In the market for a 360, am I being realistic?

Not entirely sure exactly what you're asking but I think if you buy a good 360 you will be very pleased with your decision. I could not be more happy with my F355 and most people compare ownership of that car to setting your wallet on fire.

Also having owned a 993, I would say it is an excellent car but certainly not bulletproof. They, like any other car, have things that require attention.

 

The manual can be owned and serviced quite easily by a skilled and/or patient person. There were enough of them made and wrecked already so that parts are readily available. Manifolds are not an issue for the 360, except in a very rare occurrence AFAIK.

 

Kind of was in your position a couple of months ago. I traded my 993 in on an '03 360 F1 coupe. I too was apprehensive since my 911's had all been very familiar to me and I kind of knew what to expect as well as being able to do most of the maintenance. I had owned my 993 for 17 years.
Although I haven't had my 360 for long I can tell you I am not regretting the decision and I'm not looking back. I too only use the 360 as a weekend / special drive type car. But truthfully I enjoy it way more than the 993. It is considerably faster and the F1, while I had my reservations about it since having a 6 speed stick in the 993, is a blast to drive as I get more and more familiar with it. I now actually look forward to my next drive. I will say if you are used to a Porsche 6 speed, you may want to drive a 360 6 speed stick around some before a purchase. I thought I wanted a stick in my 360 until I drove one. The feel is very different from a 911 and it just felt too long a throw and the gated shifter feel is very different from the smooth and quick shifts I was used to in my 911. The 360 revs up much faster than the 993 and you have to get the gears considerably faster. I felt it would take some time for me to get accustom to it and frankly I didn't like it at all. And trust me, I was convinced I didn't want an F1. Now I can say I really like it and the shifts are so fast...incredible and fun.

I was also concerned with the maintenance on the 360 since the 993 was really trouble free and I had only minor issues through the years. But most here, as well as my research prior to my purchase, indicated that the 360 is a pretty reliable car. In fact, when I talked to a long time Porsche Repair Shop owner (friend) about changing "camps", he said the 360 was probably the only modern Ferrari he would agree would be a good choice as a replacement to my 993 (he has owned a few Ferraris in his time). I think it's just the fear of the unknown. If you are able to do your own work you probably will not regret it. It seems there's not a whole lot of major issues. Mostly I fear the electronics in the car. I always felt the 993 was on the precipice of too much tech for my tastes as it was-- despite never really having any issues.

The major selling point for me buying my car was a new clutch (mostly the same costs as one in a 3 pedal car you're considering) and that is the one thing that seems to be a major expense. Other than that as James Moran says, like any other car they have their issues. But I didn't see anything that was a deal breaker for me. The best advice I got was try to buy a car with moderate mileage. One that has not been driven much (under 10K miles) can be problematic due to it's sitting more than driving.

Hope this helps, good luck and enjoy the hunt for your 360.

 

You are doing the exact same thing that I did. For a lot of jobs, you will be pleasantly surprised how easy the car is to work on. The gated will save headaches and $$ down the road, but may have a higher up front cost. Since you are doing the work yourself, dont go looking for a low mileage investment quality unicorn, get one that has "high" miles that has been passed up by others and you will never have to worry about value from the distinguished buyer that only wants to see dealer receipts. Its exactly what I did and I think I may have gotten a historic deal, even after putting a ton of DIY work into it.

 

Manifolds are not a 360 issue, you probably meant cracked headers. Also not a problem, as there are a ton of them available from guys who installed Capristo headers. Engine out to replace the motor and transmission mounts at circa 25-35K miles is a good idea. A stick will cause less headaches. Just look at all the F1 transmission issues threads in this forum.

I just sold my '01 456M - a rara avis in Rosso Corsa with shields and a tan Daytona interior - to get a yellow, stick, sunroof 360. One of two yellow stick/sunroof 360's (22 total sunroof cars in the US, about half sticks). Manual 360's are probably as cheap as they are ever going to be. The time to buy is now.

 

That's not the issue or the solution. The concern is pre cat failure in the header, sending debris into the engine. If that happens, it is little consolation that you can buy another header from someone who was fortunate enough to remove theirs before this happens to them.

 

As far as the clutch wear: I keep my setting on "sport". My understanding is the clutch engages sooner with less slippage across the board. I think a lot of guys just floor it off the line and never really "feel" where the clutch engages. It took me a little time for me to read that feel but it does act just like a "real clutch". Once engaged, just go as normal. Hard to explain as I was kind of trying to wrap my head around it myself before I actually got my car. But I get it now. Driven correctly, guys here have said the clutch can last upwards of 50K miles.

Like your other breed of cars, the best thing you can do is find a good independent Ferrari Repair Shop. The Dealer will always exceed you expectations in regards to costs--- and not in a good way. Even doing my own work there are things I either don't want to do, don't have time to do, or in the case of having a "reader" to diagnose a problem, simply cannot do.

Do a search on F1 pump failures. I tend to think it's over exaggerated. I don't know that I've found a ton of reported problems when I was doing my research to buy my car. It kind of brings to mind the purported outright belt failures in the engines. Higher mileage cars will always start to wear out parts. No matter what make.

If you buy a fairly low mileage car and stretch it's legs regularly it will still take you some time to reach any higher mileage issues. At least that's the way I look at it.

