355 exhaust pipes after 100 km trip: How do they have to look? | FerrariChat

355 exhaust pipes after 100 km trip: How do they have to look?

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by cinquevalvole, Apr 20, 2004.

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  1. cinquevalvole

    cinquevalvole Formula 3

    Feb 6, 2004
    1,158
    Germany, Bayern
    #1 cinquevalvole, Apr 20, 2004
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Hi experts,

    we were driving our F355 ('95 and '96) around 100 km and my pipes were looking grey/white inside. Dry, nice.
    My buddy's 355 ('96) pipes were much darker: brown/black under the same conditions/stint.
    Have a look at the little pics!
    So we have questions: What's healthier? Does dark means "too rich"?
    Or is the bright pipe image abnormal?
    What is usual on a 355 or other F-cars after longer turns? Can you post pics?
    Is there a difference between the 1995 and the 1996 model (motronic 2.7 vs 5.2) ?

    thanks for any ideas!

    cinquevalvole
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  2. murph7355

    murph7355 Formula 3

    Nov 30, 2002
    1,691
    SE England Yorkie
    Full Name:
    Andy
    They look like std exhausts. If they are, and if you both have cats, I'd guess that yours could well be on their way to the cat maker in the sky...

    I believe that a tell tale sign for cats that are breaking up is white powder in the exhaust.

    On the upside, fit a pair of "test pipes" instead of the cats and you'll save a bit of weight and probably improve the sound.

    Alt, you coud buy some more cats. But these won't be cheap.
     
  3. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 6, 2002
    79,143
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Bubba
    ANSA just sent me new info, they are making high performance cats now.

    I know, my Greenpeace membership is showing!
     
  4. FL 355

    FL 355 Formula 3

    Nov 3, 2002
    1,665
    Ft Laud
    Full Name:
    Frank Lipinski
    Agree - The red car is normal.

    Alan - Can you post more info on the cats? Do they have an inlet to insert the sensor for the ECU / price / etc etc.
     
  5. cinquevalvole

    cinquevalvole Formula 3

    Feb 6, 2004
    1,158
    Germany, Bayern
    Hi murph,

    thanks for the bad news :-(
    Both cars are on stock with cats but with always open throttle to the muffler.
    Good news: I could talk to the "cat maker in the sky", Mr. Fuchs, himself.
    He can open the old cats, remove the ceramic insert sh*t an put some 100 cell metal cats into. It looks original, has a better flow, no more ceramic problems, cleaner exhaust, comform with our laws + taxes.
    In my country "test pipes" are polluters & law-breakers. No way to go because the all 355 with public road registration are checked every 2 years at the TÜV + AU (clean exhaust cumbustion test).
    But what what will happen if I blow all the white dust out of them :)
    They will be empty soon ..... :)

    forza

    cinque
     
  6. murph7355

    murph7355 Formula 3

    Nov 30, 2002
    1,691
    SE England Yorkie
    Full Name:
    Andy
    I'd probably get someone to look at them sooner rather than later. I've seen some photos of big chunks of debris coming out of cats, which might not be too healthy.

    Hear what you're saying about the TUV in Germany. The MOT here's similar (though not as strict/thorough) but where there's a will...

    Funnily enough I'll be driving through Germany on Thursday on my way to the Imola GP. Staying in Baden Baden on Thursday night, then on to Liechtenstein (only because I've never been before), over Stelvio (only because I've always wanted to drive that no matter how bad a road it is) and into Italy.

    Good luck getting the cats replaced.

    Andy
    PS I've heard that the standard Ferrari cats don't restrict floww that much, so wouldn't expect you'll see too much by way of gains.
     
  7. cinquevalvole

    cinquevalvole Formula 3

    Feb 6, 2004
    1,158
    Germany, Bayern
    Hi murph,

    good luck on the Stelvio downhill! You'll need good breake fluid + pads :)
    BTW: Fuchs confirmed a good flow in the stock cats.
    So the 100 cell cats would rather improve reliability & sound but not performance. Maybe I can get a package price with a Fuchs muffler ... Hmmm
    Tend to 100 cell cats because you can't go to the TÜV with "test pipes" :)

    THX and have noisy fun on your Imola GP!

    cinque
     
  8. Ade

    Ade Formula 3

    Jan 31, 2004
    2,102
    UK
     
  9. cinquevalvole

    cinquevalvole Formula 3

    Feb 6, 2004
    1,158
    Germany, Bayern
     
  10. DIGMAN52

    DIGMAN52 F1 Rookie
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Jan 30, 2004
    3,999
    Dallas Texas
    Full Name:
    Philip C
    Put the ANSA Performance on 1995 355 Spider and like it better than the TUBI I took off. Less boomy, and great sound all around.
     
