Countach, Style or Performance?

[miurasv]

In 1975 Motor magazine in the UK actually tested and compared the Countach LP400, Ferrari 365 GT4 Berlinetta Boxer and the 3.0 Litre Porsche Turbo. They didn't record the top speeds but the Countach was considered to be the fastest. From memory the 0-60 times were 5.6 Countach, 6.1 Porsche Turbo and 6.5 for the Boxer. Overall, it was either the Countach or the Boxer that was the fastest production car in the world at the time. These 2 cars were the ultimate expression of Style AND Performance. They were and still are absolutely stunning cars. Imagine what it was like seeing one back then. They were in a different league to anything else.

The Countach that the Porsche Turbo beat was a 5000S (4754cc) which was probably the slowest version having no more power than the 3929cc cars but more weight? The 5000 QV (5167cc) was faster than a Porsche Turbo.

Great pic of the LP500 Prototype, Joe. That was such a fantastic looking car. Lamborghini should make a copy of it.

[joe sackey]

Originally Posted by miurasv

In 1975 Motor magazine in the UK actually tested and compared the Countach LP400, Ferrari 365 GT4 Berlinetta Boxer and the 3.0 Litre Porsche Turbo. They didn't record the top speeds but the Countach was considered to be the fastest. From memory the 0-60 times were 5.6 Countach, 6.1 Porsche Turbo and 6.5 for the Boxer. Overall, it was either the Countach or the Boxer that was the fastest production car in the world at the time. These 2 cars were the ultimate expression of Style AND Performance. They were and still are absolutely stunning cars. Imagine what it was like seeing one back then. They were in a different league to anything else.

The Countach that the Porsche Turbo beat was a 5000S (4754cc) which was probably the slowest version having no more power than the 3929cc cars but more weight? The 5000 QV (5167cc) was faster than a Porsche Turbo.

Great pic of the LP500 Prototype, Joe. That was such a fantastic looking car. Lamborghini should make a copy of it.

You make some great points. However, the thing about Countachs tested is that their performance results have been inconsistent. At various points from LP400 to Annivesario there have been other production cars that have been faster both in terms of acceleration and top speed.

The only consistently undeniable quality where the Countach reigns supreme for all cars of that era is styling, avantgarde, stunning and dramatic as it is. That's my central point, and I think, that of the OP.

FWIW I think you'll find the LP500S has slightly more torque than the 4 litre cars, but the LP500S is essentially the same weight as the LP400S. Weight increased with the QV.

[Jamesark]

Originally Posted by miurasv

In 1975 Motor magazine in the UK actually tested and compared the Countach LP400, Ferrari 365 GT4 Berlinetta Boxer and the 3.0 Litre Porsche Turbo. They didn't record the top speeds but the Countach was considered to be the fastest. From memory the 0-60 times were 5.6 Countach, 6.1 Porsche Turbo and 6.5 for the Boxer. Overall, it was either the Countach or the Boxer that was the fastest production car in the world at the time. These 2 cars were the ultimate expression of Style AND Performance. They were and still are absolutely stunning cars. Imagine what it was like seeing one back then. They were in a different league to anything else.

The Countach that the Porsche Turbo beat was a 5000S (4754cc) which was probably the slowest version having no more power than the 3929cc cars but more weight? The 5000 QV (5167cc) was faster than a Porsche Turbo.

Great pic of the LP500 Prototype, Joe. That was such a fantastic looking car. Lamborghini should make a copy of it.

This takes me back to my youth - I remember the Guinness book of records at that time (mid 70's) had the LP400 and the 365BB as equal fastest production cars with a top speed of 186mph. I know this is all academic and nostalgia but (like Paul) I still like to occasionally stretch her legs and for me this is also an integral and enjoyable part of Countach ownership.

[deangpsx8]

My darling wife rang me at work 2 days ago.

"Hey honey I am pulled up next to a thing called a Gallardo..It says it's a Lamborghini"

Me
"That's right honey"

Wife
"Wow it looks like a mass produced sporty Toyota, the Countach looks so much better, it looks like what a Lamborghini should look like" Are these Gallardo's worth much?

