy a pur sang Bugatti from argetina, they ship it here seperate to the motor and then fit the motor stateside. Basicaly you can get a "new" T35 Bugatti from pursang.

I dont see why older ferraris should be any different. The problem is snobbery.

So here on this thread we have a graphic example of a period pice being disemboweled to make a " data plate acceptable" facimile of aP3. Surely with standards and acceptance for recreations this type of butchery would stop, plus the racing woul be betetr becase there wuld be more interesing historic cars running and the consequences of ashunt minimised.

As to Butchhery in the 80's. Comsidder the value of the donor cars then and the shape they were in. Most of these were cars too far gone to restore then, and may have been lost to time anyway.

Views and values are different now. Plus there really is no need for a donor vehicle, all the bits are vailable. Either way a proper recreation is not inexpensive,

 

A "pur sang" replica? Isn't that a contradiction in terms?

 

Is there any guess of the cost of a Recreation built purely from recreation parts?

Also the cost of a recreation using a donor car?

I'd have to think that with the Values of GTE's going up the trend may shift from destroying donors to just using recreated parts.

What's the difference if you use real Ferrari parts? In the end it's a recreation whether it has Ferrari guts or not.

I'm all for saving the old ones. I feel the parts are available at this point to do that so why should the butchery continue?

Oh yeah, I forgot.... It's my car, I can do whatever I want.

 

I hope there will someday be a tipping point where abandoned Ferrari's get their guts back and the recreated car is sent down the road with a recreated engine, chassis, or whatnot.

Also realize there will be some sort of market that will make Favres etc. collectable and I'm guessing numbers matching collectable will be with the Ferrari motor that the recognized builder threw into it originally.

Maybe I'm a dreamer but it would be nice to get some of the lost cars back. Hopefully GTE/Donor car values will climb higher then recreations.

 

This is hardly a data plate replica, the vast majority of components are from the original car, only certain elements of the body have been replicated. Even the engine could be resleeved and this may well have been the case when it was converted to Can Am spec anyway by Ferrari.

 

Interesting. Seems like it is more important to these guys to do the body the right way, hand hammered, on a 300,000 exact 550 spyder recreation then it is for someone that is restoring a multi-million dollar car with actual Ferrari pedigree.....

SPYDER CREATIONS - 550 SPYDER TRIBUTE CAR Main

This $320,000 Replica Is So Accurate It's More Porsche Than A Porsche

Hmmm. Recreations being built more correct then priceless originals. Who woulda thunk it?

Guess no one cares. Guess it's close enough.

 

I guess the easiest thing for the people claiming its not a P4 is for them to clearly identify which of the thousands of parts on the car are not from P4 0858 originally, or to P4 spec

Ok I will start you off, you have already listed some of the body skins and windscreen. Oh and the header tank lol so thats let say 7 or 8 items of say a round thousand min, so off you go :-

 

You're kidding, right?

Best,

Jack.