  11. cinquevalvole

    cinquevalvole Formula 3

    Feb 6, 2004
    1,158
    Germany, Bayern
    hello Fchatters,

    this week we put 100 cell metal cat inserts in my original shells.
    The welding work was done by Fuchs.
    He takes around around 1.450 € + 16 % taxes for both.
    The 100 cell metal cat allows better flow because it is less restricted then the stock ceramic cat.
    My 100 cell cats look original and reduce emissions again.

    On the scales in the shop we found a remarkable difference in weight.
    The left italo ceramic scrap had only 2.4 kilogramm!!!!!!
    The right cat had 3.2 kilogramm.
    At least 800 gramm turned to dust :-(
    The ceramic insert was only 5,5 cm long!!! Normaly the size is twice.

    This is poor engineering. Not engineering, just embarrassing.
    Th responsible man has to be roasted in hell.
    ----------------------------------------------------------

    My first impression after a few kilometers:
    The 355 is running great an feels slightly "lighter".
    Sound is sonor & clean and a little bit louder. No more dust on my ass.
    With ceramic cats the sound was more musty.

    THX for support to all of you!

    Time to be happy again with new metal cats.
    Let's see it as a contribute to clean breath air :)
    In my case "test pipes" don't increase the value of the car. Metal cats do so.

    forza

    cinquevalvole
     
  12. cinquevalvole

    cinquevalvole Formula 3

    Feb 6, 2004
    1,158
    Germany, Bayern
    #13 cinquevalvole, Sep 10, 2004
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  13. maranello71

    maranello71 Formula 3

    Jan 23, 2004
    1,221
    Chicagoland
    Full Name:
    Andre
    Hi Cinque,

    Very interesting story about your cats. Mine still look ok (no white crap on my exhaust - yet) but the idea of having low-restriction, lightweight cats on my car sound very appealing. I'll have a look at Fuchs.de and see what they have.

    Thanks for the info, always very informative and great pics!

    PS - I may be coming to Munich some weekend before the roads get too icy, probably after Oktoberfest. It'd be great to see you if you're around. I think I'd bring the F355 (unlimited Autobahn is always a very tempting idea) but I have to find out where to park it safely for the day. Any suggestions?
     
  14. senna21

    senna21 F1 Rookie

    Jul 2, 2004
    3,334
    Los Angeles, CA
    Full Name:
    Charles W
    As someone who lives in Los Angeles, California I know the effects of pollution all to well. I would like to applaud cinquevalvole for his efforts and think more people should follow his lead. It always bothers me to see Ferrari owners taking the easy route to HP by removing their cats. I for one have always loved Ferrari for their application of the latest technology to make their cars faster. I think if these same owners took a look at the marketplace for performance they'd find that these cats cinquevalvoe has put on his car would gain about the same HP gains as a Tubi exhaust and for less money! Not only that but I'll bet they do a much better job at cleaning up the exhaust than the stock ones. How Ferrari can get away without installing this type of cat as stock is beyond me. Too many people are still in that 1980s mindset that cats=poor performance. Technology has marched along and most people's minds haven't.

    If you're interested in knowing something about Cats and how they work check out this site:

    http://www.randomtechnology.com/technical.html

    It's a short quick read. They've also shown how a proper engineered cat can (in one application on an LT1) give better HP numbers than an open exhaust engine.
     
  15. cinquevalvole

    cinquevalvole Formula 3

    Feb 6, 2004
    1,158
    Germany, Bayern
    Hi maranello71,

    come to munich whenever you like. We will find a good parking lot for your
    primadonna :)

    @senna21: glad to see that removing the cats is not our cup of tea.
    I have no problem to drive without cats - with a 365 Daytona.
    No way for me to install "test pipes" and pollute breath air in order to get 5 hp more and save some €.
    The value of the car and your personal reputation will fall after those tricks.

    forza

    cinque
     

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