Me
"Well the Countach is old school and its probably worth the same as a used Gallardo"


I think the words of a car novice such as my wife sum it up.

No disrespect to Gallardo owners...I love the Gallardo and have considered one as a daily drive.

[miurasv]

Originally Posted by joe sackey

You make some great points. However, the thing about Countachs tested is that their performance results have been inconsistent. At various points from LP400 to Annivesario there have been other production cars that have been faster both in terms of acceleration and top speed.

The only consistently undeniable quality where the Countach reigns supreme for all cars of that era is styling, avantgarde, stunning and dramatic as it is. That's my central point, and I think, that of the OP.

FWIW I think you'll find the LP500S has slightly more torque than the 4 litre cars, but the LP500S is essentially the same weight as the LP400S. Weight increased with the QV.

Until the 5000 QV was introduced the original production 375 BHP LP400 may have been the fastest Countach as the LP400S was heavier and I've read had 50 BHP less due to smog controls. Power was only about equalled by the 5000S but was heavier so must have been slower just as the bigger engined 5.0 Litre 512 Boxer (less power, more torque but heavier) was slower than the 4.4 365 Boxer.

I remember reading that the Porsche Turbo 3.3 beat the Countach and being disappointed but its top speed may have been hindered by having a rear wing if it had one? Again from memory, so I may be wrong, Motor said that the Countach was the fastest car they had ever tested at MIRA. There were pictures of very long skid marks when they launched the car. Does anyone have these Motor articles? They were published over 3 weeks for each car, the 365 Boxer (reg. KPD 622P), Countach LP400 (reg.?) and the 3.0 Porsche Turbo (reg. 2 GOO). Due to its practicality more than anything the Porsche was the winner.

I don't remember any cars being faster than these until the advent, at least 10 years later, of the more expensive Porsche 959 and Ferrari 288 GTO.

The Countach looked very fast and it was very fast as was the Ferrari Boxer.

[Jota 5084]

Originally Posted by deangpsx8

My darling wife rang me at work 2 days ago.

"Hey honey I am pulled up next to a thing called a Gallardo..It says it's a Lamborghini"

Me
"That's right honey"

Wife
"Wow it looks like a mass produced sporty Toyota, the Countach looks so much better, it looks like what a Lamborghini should look like" Are these Gallardo's worth much?

Me
"Well the Countach is old school and its probably worth the same as a used Gallardo"


I think the words of a car novice such as my wife sum it up.

No disrespect to Gallardo owners...I love the Gallardo and have considered one as a daily drive.

Lol!

[miurasv]

Here are pics of the front covers of the 1975 Motor Magazine Supertests of the Boxer 365, Countach LP400 (just look at it going) and Porsche Turbo 3.0 that are listed on Ebay. Does anyone have the Countach mag to scan the article and post?

[TurboFreak650]

Style is more important but let's not forget history. History after all, is a big part of what makes cars like the Ferrari 250 GTO so valuable. The Countach is a piece of history, a legend in its own time and etched into the memories of those who fantasized about them in their younger years. Down the line, I think Countach values will rebound above that of most Diablos more and more.

And there is the experience, which is what true car lovers live for. The Countach was a much rawer driving machine than its contemporaries, and the ultimate verison (the 5000QV) blew away most anything readily available in terms of being an exciting weekend diversion or a track mate. I've never heard anything more glorious than the 5.2L V-12 with six carbs!

I doubt hardly anyone capable of owning a Countach is concerned about winning a red light grand prix against a Mustang. If you want to do that, find an '86 Mustang and compare them with context.

Modern exotic cars, however, would look very foolish if they couldn't compete with off the rack blue collar warriors. There has been a huge trend of making Ferraris and Lambos track ready from the factory since the '90s, which is a good thing. This was inspired by the increasing popularity of track days in the general population, but also by increasing F1 success for Ferrari and Audi's involvement with Lambo.