I too was a little concerned with the cars I looked at that had 6+ owners. But two things here. A lot of F-car owners are different than other car owners. They tend to trade cars often. Yet with that said I agree that a car that was in one owner's possession for 10+ years probably indicates that the car was a keeper and it was perhaps more faithfully maintained both mechanically and cosmetically. I felt good being only the 3rd owner of my car (a 2003).

As to repair costs; I think I would be shocked at the costs to repair a new out of warranty Corvette. They are just as electronically advanced and certainly lots to go wrong as they get older too.

I just returned from a really nice day of driving my 360. It's a car that thrills me more than my 993 did. So for now I'm happy. Repair costs --- another day.

 

I've had my '03 360 for over 3 years. The clutch (original) was replaced at 17500 miles. Clutch wear depends a lot on one's driving style. 17-20k miles seems to be common while others have reported close to 30k IIRC. I've had no F1 issue to date but it may just be a matter of time (well, we will all have issues, F1 or not, in just a matter of time anyway as these cars are getting older). I have a new F1 pump and am considering pre-emptively replacing it for peace of mind when my major is done.

Btw, I may be the 4th or 5th owner of this car. I bought it with new clutch and brakes in 2014 and have had no breakdown except for the
Optima battery dying in 1.5 years.

 

Black 3 pedal coupe with sport seats.

http://www.intersportperformance.com/1999-Ferrari-360Modena/Used-Car/Mclean-VA/8963027/Details.aspx

I believe there's some room in the asking price. My friend owns the dealership, and I'd be happy to put you in contact directly with him.

 

Ball joints, bushings, tie rod ends to add to your list. Same for the F430 btw.

 

The age of the heat exchanger may be an issue. These cars are at the point where we are starting to see failures. When that happens, the coolant mixes with the gearbox fluid. If the car has documented annual or at least biannual coolant changes, there is less concern.


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Love the cf. however I don’t think those are original ferrari seats.


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I've been selling, not selling my car as others here know. But as far as the clutch goes mine has surprised me. My first major transmission expense was the result of a failed throwout bearing and gear position sensor (4K). Part of that 4K was doing all the F1 diagnostic stuff including ultimately replacing the F1 pump. Since my new pump works just like my old one I don't think the F1 pump was faulty at all which makes me wish I'd gone to a shop that knows what they're doing. I just had my car in for service at a shop that does and the clutch is showing 7% wear or 93% remaining. This is after 9300mi. Seems like pretty minimal wear to me. I do the neutral thing at stop lights sometimes and don't necessarily stay out of first gear as it's often a way of life here in So Cal. If you want to irked about a 360 system it should be emissions, it never works.

 

+1 on this. I think many cars get the clutch replaced early because the shop doesn't spend the time to correctly diagnose the problem, and instead decide to replace the most expensive part first. This happened to me, and my problem persists.

 

They are OEM seats

 

I’ve never seen them without the embossed Cavallino Rampante on the headrest. Did some come without or were they reupholstered?


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I have been pretty lucky so far in my Ferrari ownership. No big ticket repairs. I myself am a current porsche owner, OP may get a little sticker shock in a Ferrari repair bill.

Same type of owners, 2 different sphere ow ownership.

 

Rowan, check out my thread for a real world breakdown of a DIY'ers ownership cost...your experience will be different of course but it may give you a good parts cost baseline...

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/full-cost-of-ownership-1st-9-months-diyers-ferrari-360-gated-on-a-budget.561193/

 

First, we all do things by ourselves when we own these cars. You can maintain the 360 with some hand tools and spare time in the garage. But...
but... swapping out parts is the easy part. Any monkey can swap out parts. As you can see with your reading on this site and others, diagnosis is a gray area. And many mechanics have a difficult time with these cars even WITH the computers. TONS of people who get burned by mechanics who.. to put it honestly.. service Porsches and Mercedes and screw up the computerized 360.

You WILL need access to an SD2 or Leonardo. Suspension lights, and anything F1 will require you to plug it in and get a readout. I know, I know.. replace the brake switch if you're stranded and that will save you. Until it doesn't and it's a bad F1 sensor, etc. etc. And if you change the clutch you need it to set the PIS.

If you want less expense get a Gated.. but you're not guaranteed a good experience with these cars. Many owners who have bad, expensive, experiences. Go in with your eyes open and you wallet flush and it'll a great experience. IMHO the best experience is not having to care if something breaks. You can just enjoy it. Don't go in with a 2-3 year exit in mind. You'll never drive it and when you do you'll worry about it breaking all the time.

 

Seriously? Grabbing some tidbit you read and reiterating it is what makes urban legend. There were a few updates over the years but very few issues with any year of these cars.

 

Look for cars, inspect it, buy it and just dont worry about it too much.
All cars break. Even if you dont use it , it will break.

I just really dont worry about it. My reasoning is that If i cannot afford to fix it, Ill just keep it and wait for 20 more years, somebody will buy it as a garage find.
Seriously, its cheap enough that its cheaper than a BNEW Porsche or BMW M.

 

the pump is not that expensive, you can get one for around 500 dollars and 1 hour of labor, if you upgrade the relay to 50 amp you can have the original pump working basically trouble free, the actuator is more expensive to repair though.