355 Challenge Cars - why not street legal? | FerrariChat

355 Challenge Cars - why not street legal?

Discussion in '348/355' started by f1karting, Jul 20, 2006.

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  1. f1karting

    f1karting Karting

    Jul 19, 2006
    235
    BC Canada
    Full Name:
    Jan H
    curious about the specification and also why the challenge cars are supposedly not streetable..
     
  2. Dr.T348

    Dr.T348 Formula 3

    Jan 8, 2004
    1,599
    Chicago NW Burbs
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    Richard T.
    Roll cage, racing harness, lexan windows, no side impact protection, no 5mph bumpers among other reasons. The earlier cars were converted street cars. Later years were factory build. Vern on this chat knows quite abit more about the 355 CH's. Do a search and there might be more info as I know this has been discussed before.

    Mostly because they were sold a race cars without titles. I have heard some people have gotten titles under kit car. It would be cheaper to modify a street 355 than to refit a 355 CH for the street.
     
  3. hardtop

    hardtop F1 World Champ

    Jan 31, 2002
    11,294
    Colorado
    Full Name:
    Dave
    1995's were sold with normal titles and then modified by dealers. After that, all were imported as race cars only and can't be titled for road use. Technically, none are legal to be on public roads with the mods.

    Dave
     
  4. Dr.T348

    Dr.T348 Formula 3

    Jan 8, 2004
    1,599
    Chicago NW Burbs
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    Richard T.
    I think it was not until '97 that 355 were actually factory built. In any case unlike the 348 factory challenge cars (most 348 CH's were converted older street cars), I don't think any of the dealer converted 355's were sold with a title. I read somewhere that they had Euro vin #'s as well.
     
  5. Llenroc

    Llenroc F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Jun 9, 2004
    5,488
    Colorado
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    Vern
    I'm not sure where to start, there are so many mods from road car to CH cars. Most of them are really not even noticable. I have a '97 factory car not a '95 converted car. My car has a NA serial no. ie;airbag classifacation in the 17 digit no. but had no air bags and "A" in the no. which is the NA classifacation(vs. B for Euro) the serial no. also has the digit for the 5.2 management system but has a 2.7 system. The major differences are: euro bumpers(no side marker lights) '95 engine management system (2.7 motronic) South African/ME upper exhaust(no cats) but has the lower cats no bypass valve, roll cage, race seats, fire system, no heater no A/C, huge twin oil coolers and fans, rear wing ('98 update) gearbox oil cooler in frt bumper, larger swaybars, different shocks, springs, wheels and brakes(stainless brake lines also) teflon/solid susp. bushings. NACA ducts in under body panels for brake cooling and modified cooling ducts around the brake discs. The plate on the drivers door pillar is removed and there is no emissions sticker on the engine compartment plate the plate is there just no sticker. Even the wiring harness is different, mine has ID tags that denote "Challenge car" and blank headlight buckets. My car has the NA door guard beams still in place and doesn't have Lexen windows challenge rules didn't allow those changes, guys may have changed to those in cars now if they weren't racing in the CH series. There a few other minor changes and I'm sure I've missed something here so if I think of other mods I will edit later. Regards, Vern
     
  6. Llenroc

    Llenroc F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Jun 9, 2004
    5,488
    Colorado
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    Vern
    To add to what Dave is saying. There were some factory '96 355CH cars but from what I can tell they were all Euro "B" serial nos. cars and not brought into the US at that time. There are a few here now, after the 360 took over they came up for sale and a few came over. I'm repeating what I have found out in my research, someone else might know more about the '96 story. From what I have found the US factory challenge cars are '97 and '98 cars starting with serial nos. 107... and thru 112.. cavillino quotes 109 CH cars built. On the road use thing "technically" would be the key word here depending on your particular state and its rules that they follow ie; anything is possible, who you know what you know?, kit car status? etc. Regards, Vern
     
  7. Dennis4077

    Dennis4077 Rookie

    Feb 6, 2006
    26
    Palo Alto, CA
    Hi Vern,
    My '97 F355CH also has no title, and so cannot be registered for the street. I am wondering if the factory put modified ECU chips in our cars? Without emissions controls or monitoring it seems they could have given us a bit more bhp with some software!
    Dennis
     
  8. greyboxer

    greyboxer F1 World Champ

    Dec 8, 2004
    12,664
    South East
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    Jimmie
    No handbrake
     
  9. Old Guy

    Old Guy Formula Junior
    Honorary

    Dec 1, 2003
    438
    No longer here
    Here we go again.

    No -- not any -- Ferrari Challenge car which was (a) either built by the factory for racing (e.g. racing seat, roll cage, etc. installed) or (b) which was converted by a dealer for the Challenge series by installing the kit, can ever be street legal. 355s fall both in a and b; 348s are all b. 360s and 430 Challenge cars were imported as race cars, without VINs.

    Ferrari DOT had extensive discussions in 1993 with both the DOT and EPA about the Ferrari Challenge series. DOT Regulations state that any car which complied with DOT Regs and was taken out of compliance (by fitting all the racing parts) cannot be brought back into compliance by removing these parts and refitting the originals. (The exact wording is a little hazy in my mind, as it's been quite a few years.)

    The original Challenge kit for the 348s included four stickers stating that the car could never again be registered for street use; these were to be placed on the car in four specific places. The original owner had to also sign an agreement to this effect.

    So, by DOT Regs no former Challenge car can ever be eligible for street use. Dealers who convert cars back do run a possible risk of action (penalty was $10K in one case).

    Realistically, a private owner who licenses and registers, if possible, or simply drives an old Challenge car on the street faces little real risk.

    But it isn't legal. This might have an effect on your insurance if you ever got caught up in a really involved situation.

    O.G.
     
  10. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    28,967
    socal
    With real CH cars is there any referrence to the sub factory which supposedly built them "gestione sportiva" or someplace like that. I thought Ferrari really did not do it but contracted someone like GM did for the old vette ZR1 motors with mercury marine. Anyone know about that group?
     
  11. Old Guy

    Old Guy Formula Junior
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    Dec 1, 2003
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    Gestione Sportiva is the Ferrari competition department (F1), as opposed to the customer competition department, Corse Clienti.
     
  12. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    28,967
    socal

    So I guess that means Corse Clienti makes the CH cars eventhough I heard that the 355CH was from Gestione Sportiva. I am sure the F1 guys would not be slumming with the 355's. There are some even rarer i.e. more expensive comp cars that can be customer purchased like the 550/575 that prodrive was running also from Corse Clienti?
     
  13. nerd

    nerd F1 Rookie

    Oct 12, 2003
    2,535
    Coronado, CA
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    RSK
    #13 nerd, Aug 5, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    A minor point, but 360 challenge cars do in fact have VINs.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  14. Dr.T348

    Dr.T348 Formula 3

    Jan 8, 2004
    1,599
    Chicago NW Burbs
    Full Name:
    Richard T.
    Does the B designate Euro model? I thought they had Euro vin's .
     

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