[ralfabco]

Yes, you have to avoid the latest hot hatch and entry level V-8 Mustang.




When driving the car, I enjoy the handling and satisfaction from the firm suspension. The steering feels real good. You have to drive the car.

It all makes sense, at fun speeds.

[geno berns]

Wasn't the Porsche Turbo a 5 sec flat car right out of the box? Or was it the later 3.3 versions? If yes, than it would be the fastest out of the three I believe...

Geno

Originally Posted by miurasv

Here are pics of the front covers of the 1975 Motor Magazine Supertests of the Boxer 365, Countach LP400 (just look at it going) and Porsche Turbo 3.0 that are listed on Ebay. Does anyone have the Countach mag to scan the article and post?

[geno berns]

I think it's time to put the two to a test. The 365 BB feels light and revy with less torque than the QV (wish I had a 4 liter car to compare). Andrew M and I will do a run down LSD in the next few weeks to find out. Will get back with the results...

Geno

[amenasce]

Originally Posted by geno berns

I think it's time to put the two to a test. The 365 BB feels light and revy with less torque than the QV (wish I had a 4 liter car to compare). Andrew M and I will do a run down LSD in the next few weeks to find out. Will get back with the results...

Geno

You have my number, im available Monday to Sunday

[dmaxx3500]

just remember in 72-73 what every other car on the road looked like,a countach looked like it was from outer space,

[joe sackey]

Originally Posted by miurasv

I don't remember any cars being faster than these until the advent, at least 10 years later, of the more expensive Porsche 959 and Ferrari 288 GTO.

The Testarossa was consistently faster at top speed than most QVs tested (Martini's special car excepted).

[miurasv]

Originally Posted by joe sackey

The Testarossa was consistently faster at top speed than most QVs tested (Martini's special car excepted).

Yes, you're right, Joe but even the Testarossa was 10 years later and it's even been said that the 365 Boxer was faster than that though may not on top speed. From memory I think the Testarossa was tested by either Autocar or Motor at 181 mph? What the performance figures of the day didn't convey was how fast the Boxer was over 100 mph. Its engine was fantastic being so refined and flexible as I'm sure the Testarossa's was as well being a development of it with 4 valve heads. Car magazine said the Boxer had the best engine in the world.

[miurasv]

Originally Posted by geno berns

I think it's time to put the two to a test. The 365 BB feels light and revy with less torque than the QV (wish I had a 4 liter car to compare). Andrew M and I will do a run down LSD in the next few weeks to find out. Will get back with the results...

Geno

That Boxer is absolutely beautiful. The Countach QV has 455 BHP (420 BHP US Spec?) as opposed to a genuine 360 BHP of the 365 Boxer (380 claimed). 12 years progress and an extra 0.8 litre bigger engine with 4 valve heads.

[EMILIO]

countach was faster than a boxer on a lap time
and by a good margin

on the straights they were closer (400, 400S Vs BB), the DD is faster than any BB

[P300V8]

Originally Posted by rovingtravler

The engine note and the feeling from driving many of these older cars is so much more exciting than many of the newer cars. It is not just about top speed, but about the experience of the ride in total.

These cars were at the cutting edge of technology in their day but the Countach had only two valves per cylinder and 70 profile XWX tyres on 15" rims when introduced. On these two counts alone any comparison with modern cars is completely redundant. Enjoy them for what they are and do not expect them to incorporate future performance technology!

[Jamesark]

Originally Posted by EMILIO

countach was faster than a boxer on a lap time
and by a good margin

on the straights they were closer (400, 400S Vs BB), the DD is faster than any BB

Emilio, you are spot on - the Boxer is my favorite Ferrari but not good when pushed hard around corners.

[miurasv]

Originally Posted by P300V8

These cars were at the cutting edge of technology in their day but the Countach had only two valves per cylinder and 70 profile XWX tyres on 15" rims when introduced. On these two counts alone any comparison with modern cars is completely redundant. Enjoy them for what they are and do not expect them to incorporate future performance technology!

The wheels on the LP 400 were actually 14" in diameter.