We've had one related thread: http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=247157&highlight=fca+racing In this thread, the proposed FCA racing program was described in part as follows: "The contemplated series would be run under the FCA, with rules drafted similar to the Porsche club rules. Insurance would fall under the FCA. As for safety concerns, there will be licensing, tech, and very strict "no touching rules" which provide disqualification and probation for the first offence and a one year suspension for a second. The idea has been sprung by those who want to race in the Ferrari Challenge Series, but are not Billionaires, or willing to spend $500K a season. The idea is the creation of a challenge series with a more reasonable cost to enter and run. The Ferrari Trofeo would be very different from the Factory Challenge series run according to pro-racing rules which, at times, encourages touching. The reason that there is momentum behind a stand alone series, is for those who want to race in a ferrari spec. series, with equal cars (the contemplation is only for 348.355,360 and 430CH cars, not GTs or mods), and those who don't want to race with mustangs and corvettes that may cost far less to fix. Like the Factory Challange, the Ferrari Trofeo would run in conjunction with the social aspects or pre-existing Ferrari event. Its already been done at Sebring and it was an amazing event. The porsche club has been hosting club events successfully for 20 years. With this years retirement of the 430CH there is gaggle of non-current challenge cars. The momentum and will is there. With participation and pending FCA approval, this will happen." I think a club racing program could be extremely important to the US Ferrari community, and thought it deserved at least its own thread here in the Racing section. First of all, thank you, to the folks behind FCA racing. It's about time. I know it's a lot of work to get this going, and I'd imagine the pay isn't great. I like certain aspects of the proposed racing program - for example, the anti-touching rules. Without 13/13 or vintage style anti-contact rules, I don't think participation would be sufficient to have a successful series. Perhaps the goal is to keep things simple, and stage a conservative start for the program. As envisioned, Ferrari club racing seems to contemplate a single race group added to existing Ferrari track days/social events, rather than a free standing series. A Ferrari club race series, similar to PCA's Club Racing program, could have tremendous appeal to tracks, factory dealers, independent shops, other vendors, spectators, non racing owners, and so on. It could help move the focus of the US Ferrari community from the the fetishes of the concours to the track. To prosper, a club racing series needs critical mass, large car counts. I suggest the organizers of Ferrari Club racing consider a significant expansion of the eligibility rules: All Ferrari street cars with proper safety equipment should be permitted to race. Why not? I've seen track prepped 308s and Mondials and many other cars. Street 360s have dropped so much in price that conversion to race spec - in the warped perspective of the racer - could make sense. Why not give these folks a place to race? More cars means more entry fees, more club revenues, more leverage with tracks, etc. IMO, the more the merrier. Not everyone wants to run a 430 Challenge car, with its silly air jacks and ceramic rotors. Open up the fun to all qualifiedowners (an important caveat - open not to those who think they're qualified, a class comprising everyone who can drive, but only to those who can demonstrate their qualifications. Allow mods. I believe that many if not most of the 360 Challenge cars, and many of the 430 Challenge cars, already have been modified. When it's rebuild time, an owner doesn't ask his shop for less power. Easier to let owners fess up to mods than to try to scrutineer. Believe me when I tell you that the level of cheating will be sophisticated. Also, I'd argue from experience that a 360 Challenge car with the GT splitter and wing is a lot easier and safer to drive than the stock car. Perhaps the no mods rule is designed to control costs? You will not be able to control the amount spent on FCA racing. As soon as the series starts, the spending will go wild, that's just part of racing. Don't worry too much about car classification, at least at first - tell everyone you're just getting started, get everyone in and committed, and then let the rules evolve. Allow 360 and 430 GT cars I can see leaving out the 333SPs and the BBLMs, I guess, but the GTs seem to me to fit nicely into the program. This is a bit arbitrary, I know, but the show -and racing is entertainment, right? - will be better with the GTs. Whatever happens, again, my thanks again to everyone who is working on the racing proposal. Will
I looked at the Challenge just long enough to know it's not for me. There sure are a lot of drivers that may be interested. There sure are a lot of cars that aren't even eligible for the Challenge that could be tremendous fun. Cars like the 360 Challenge etc. And why not permit street racres in such a situation? I like it. An undercard would enhance the Challenge itself IMO. It could be accessible to more people and that would have to be good. PCA has a lot going on and it is great for them.
Will, I agree. But I would adopt NASA style rule with classing based on power to weight formula to attempt to equalize cars. This way a lightened 348 could run with 355's or that turbo 355 could run with 430's. There are so few ferraris that are actually racing or even doing time trialing or HPDE that strict rules or attempt to build a spec class would result in really small fields. I gave up racing Ferraris and moved to vettes just to have someone else to race. I'd race a ferrari again if there were more ferraris to race. In so cal it is rare to even see another ferrari on track even in an hpde.
I remember being at a PCA annual event at Sebring. There were at least two races (probably three) besides the Cup cars. In these other races there were multiple classes and even second fields. That was a lot of fun and I saw only one unsafe idiot who was on the brakes way too late in the hairpin and laid on the outside cars (three wide) to assist him in his attempt to pass about six cars in the turn.
+1,000! Great post. Hope it comes to fruition. Would like to see the GT emphasis. See no need for "classes," just "groups" like HMSA, VSCCA or General Racing does. Insurance could also be gotten through Parrish-Heacock under the VMC umbrella plan if the group operating it wanted to join VMC. A strong series steward (Dave Seibert comes to mind) could make the difference...
+2 But just how many would go to this level? I have modified many porsche and BMW cars for people to get into racing, but that took considerably less money for the initial donor car than would even the humblest of 308s. My 944 was traded for a few hours work, slowly acquired a few bits and pieces, spent big on a good seat, rollcage and belts. Over 3 years running on less than $4K! The undercard for a Challenge event sounds good, but I think the NASA aspect would be most favorable outside of FOC/FCA events. The numbers in BMW and Porsche have tended downward in recent years, although new tracks have helped, there is still a difficulty booking weekends at many tracks as well.
Actually ferrari racing can be very cheap but really all racing is very expensive even that 944. Look at what guys are doing in 944 spec for example and regardless of what you race; tires are still $1000-1700 per set unless running non-competative used rubber. Moton double adjustable shocks for a vette or a ferari are nearly the same cost as are many go fast goodies. Cost of a rollcage is the same regardless of car +/- a small amount of money. The cool thing about racing say a 348 is that the foglights you don't need can be sold for 700 bucks, mirrors, interior trim etc...all have significant value. 348's for example you can buy a set of R4 race brake pads for $175 yet my vette is over double that cost for the same pad ! Racing my old 1991 348 was cheaper than racing my 2004 Z06 I'm racing now and many people all over the country are racing those. Vette parts you don't need off the streetcar are nearly worthless compared to ferrari street parts. Anyway that's been my actual experience.
